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Old 08-09-2024, 12:27 PM   #1601
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ATR 72 crash in Brazil near São Paulo. Video is on social media showing it in a flat spin before impact.
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Old 08-09-2024, 12:31 PM   #1602
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Old 08-09-2024, 01:05 PM   #1603
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RIP.

That's just awful to see. What would make it stall out like that?

Last edited by Ironhorse; 08-09-2024 at 01:10 PM.
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Old 08-09-2024, 01:10 PM   #1604
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62 on board, doesn't look like there's any survivors.
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Old 08-09-2024, 02:59 PM   #1605
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RIP.

That's just awful to see. What would make it stall out like that?
Well the ATR 72 has had a few issues over the last few years of pilots turning off/feathering the wrong engine if there is an engine failure.
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Old 08-09-2024, 03:06 PM   #1606
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Well the ATR 72 has had a few issues over the last few years of pilots turning off/feathering the wrong engine if there is an engine failure.
Could also be an icing on the wings issue from what I've read. A known issue on that airframe.
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Old 08-09-2024, 03:22 PM   #1607
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Remember when air travel was considered safe beyond reproach?

These events are still quite rare but seeing so many of them happen because of design flaws and maintenance lapses just reinforces my opinion that flying should not be a budget-minded activity. Like most things greed is also a factor. Safety should never take a back seat to profit.
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Old 08-09-2024, 05:17 PM   #1608
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Remember when air travel was considered safe beyond reproach?

These events are still quite rare but seeing so many of them happen because of design flaws and maintenance lapses just reinforces my opinion that flying should not be a budget-minded activity. Like most things greed is also a factor. Safety should never take a back seat to profit.
We don't know what happened yet so a little to jump to conclusions. Given how many more hours we fly now than in the past I would hazard a guess flying is safer now than it ever has been.
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Old 08-09-2024, 10:39 PM   #1609
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Remember when air travel was considered safe beyond reproach?

These events are still quite rare but seeing so many of them happen because of design flaws and maintenance lapses just reinforces my opinion that flying should not be a budget-minded activity. Like most things greed is also a factor. Safety should never take a back seat to profit.
What do you mean "remember when"? What are the stats for commercial airline deaths? I'd imagine they continually get fewer and fewer through the years? I'd imagine you're just seeing an uptick in phone cameras and social media rather than less safe air travel. I'd be willing to bet we are currently living in the safest era for air travel and it will continue to get safer with each passing year.

If you're throwing out a term like "safe beyond reproach" that would probably be your own invention and likely conflated with being insanely safe, statistically.

Last edited by jayswin; 08-09-2024 at 10:41 PM.
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Old 08-10-2024, 08:57 AM   #1610
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Up until the 2000s you'd have thousands of deaths in aviation per year. Nowadays it's just a few hundred.
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Old 08-10-2024, 09:14 AM   #1611
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What do you mean "remember when"? What are the stats for commercial airline deaths? I'd imagine they continually get fewer and fewer through the years? I'd imagine you're just seeing an uptick in phone cameras and social media rather than less safe air travel. I'd be willing to bet we are currently living in the safest era for air travel and it will continue to get safer with each passing year.

If you're throwing out a term like "safe beyond reproach" that would probably be your own invention and likely conflated with being insanely safe, statistically.
Like how no one lets their kids walk to school or the playground until they have a GPS tracking device or a smart phone even though it's WAY safer than when we were all doing it.

Although in that case, being a pedestrian is one of those things that is sadly getting more dangerous. I'll save my rant on high hood/belt lines for the auto thread.
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Old 08-10-2024, 04:03 PM   #1612
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Yes, air travel is very safe. It just seems accidents lately have been due to cost-cutting measures. But I'm probably wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.
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Old 08-11-2024, 10:38 PM   #1613
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Hawaii Martin Mars final flight from earlier tonight
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Old 08-11-2024, 10:54 PM   #1614
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Hawaii Martin Mars final flight from earlier tonight
Was quite the show, we are on the east coast of the island tonight on the water just south of Ladysmith. We got 4 passes at pretty much tree top height and not far off. For about 15 minutes we could see it roaming around the gulf islands killing time for the snowbirds to make their way over. Even the teenagers were interested. The snowbirds joined up just south of us, another mile north and we’d have seen the meet up but even without that I’m pretty happy we saw it.

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Old 08-15-2024, 12:05 PM   #1615
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Some insight into WestJet's challenge to get their fleet back in service after the hail storm.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yA366T5IC5U
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Old 08-16-2024, 12:59 AM   #1616
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Old 08-16-2024, 02:09 AM   #1617
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Could also be an icing on the wings issue from what I've read. A known issue on that airframe.
I don't trust any prop driven aircraft where the fuselage is both longer and wider than the wings, without it's massive flaps per wing area it wouldn't come close to getting off the ground, put a little ice over it's wings it has the aerodynamics of a 25,000lb rock.
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Old 08-16-2024, 06:32 AM   #1618
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This doesn't really concern anyone here but I need to vent somewhere.

YQY is getting a new airline and route to be announced next week.

Without knowing what's going on but looking at the press release and thinking through logically what's happening in the industry, it's likely Porter to YHZ.

That said, not one but two board members that I know refuse to confirm. "Signed a non-disclsoure agreement so I can't say anything"

I don't want you to say anything to me, I want you to type it! Damn it!

Won't even be koy about it.

I mean, they're 100% acting appropriately, but I want to know now!
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Old 08-16-2024, 06:44 AM   #1619
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I just flew Porter, they were great. Cheaper than WJ, too. So hope it's them for ya.
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Old 08-16-2024, 02:05 PM   #1620
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Plane crashed short of the runway at YYC. Stuck it in the golf course.

No injuries, both people walked away
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