Terrorist to hit around election!!!

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by BillW+Oct 25 2004, 12:45 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BillW @ Oct 25 2004, 12:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-RougeUnderoos@Oct 24 2004, 10:42 PM
Billy said:

The simple fact that more people are arrested after they commit a crime than before they have committed a crime is proof, and why crimes of passion are so difficult to prevent.

Laugh. Yeah, you really got me there. You ever see that movie "Minority Report" with Tom Cruise? Check it out. I know it'd be right up your alley because the last time I recommended it to a 70-year-old fighter pilot/Secret Service Agent/FAA Chief confidant from Florida, he really liked it.

Actually that movie terrified me, because it reminded me of how we have attempted to mold hate crime legislation. It’s pretty scary to think that a misdemeanor crime could be escalated to a serious felony on the grounds that someone claims to know exactly what the criminal’s motivation and thinking before the crime was. [/b][/quote]
Really now, should a man of your age and position be broadcasting political opinion, movie reviews and sensitive presidential security protocols to a bunch of Canadian hockey fans at 3am on a Monday morning? I think not.

The freedom of the western world is at hand here, Bill, so you should tread lightly. I've no idea which website our mutual friend "sjwalter" recruited you from to no doubt "kick our liberal asses" but I'm sure the locals there would counsel you to keep your national secrets quite secret.

[Five-hole]

Originally posted by BillW@Oct 24 2004, 11:33 PM
I hate to see so many freedom loving people fight among themselves about details when they first must admit that they have a common enemy that would love to destroy what we cherish.

The thing you don't seem to realize is that you uphold your freedoms in a very different way than I would, were I President. I wouldn't use freedom as a justification for war when it clearly wasn't the original intent -- that's hypocritical at best and in my opinion despicable. My version of freedom isn't "you can be free if it helps us make money". Nobody's talking about bringing freedom to many of the other repressed countries of the world, why is that? Obviously universal freedom isn't the goal here.

I have a freedom to oppose my government. I have a freedom to question the wisdom and the sanity of their wars. I have a freedom to question my country's foreign policy and why we have these enemies in the first place. I have a freedom to think that defense is a better defense than offense. I have the freedom to think it's not our freedom that they hate, but our willy-nilly swashbuckling supposedly in the name of it -- and when it seems almost overtly clear to a biased outsider that said swashbuckling is purely in the name of American economic interests.

Why do you never stop to think about what you're destroying when you go on these freedom missions from God?

Yes, yes, what a bleeding heart liberal I am.

[BillW]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos+Oct 25 2004, 12:08 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RougeUnderoos @ Oct 25 2004, 12:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Actually that movie terrified me, because it reminded me of how we have attempted to mold hate crime legislation. It’s pretty scary to think that a misdemeanor crime could be escalated to a serious felony on the grounds that someone claims to know exactly what the criminal’s motivation and thinking before the crime was.

Really now, should a man of your age and position be broadcasting political opinion, movie reviews and sensitive presidential security protocols to a bunch of Canadian hockey fans at 3am on a Monday morning? I think not.

The freedom of the western world is at hand here, Bill, so you should tread lightly. I've no idea which website our mutual friend "sjwalter" recruited you from to no doubt "kick our liberal asses" but I'm sure the locals there would counsel you to keep your national secrets quite secret. [/b][/quote]
I’ve had a great time here and I do hope to come back and see if you take your hockey as serious as your politics. I have much more up my sleeve than what we’ve discussed here, but it falls far short of what I wish Tom Clancy might offer us. Actually right now I’m thinking more about how tired I’ll be when I sneak off in the morning to ride up to Daytona and check out the hot young ladies at Biketoberfest in Daytona and hope I don’t get rained on along the way. :P

The only butts I care to kick are those that use force and violence to enforce totalitarian regimes on the people of the world. No person on this planet in any country can consider themselves truly free until all of the people on earth enjoy individual freedom and liberty. Equality of opportunity is much more important to the people of the world than equality of results – once people are truly free they can make their own results.

[BillW]

Originally posted by Five-hole+Oct 25 2004, 12:15 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Five-hole @ Oct 25 2004, 12:15 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-BillW@Oct 24 2004, 11:33 PM
I hate to see so many freedom loving people fight among themselves about details when they first must admit that they have a common enemy that would love to destroy what we cherish.

The thing you don't seem to realize is that you uphold your freedoms in a very different way than I would, were I President. I wouldn't use freedom as a justification for war when it clearly wasn't the original intent -- that's hypocritical at best and in my opinion despicable. My version of freedom isn't "you can be free if it helps us make money". Nobody's talking about bringing freedom to many of the other repressed countries of the world, why is that? Obviously universal freedom isn't the goal here.

I have a freedom to oppose my government. I have a freedom to question the wisdom and the sanity of their wars. I have a freedom to question my country's foreign policy and why we have these enemies in the first place. I have a freedom to think that defense is a better defense than offense. I have the freedom to think it's not our freedom that they hate, but our willy-nilly swashbuckling supposedly in the name of it -- and when it seems almost overtly clear to a biased outsider that said swashbuckling is purely in the name of American economic interests.

Why do you never stop to think about what you're destroying when you go on these freedom missions from God?

Yes, yes, what a bleeding heart liberal I am. [/b][/quote]
So you must believe in the foundation of “Minority Report” since you [b]know]/b] the President’s intent. Every journey begins with one step and every plan must have individual milestones that must be completed before going to the next step. I hear many people disagree with the first steps, but I hear no strategies proposed that are well defined. Should we have gone after Sudan first rather than wait for the UN to watch the rape squads run rampant while 50,000 people are killed there in genocide? Should we have gone after the Mullahs of Iran while the Iranian resistance is still weak and forming and before Iran was geographically isolated from other terror supporting nations? Should we unilaterally abandon the multilateral negotiations going on with North Korea and take them on? Maybe we should kick the French out of the Ivory Coast since they’ve stood back and watched thousands slaughtered there.

If money is an issue, why do we care about this months elections in Afghanistan which has no oil and is only of strategic interest if we wish to isolate Iran’s land borders? If money is an issue why has the price of crude oil gone up since the Iraqi people are now controlling their reserves rather than the UN? If I wanted to talk about money as a motivator, I could ask why John Kerry pushed so hard in 1996 to normalize relations with Vietnam despite their horrible human rights record if not for the exclusive real estate rights his brother acquired in Vietnam as a result.

I agree that we all have a right and an obligation to question why the world is in the shape it’s in today. The number of countries considered free by organizations such as Freedom House is growing in many parts of the world, but the middle east has been sliding backwards since 1978 and it’s time to reverse that trend before it gets worse than it is. That is a strategic decision that is tactically possible. The left leaning Pew Foundation recently completed polls and surveys in Iraq showing an overwhelming majority of the Iraqi people supporting the actions taken by America there and less than 30% of the people think things are worse now than before Saddam was removed, and most of them know it will continue to get better.

If someone were to be able to wave a wand and make all of the people of the world free at once, I’d be all for it but the reality is you have to start somewhere. Yes, sometimes some things must be destroyed in order to allow them to get better just like a good surgeon will risk taking out too much tissue rather than not enough when removing a cancer. It may sound cold and cruel, but millions of Iraqis died waiting for freedom so how many more should have died before we said enough is enough? It may not be something to say in polite company, but the reality is sometimes the only way to save a million innocent people is by killing 10,000 not so innocent people.

[RougeUnderoos]

Wild Bill said:
I’m looking for a new message board software for another application. I like the way Invision software works so I’m checking out a few boards that use it.

sjwalter said

"Come on guys... Anyone could find this site"


sjwalter said
"I know Bill is real, i know another site where he posts and i have asked people if he is the real deal and he is.What an amazing coincidence.

What in the wide wide world of sports is going on here? A mysterious geriatric fighter pilot shows up on a Sunday evening to defend the opinions of a southern Alberta schoolboy and we are supposed to just let this go?

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally posted by Flame On@Oct 25 2004, 05:31 AM

Ummmm, oookay....do you work for the US postal service perchance?

Is there something wrong with working for the Postal Service or are you just trying to infer the old 'gone postal' joke?

The first I have a problem with, the second I don't!

[sjwalter]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos@Oct 25 2004, 01:06 AM
Wild Bill said:
I’m looking for a new message board software for another application. I like the way Invision software works so I’m checking out a few boards that use it.

sjwalter said

"Come on guys... Anyone could find this site"


sjwalter said
"I know Bill is real, i know another site where he posts and i have asked people if he is the real deal and he is.What an amazing coincidence.

What in the wide wide world of sports is going on here? A mysterious geriatric fighter pilot shows up on a Sunday evening to defend the opinions of a southern Alberta schoolboy and we are supposed to just let this go?

He Rouge i just happen to post at a forum where Bill does himself so i asked him if i was misinterpreting his name because it was the same at the other forum or if he actually found his way here. And it looks like he found his way here by himself.

And trust me i post at about 10 different right wing sites and i could ask a whole lot of smart people to come here and kick your ass. And what the hell does what you're asking have to do with anything we're talking about. Still can't get over the fact that you got your ass backed down huh?

Get over it.

[TheCommodoreAfro]

Originally posted by sjwalter+Oct 25 2004, 11:03 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (sjwalter @ Oct 25 2004, 11:03 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-RougeUnderoos@Oct 25 2004, 01:06 AM
Wild Bill said:
I’m looking for a new message board software for another application. I like the way Invision software works so I’m checking out a few boards that use it.

sjwalter said

"Come on guys... Anyone could find this site"


sjwalter said
"I know Bill is real, i know another site where he posts and i have asked people if he is the real deal and he is.What an amazing coincidence.

What in the wide wide world of sports is going on here? A mysterious geriatric fighter pilot shows up on a Sunday evening to defend the opinions of a southern Alberta schoolboy and we are supposed to just let this go?

He Rouge i just happen to post at a forum where Bill does himself so i asked him if i was misinterpreting his name because it was the same at the other forum or if he actually found his way here. And it looks like he found his way here by himself.

And trust me i post at about 10 different right wing sites and i could ask a whole lot of smart people to come here and kick your ass. And what the hell does what you're asking have to do with anything we're talking about. Still can't get over the fact that you got your ass backed down huh?

Get over it. [/b][/quote]
Rouge...

I think he just invited you out to the bike racks after shop class...

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos@Oct 25 2004, 07:08 AM
Really now, should a man of your age and position be broadcasting political opinion, movie reviews and sensitive presidential security protocols to a bunch of Canadian hockey fans at 3am on a Monday morning? I think not.

The freedom of the western world is at hand here, Bill, so you should tread lightly. I've no idea which website our mutual friend "sjwalter" recruited you from to no doubt "kick our liberal asses" but I'm sure the locals there would counsel you to keep your national secrets quite secret.

We should welcome out new friend. I think its great that we get someone new to the scene that has actual experience in this subject matter. I'd much rather hear how it was done and how the technology actually functioned, even if it may be out of date, its good to get that information. Just remember to take it with a grain of salt when it comes to the political views and to try and double check everything.

I'm interested to here more from Bill. I think I know where he's coming from and have a lot of interest into why he feels the way he does. I think Bill is a retired Vietnam fighter jock who, like his brethern, has yet to put the past behind him and has an axe to grind with John Kerry. If you've seen Stolen Honor you'll quickly recognize the rhetoric and the cause of the political views. I'm extremely curious why these veterans have taken the stance they have. It makes little sense what so ever IMO. I know if one of us were to say that we were wronged by what President Bush did in the past, say like drive one of his companies into the ground causing us to lose our job, house, credit rating, etc. (you know, stuff that REALLY affects your life) he would be telling us to get over it, that its in the past and you should focus on the now. I've always been interested about why the Vietnam vets have not been able to get over something that happened over 30 years ago so I'm looking forward to his insight on this issue.

You know, Bill does not scare me as much as sjwalter does. Bill sounds like an intelligent guy who has been around the block and can be reasoned with. He seems like a guy that you could have a beer with, disagree on things, and not leave the place with hard feelings. sjwalter, OTOH, is a young guy that is already lost and has found the fringe. I suspect that in a few years he'll find his way into an extremeist RW movement and end up with a really close cropped haircut and a catchy name like Stormfront, if you get my drift. Its odd to see someone so young jump on an extremist view and embrace it so well. I guess the only thing we can do is try and expose him to a different view point and hope he softens a bit. Or maybe we just accept that he's an extremist and move along!

[Bingo]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos@Oct 25 2004, 02:06 AM
What in the wide wide world of sports is going on here? A mysterious geriatric fighter pilot shows up on a Sunday evening to defend the opinions of a southern Alberta schoolboy and we are supposed to just let this go?

If you are insinuating that they are the same people, ... they are not. A simple look at IP's from our end confirms that.

Other than that do you think you should be calling someone geriatric, Wild Bill and Billy given his newness to the board? His name seems to be BillW, not the call names you keep using.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by Bingo+Oct 25 2004, 09:39 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bingo @ Oct 25 2004, 09:39 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-RougeUnderoos@Oct 25 2004, 02:06 AM
What in the wide wide world of sports is going on here? A mysterious geriatric fighter pilot shows up on a Sunday evening to defend the opinions of a southern Alberta schoolboy and we are supposed to just let this go?

If you are insinuating that they are the same people, ... they are not. A simple look at IP's from our end confirms that.

Other than that do you think you should be calling someone geriatric, Wild Bill and Billy given his newness to the board? His name seems to be BillW, not the call names you keep using. [/b][/quote]
No, I didn't think they were the same people.

But! I do apologize to BillW for calling you a geriatric. That was a cheap shot.

[Flame On]

DIS, I was absolutely not denigrating postal work or workers. I was indeed just using the old "going postal" cliche.
sjwalter, I'm sure many of us here will agree with me in saying that we don't at all agree that the United States is the greatest country in the world. Care to guess which we think it is?
I also don't think Still can't get over the fact that you got your ass backed down huh? I don't for a second believe rouge understands this any better then me, but I don't think Bill or any others have handed rouge his ass or anyone else for that matter.
I guess you don't have that ######ing trust do you? No I don't have that trust, I like to question and hold people accountable, politicians and those that blindly follow most of all.
Or can't you stand it that his comments is against everything you goddamn supported? I don't mind at all, I don't share or agree with them though, is that alright with you?
You don't know the level of trust among a military level, trusting the man next to you with your life huh? No and I suspect that you don't either if you're at school. I happen to not care about that trust and don't think it gives more qualified insight if i did. Thats what i live by and will live by in the next future years, and i can tell you right now its sorry to be fighting for freedom for ***holes like you to tell their own damn opinion, or should i call it their lies. Bill doesn't fight for me, he fights for the US. But I suspect that he does fight for people so they can do exactly that, say their opinion.

[sjwalter]

Hey Flame on, i may have stupid views on many issues but at least i have view. And another thing, that trust that i'm talking about, its something that friends and family have taught for years the trust i live by and is the moral in my life. You don't get why America is fighting the war neither do any of those that oppose it. You have your freedom to disagree with what i say because of what? Its obvious you don't hold those that served both our countries in the highest extreme.

Oh i do have to apologize about the name calling, i was kinda p*ssed off. :P

[sjwalter]

And i live in Canada because of parents not because of choice, and i love Canada because of Hockey, but i feel more proud to be an American. Thats all IMO so why can't you just leave it alone?

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally posted by sjwalter@Oct 25 2004, 10:47 PM
And i live in Canada because of parents not because of choice, and i love Canada because of Hockey, but i feel more proud to be an American. Thats all IMO so why can't you just leave it alone?

Well if you're so proud to be American come on down here and get your fill there junior! Come on. Come on down and taste the freedom that you think is so great. See the disparity between classes. Feel the tension between the races. See how the corporations run this country and put the screws to the little guy. Oh, an while you're at it, put your life where your mouth is and feel free to enlist with the services. You too can fight for "your" freedom. We'll see how just the war in Iraq is when you are the one over there with your life on the line and a country full of people waiting for the opportunity to kill you for no other reason than because you're American. You talk a good game considering you're from Hickville, Alberta, the best province/state on the continent. I'd love to see what you would have to say once you set foot in a place like East St. Louis.

[sjwalter]

Originally posted by Lanny_MacDonald+Oct 25 2004, 04:31 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Lanny_MacDonald @ Oct 25 2004, 04:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-sjwalter@Oct 25 2004, 10:47 PM
And i live in Canada because of parents not because of choice, and i love Canada because of Hockey, but i feel more proud to be an American. Thats all IMO so why can't you just leave it alone?

Well if you're so proud to be American come on down here and get your fill there junior! Come on. Come on down and taste the freedom that you think is so great. See the disparity between classes. Feel the tension between the races. See how the corporations run this country and put the screws to the little guy. Oh, an while you're at it, put your life where your mouth is and feel free to enlist with the services. You too can fight for "your" freedom. We'll see how just the war in Iraq is when you are the one over there with your life on the line and a country full of people waiting for the opportunity to kill you for no other reason than because you're American. You talk a good game considering you're from Hickville, Alberta, the best province/state on the continent. I'd love to see what you would have to say once you set foot in a place like East St. Louis. [/b][/quote]
Lanny i never said why i'm proud to be an American. So where the hell you get all those ideas from. And are you ridiculing your troops now huh? No wonder you agree with Kerry on every damn thing he says, cause he once was against the troops as well.

And by the way, you don't know sh*t about patrotism do you Lanny?

You think like Micheal Moore does, Canada is awesome but they couldn't protect their ass if we were attacked by the terrorists.

And keep my comments out of this, or can't you stand my opinion because i actually believe in the honor of serving my country. Typical Democrat.

[KevanGuy]

Where in Canada do you live sjwalter?

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally posted by Flame On@Oct 25 2004, 05:22 PM
DIS, I was absolutely not denigrating postal work or workers. I was indeed just using the old "going postal" cliche.

It's interesting, the USPS does not like being associated with that term. You can't say it at work, you could get in trouble for it.

I still think it's a funny term, going postal. The rest of the workforce has taken over in workplace shootings though. I can't remember the last time I heard of a post office getting shot up by a disgruntled worker. (Why are they always disgruntled? Never just unhappy?)

Still, the term going postal will stick because of the specificity of what that entails.

[arsenal]

Originally posted by Displaced Flames fan@Oct 25 2004, 05:42 PM
..I heard of a post office getting shot up by a disgruntled worker. (Why are they always disgruntled? Never just unhappy?)

To paraphrase Newman... "Becuase the mail just keeps comming, there is no end. It just keeps comming and comming..."

[sjwalter]

Originally posted by KevanGuy@Oct 25 2004, 04:42 PM
Where in Canada do you live sjwalter?

Alberta.