Flames fire Geoff Ward, hire Darryl Sutter, signs 3 year deal

[NewFan]

Another thing is it's very easy shut down Monahan's line. Because if you take care Johnny, there is no other danger. But when Lindholm with them it makes more difficult to protect as Lindholm can shoot, pass and also he is smart.

[powderjunkie]

I think we need our best player(s) to not need such specific circumstances to be successful.

[NewFan]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I think we need our best player(s) to not need such specific circumstances to be successful.

That is what our best players who are. You can't change them. Johnny can't become big or Monahan can't play like other star 1st line Cs. So do you want them help to play eith their game or try to force them to play game that they fail?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by NewFan

That is what our best players who are. You can't change them. Johnny can't become big or Monahan can't play like other star 1st line Cs. So do you want them help to play eith their game or try to force them to play game that they fail?

You can’t change their bodies, but you can change the players.

And you can change the way those guys play the game somewhat - Yzerman, Thornton to a degree, Kane worked on his defence, Modano did as well, to great success.

[Inglewood Jack]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

You can’t change their bodies, but you can change the players.

And you can change the way those guys play the game somewhat - Yzerman, Thornton to a degree, Kane worked on his defence, Modano did as well, to great success.

err Yzerman, Thornton, Kane and Modano are all like in the top 40 players in NHL history. I don't think that's what we're working with on the Flames roster, but would love to be surprised.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Inglewood Jack

err Yzerman, Thornton, Kane and Modano are all like in the top 40 players in NHL history. I don't think that's what we're working with on the Flames roster, but would love to be surprised.

You missed my point. Players can work on, and change their game. Those are high profile examples. You can also look at half the big scorers who are drafted out of junior and then adapt their game to make the NHL. Say, Stephane Yelle, Mike Peca, etc.

[Inglewood Jack]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

You missed my point. Players can work on, and change their game. Those are high profile examples. You can also look at half the big scorers who are drafted out of junior and then adapt their game to make the NHL. Say, Stephane Yelle, Mike Peca, etc.

Yzerman, Thornton, Kane and Modano had Art Ross level offensive capability from early in their careers; the addition of a defensive element might have dragged their scoring ceiling down a bit but they were still PPG or better even after. Yelle and Peca never had anything close to first line level offence at any point in the NHL, so 2 way play was the only way they could provide value.

You need examples of guys who had PPG ceilings in their early 20s by playing zero defence, that transformed later into maybe 50-60ish point 2 way players. That transformation is only realistic for Monahan due to his frame, Johnny will never be that guy so it’s up to his linemates to provide that dimension.

[Kasi]

There is two parts of this Sutter thing to me.

1. Getting players to give better efforts
2. Getting players to commit to the style he wants them to play.

While I believe he can do number one better than any recent coach we’ve had I’m not sure he has the horses to do number 2. The teams forwards are not suited to that style of game he’s asking them to play. I just don’t think they can forecheck hard enough to do what he wants them to do and some of the players would do better with a more free wheeling style. Something has to give and I don’t think we’re going to get good trade value out of players playing styles they’re not good at. If you sell for pennies on the dollar we might have a good working trap style team but we won’t have any offence and I’m not sure that works in today’s league.

We all said this is the season that we find out which players want to play and I think we will, but the caveat is it’s a combination of gaf as well as players suitability to playing like this. Aka you’re never going to turn Gaudreau into a solid checker and trying to do so will not help his trade value.