2015/2016 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[kehatch]

I think people have short memories. A year ago many were hoping Wideman was going to be bought out. He was great last season sure, but he has been on again off again from season to season his entire career.

Beyond that, he had two seasons left under contract. It is unlikely the Flames can extend him based on his age, cost, and the cap situation we will soon be in. Selling high on Wideman makes some sense even without signing Franson.

Now enter Franson. He has a great opportunity in Calgary since be will be on the second pairing with a very good D partner. Calgary is a young and up and coming team that is already doing things in the playoffs. Plus, it's August and he hasn't been signed.

I think he is an underrated player coping with some negative hype from the Toronto machine. There is potentially an opportunity to sign Franson to a value contract. Short term or multi year.

[GoJetsGo]

Franson is below average in his own end. He has Phaneuf syndrom in that he is often standing flat-footed poking with his stick, making bad reads taking himself out of the play, and over-commits chasing after guys with no plan.

He is above average in the offensive zone, has a good outlet pass and is a good skater.

Those are all things we have in spades.

The area of the game he lacks in makes him a bad fit for us right now if it means losing Wideman or Russell to fit him in.

If we could take him and lose Smid or Englland, I could see it, but those guys will be difficult to move and I like their grit.

Just doesn't seem to make a lot of sense for us.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Cheerio

Explain please, without saying points or ice time.

Franson is a damn good dman

Franson is better defensively, but Wideman is better at putting up, ummm... points. Sorry, this is the real world, and that matters. Franson is good, but he'll be more expensive than Wideman in two years as Wideman will be gone. Franson isn't taking a discount or a one year contract, so he's not worth our time.

[Cheerio]

Originally Posted by mikephoen

Why? Are points and minutes played not important any more? Did advanced stats in baseball make RBIs and Runs scored stop mattering?

And Franson was hot garbage in Nashville after the trade. Maybe you can explain why he was still 'damn good' despite being a healthy scratch.

No, but TOI is largely a result of coaches decisions. If a coach loves a guy he'll get more ice regardless of how bad he sucks. If a coach hates a guy he'll bench him or give him no ice until he's gone. Points are great to have, but they're only one aspect of the game. Dennis Wideman had 56 points last season, but he's a career low 40s point guy save last season and 2008/09. He is a great defensive defenceman but leaves a lot to be desired in the d zone. Franson is a damn good defenceman because of his good play in both ends. Is he Zdeno Chara in the d zone? Of course not, but he isn't a liability out there like some people seem to suggest.

Dennis Wideman is a better offensive player, and Cody Franson is a better defensive player. The difference between the two is not enough to say that Dennis Wideman is a much better player.

[Phanuthier]

Franson is a No 4-5 d-man... he can fill in on the top 4 sometimes, but would get exposed easily there. He's really better on the bottom pairing. Seems like a good teammate though.

Wideman is a No 2-3 d-man.... played on the 2nd pairing, but as we saw can play the top pairing and didn't look out of place. I don't care that he wasn't very good a year ago, Gaudreau was a borderline NHL player but I don't consider him a NHL tweener anymore either.

Pretty obvious who is better

[Cheerio]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Franson is better defensively, but Wideman is better at putting up, ummm... points. Sorry, this is the real world, and that matters. Franson is good, but he'll be more expensive than Wideman in two years as Wideman will be gone. Franson isn't taking a discount or a one year contract, so he's not worth our time.

Yeah between Hamilton, Giordano and Brodie I think we're fine for offence coming from the blue line and PP guys. Franson fills a need moreso than Wideman does given our current situation. Is Franson affordable for this Flames teams given what he should demand on the open market? No. But as we've seen this July, the market is much softer than expected due to the cap, I think he could be wise to sign a 1 or 2 year "Show me" deal in a good situation and then cash in when the cap goes up as a result of the $1 billion in expansion revenue.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Cheerio

Yeah between Hamilton, Giordano and Brodie I think we're fine for offence coming from the blue line and PP guys. Franson fills a need moreso than Wideman does given our current situation. Is Franson affordable for this Flames teams given what he should demand on the open market? No. But as we've seen this July, the market is much softer than expected due to the cap, I think he could be wise to sign a 1 or 2 year "Show me" deal in a good situation and then cash in when the cap goes up as a result of the $1 billion in expansion revenue.

I don't really disagree with what you're saying for the most part, but where are the flames last year without Wideman? Maybe bit even in the playoffs.

Franson is a bit better defensively, but you aren't getting him on a show me deal for 2 years. I don't think so anyways.

I'm all for selling Wideman before his stock drops, but careful as Franson won't replace his offense nor will Brodie.

[Cheerio]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

I don't really disagree with what you're saying for the most part, but where are the flames last year without Wideman? Maybe bit even in the playoffs.

Franson is a bit better defensively, but you aren't getting him on a show me deal for 2 years. I don't think so anyways.

I'm all for selling Wideman before his stock drops, but careful as Franson won't replace his offense nor will Brodie.

Flames are likely not even close to sniffing the playoffs last season if Dennis Wideman didn't play for them. When Gio went down it would have given them a top 6 of Brodie, Russell, Schlemko, Engelland, Potter, and Wotherspoon, which wouldn't have gotten them into the playoffs let alone into the second round. However, if you replace Wideman with Franson you likely end up in the same place as a result of Franson's defence making up for his lack of offence (compared to Wideman).

In terms of his contract it's unlikely, but look at Brad Richards and Christian Ehrhoff's deals from last summer. It worked out for Richards, not so well for Ehrhoff.

I agree with that sentiment, but I don't think you can pencil Wideman in for 55 points again either. If the difference is Franson with 35 points or Wideman with 45 for the same price, I'm hoping that Hamilton and Brodie can make up the point difference.

[Hugh Jahrmes]

If return on Wideman was substantial, and it was a move he wanted to make I say do it. Should we be pressuring him into a move? No. I feel his presence/leadership on the team is a tad underrated here, and as been pointed out, his performance when it counted was absolutely impressive. If someone offered a package that blew the JBo deal away? Sure.

My biggest fear through our success and new moves is that either Russel or Wideman are moved for subpar pieces in an attempt to bring in long term pieces.

If I had to choose between Wideman and Franson I take Wideman.. If it were Franson, a first+intriguing prospect, that makes things interesting.

One advantage to moving either DW or KR is that could provide a way of exacting more value in a package including one of the goalies we decide to move. Signing Franson (if his salary demands even come close to fitting what we have available) and picking up another potential young raw top 3D, blue chip tender or some nice picks would be good frkm an asset management standpoint.

Whatever happens I trust BT, I can't remember a time I was this excited about the -long term- success of this team.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Cheerio

Flames are likely not even close to sniffing the playoffs last season if Dennis Wideman didn't play for them. When Gio went down it would have given them a top 6 of Brodie, Russell, Schlemko, Engelland, Potter, and Wotherspoon, which wouldn't have gotten them into the playoffs let alone into the second round. However, if you replace Wideman with Franson you likely end up in the same place as a result of Franson's defence making up for his lack of offence (compared to Wideman).

Maybe, but I don't think so. Maybe Wideman played above expectations, but remember he was given the 1/2 role (#1 maybe even). I'm not sure Franson could've done it.

[Quote]
In terms of his contract it's unlikely, but look at Brad Richards and Christian Ehrhoff's deals from last summer. It worked out for Richards, not so well for Ehrhoff.
[/qoute]

Both of those players had just been bought out. Of course they took low money short term

I agree with that sentiment, but I don't think you can pencil Wideman in for 55 points again either. If the difference is Franson with 35 points or Wideman with 45 for the same price, I'm hoping that Hamilton and Brodie can make up the point difference.

The difference being Wideman is off the books on two years, Franson won't be. The flames can't afford to play their 4th defenseman $4-5M with Bennett, Gaudreau, Monahan, etc up front

[Hugh Jahrmes]

Hate to say it but if we want this defensive juggernaut roster, Stajan likely has to be replaced by a guy like Arnold, Jankowski or Granlund sooner than later

[Calgary4LIfe]

Count me on the side that would be very disappointed if Calgary signs Franson and trades Wideman.

Wideman really stepped up when Giordano went down and did great playing those tough minutes. Does anyone think that Franson could do it? Franson was a healthy scratch in Nashville. It really reeks of Toronto's over-glorification of mediocre players.

Wideman had more points, played much tougher minutes, more goals, and wears an A on his jersey. I can understand asset management, and how sometimes there are simply very good players becoming casualties. However, in no way can I see Calgary signing Franson on the cheap and for a short-term contract and jettisoning Wideman because of it. Franson turned down big money already (though I am sure he is regretting it already) and I doubt he wants a short term contract. Would rather keep a guy who has done VERY WELL (and remember, the season before last he did well too until his injury when he stepped up in another Giordano injury and for a while was the NHL league leader in TOI).

I am confident Wideman will still be a strong contributor until the end of his contract, and by then, I hope that a few of the kids are starting to put the squeeze on him (Wotherspoon, Morrison, Culkin, Kulak, etc).

Wideman may not be perfect, but he is a much better player right now than Franson, and only has a couple of years left on his contract. Would be a huge mistake (IMO) to trade him and think that Franson (who wouldn't come much cheaper, and who would want a lengthy contract) could replace him. Sure, if Franson will sign a very short term (2 years or less) and be a cheaper cap hit (and seeing how he is not signed yet, maybe - but apparently he was supposed to sign in Boston) then I would try him out. I just don't see a player that is anywhere close to replacing Wideman in any way.

[AltaGuy]

I think it's pretty much always good asset management to sign a UFA to replace a comparable player on contract who can be traded for futures. I'm not sure what we could trade Wideman for, but if it's even something like a couple seconds, it's great from an asset perspective for our #5 DMan. Then we can do it again with Franson a few years down the line if we want/have to and another UFA becomes available.

[Badgers Nose]

I'm not sure why everyone sees this as an either/or situation.

If Flames get Franson, I doubt Wideman is going anywhere right away. I am assuming he would waive if pressured.

The log jam is in the forward ranks, and guys like Raymond and Bollig need to move to make room for way cheaper alternatives. That happens after camp.

That makes the room Flames need.

They can juggle contracts until then, right?

The d-kids are probably 2-3 years away from being legit NHLers. At that time Eng and Wideman are gone.

[hockey.modern]

Cody Franson to BUF?

@BNHarrington: #Sabres could use another veteran D. Have two sources saying they're trying to land FA Cody Franson by offering two-year deal.

[Knut]

Need more of this thread. I like it.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by hockey.modern

Cody Franson to BUF?

@BNHarrington: #Sabres could use another veteran D. Have two sources saying they're trying to land FA Cody Franson by offering two-year deal.

Seems like an odd choice given that the Sabres are basically set at RHD with Ristolainen and Bogosian ahead of him and Pysyk needing to play. If I was Franson I'd be looking for the best situation to pump my value at this point, whether it be a 1 or 2 year deal.

[Poe969]

I know it's only ektard but he's saying that Franson has it narrowed down to 4 teams; B's BJ's sabres and oilers. I'd love to see him sign with the oilers as he'd probably be leaned on as one of their "leaders" and make them even worse. Franson hasn't shown he's anything more than a 4-6 guy. That being said, I wouldn't mind him as our 6 guy...just not our 1-2 guy.

[Jacks]

Kopitar, Kings 'not even in the ballpark' on agreeing on contract extension
http://slam.canoe.com/Slam/Hockey/NH.../22547259.html

Can't imagine the Kings would want to lose Kopitar but they have 22M next offseason to fill 9 holes including Kopitar and Lucic.
http://www.capfriendly.com/?p=team-c...ngeles%20Kings
Something has to give there. That's also not counting Voynov's 4.1M salary. If they lose the Richards appeal it looks even worse for them. You gotta think Kopitar will want at least 8M, probably 9M on a long term deal. Lucic will probably want at least 4M, probably more.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Kopitar, Kings 'not even in the ballpark' on agreeing on contract extension
http://slam.canoe.com/Slam/Hockey/NH.../22547259.html

Can't imagine the Kings would want to lose Kopitar but they have 22M next offseason to fill 9 holes including Kopitar and Lucic.
http://www.capfriendly.com/?p=team-c...ngeles%20Kings
Something has to give there. That's also not counting Voynov's 4.1M salary. If they lose the Richards appeal it looks even worse for them. You gotta think Kopitar will want at least 8M, probably 9M on a long term deal. Lucic will probably want at least 4M, probably more.

Good. I hope the Kings become basement dwellers.