Making the playoffs or keeping our top-10 first round pick 2025?

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Well maybe try reading his words again.

I did not see any words in there saying that the time to make those trades or signings was NOW, or even this off season. No specific timeline was mentioned at all.

I do agree that Goriders is almost certainly wrong in projecting that the Flames won't get any more chances to draft high. This team is full of stopgap players, some of whom have performed better than expected, plus Wolf, who is lights out, and the first few graduates from their prospect base. Replace the stopgaps with inexperienced kids and the team gets worse in the short run.

[flamesgod]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Goriders is talking about filling the gaps with our cap space and saying #### it to the draft.

The gaps on this team cannot be filled via free agency or a single trade. It will take some suffering and people need to accept it. This isn’t a good team. It’s being propped up by goaltending and loser points.

Are we trading away our young goaltender? No. So its not being propped up, it is what it is, because he is our goalie. That’s not changing. There are young guys on this team that are steadily improving, so I absolutely get what Goriders is saying. I feel like they are in a very weird place right now. Definitely not a place I feel we should be. There’s a very good chance we don’t draft top 10 this year, then the young guys continue to grow, and what if we don’t again next year? Keep trying to kinda suck is also not a good plan, if that’s what happens.

[stemit14]

I’m considering this year to be a bit of a wash as far as collecting elite talent through the draft at this point. Don’t think they’ll finish bottom 10 in the league and they likely only get to pick outside the top 20 with New Jersey and Florida’s picks. Might get some decent depth players from the draft but not expecting much.

I am getting the feeling this will be a poor draft looking back. Mostly just a gut feeling but it seems like drafts where the consensus top picks are continually changing can lead to disappointing drafts years later when we look back. And there’s apparently a big drop off after the top 4. So if the flames are going to miss an 11th-16th overall pick I guess it’s good it’s this year. Who knows though.

My hope will be the flames trade Andersson and Kadri some time in the next 6 months and get some more picks and hopefully a decent center prospect… use cap space to spend on Coronato and Zary extensions (go with higher salary to buy some UFA years). Only spend on short term deals for UFA players to get to the cap floor if necessary. If not needed to get to the cap floor, just let it ride with the young players… don’t bother signing UFA players for the purpose of trading them at the deadline. Usually not worth it.

Finish bottom 2-3 next year. Vegas has injury trouble and finishes bottom 10 in 2026. Win the draft lottery to get the top pick in the draft to select McKenna and hopefully get the best center available with the Vegas pick. Likely struggle again in 2026-2027 and get another top 10 pick. By the 2027-2028 season, the team will have a plethora of talent both in the NHL and in development:

McKenna
Zary
Vegas pick from 2026
Calgary’s 1st round pick from 2027
New Jersey’s 1st round pick from 2025
Florida’s 1st round pick from 2025
Coronato
Basha
Misa
Suniev
Center acquired from Andersson trade
Honzek
Gridin

That’s just at forward and I’m certainly missing a bunch of players already in the system and I’m omitting any players that are still to be picked outside the first round in the next 3 drafts. And I’m omitting any trades that could potentially return other 1st round picks - there won’t be many left besides potentially Andersson. Start dipping into free agency in 2028 to fill wholes in the team that it looks like the 2024-2027 draft picks missed on.

Takes crazy luck, great scouting and patience to build a contender. Here’s hoping.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

I did not see any words in there saying that the time to make those trades or signings was NOW, or even this off season. No specific timeline was mentioned at all.

I do agree that Goriders is almost certainly wrong in projecting that the Flames won't get any more chances to draft high. This team is full of stopgap players, some of whom have performed better than expected, plus Wolf, who is lights out, and the first few graduates from their prospect base. Replace the stopgaps with inexperienced kids and the team gets worse in the short run.

Well I just don't know how you can not get a short time line out of his posts when he's literally stating that we have three good goalies, too many good defensemen coming up and need to acquire our biggest need (centre) through free agency. Like I'm dumbfounded and feel like we're reading different posts, but I'll leave it because I hate arguing.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by flamesgod

Are we trading away our young goaltender? No. So its not being propped up, it is what it is, because he is our goalie. That’s not changing. There are young guys on this team that are steadily improving, so I absolutely get what Goriders is saying. I feel like they are in a very weird place right now. Definitely not a place I feel we should be. There’s a very good chance we don’t draft top 10 this year, then the young guys continue to grow, and what if we don’t again next year? Keep trying to kinda suck is also not a good plan, if that’s what happens.

What are you talking about. The only reason we are the ####ty spot we are is because of goaltending. They can barely score 3 goals.

What we need to do is give the depth a run. Get Vladar a run of games.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

What we need to do is give the depth a run. Get Vladar a run of games.

That would be a sound plan if Wolf was a finished product. He still needs to play. So far Vladar has played 1,034 minutes and Wolf 1,030, which is as equal a workload as you'll ever see. I wouldn't tinker too much with that.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

only reason we are the ####ty spot we are is because of goaltending.

And hard work. You're not giving them enough credit for refusing to roll over and die most nights. It's not like they get dominated every single game and their goalies have to bail them out.

[flamesgod]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

What are you talking about. The only reason we are the ####ty spot we are is because of goaltending. They can barely score 3 goals.

What we need to do is give the depth a run. Get Vladar a run of games.

lol, what are you talking about? Yes let’s reward our stellar young possible franchise goaltender by having him ride the pine for his stellar play. Smart plan.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by flamesgod

Are we trading away our young goaltender? No. So its not being propped up, it is what it is, because he is our goalie. That’s not changing. There are young guys on this team that are steadily improving, so I absolutely get what Goriders is saying. I feel like they are in a very weird place right now. Definitely not a place I feel we should be. There’s a very good chance we don’t draft top 10 this year, then the young guys continue to grow, and what if we don’t again next year? Keep trying to kinda suck is also not a good plan, if that’s what happens.

They were supposed to be the worst team in the history of hockey this season. They aren’t and that’s with their vets doing close to nothing spectacular.

To me that’s a good thing. It means our young guys are carrying a lot of the load. It also shows me there are a lot of players here that don’t accept losing or the BS being a loser narrative. Good for them.

Pospisil
Zary
Coronato
Bahl
Pachal
Wolf

All young. All doing really well and getting better all the time. There are probably 3 to 5 defensemen that will be ready, if not now then in the next couple of seasons.

Kadri and Huberdeau aren’t leaving anytime soon and are gelling.

Weegar is one of the better defensemen in the league. He’s not going anywhere. Same can be said for Anderson if he wants to stay.

Great vets in Coleman and Backlund to build culture and mentor the younger players.

Great 1b in Vladar. Even a 1a at times.

$20 million in cap space. Getting a new rink.

Things could be way worse. I’m glad they are proving everyone wrong. That will pay dividends down the road. Not everything gets decided by a phone app or by AI.

[FlamesAddiction]

My brain says top 10 pick, but my heart says playoffs. Anything but the mushy middle where the team is too good for a top 10, but still misses the playoffs though and I certainly don't want to see any trades with "making the playoffs" as the driving factor. I am pretty confident that Conroy won't do anything like that anyway.

Honestly, I don't think about it too much. It's completely out of our control, so I just go along for the ride.

I guess if I had to pick one, I would say sell and go for a top 10 pick. I'd be lying if I said that losses still didn't piss me off and that wins still feel good though. If I was paying thousands for season tickets, I'd probably just want W's.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Yep, we're at a point where we're a team that will likely only succeed through quality draft choices, but are good enough with Wolf as a goalie to avoid drafting high to get those elite pieces. Cool, cool, cool.

Wolf is elite...best young goalie in the entire world, possibly the universe

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Goriders

They were supposed to be the worst team in the history of hockey this season. They aren’t and that’s with their vets doing close to nothing spectacular.

To me that’s a good thing. It means our young guys are carrying a lot of the load. It also shows me there are a lot of players here that don’t accept losing or the BS being a loser narrative. Good for them.

Pospisil
Zary
Coronato
Bahl
Pachal
Wolf

All young. All doing really well and getting better all the time. There are probably 3 to 5 defensemen that will be ready, if not now then in the next couple of seasons.

Kadri and Huberdeau aren’t leaving anytime soon and are gelling.

Weegar is one of the better defensemen in the league. He’s not going anywhere. Same can be said for Anderson if he wants to stay.

Great vets in Coleman and Backlund to build culture and mentor the younger players.

Great 1b in Vladar. Even a 1a at times.

$20 million in cap space. Getting a new rink.

Things could be way worse. I’m glad they are proving everyone wrong. That will pay dividends down the road. Not everything gets decided by a phone app or by AI.

Where are the great young forwards ? You listed 3 and only 2 of them are showing any progress. Pospisil has 2 goals and is probably going to end up being a 3rd or 4th liner. Unless you mean Walker Duher.

Kadri and Huberdeau gelling doesn’t mean much when they are a combined -26.

Great 1B or 1A in Vladar is hysterical. He’s playing at his career averages which is a .886 save % and 3.06 GAA. Jonas Hiller was ran out of the league with 1 bad year with stats like that.

Bahl is a nice surprise and Pachal is a 3rd pairing player.

You said no one is doing anything spectacular, yeah well that’s whole issue. We need players who can make an impact on the game with the puck on their stick and being able to play with other teams top players. We aren’t getting that with our cap space.

Our division has Kopitar, McDavid, Petterson, Celebrini, Carlson. We tried to convert Sharangovich into a C to play against these guys.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

My brain says top 10 pick, but my heart says playoffs. Anything but the mushy middle where the team is too good for a top 10, but still misses the playoffs though and I certainly don't want to see any trades with "making the playoffs" as the driving factor. I am pretty confident that Conroy won't do anything like that anyway.

Honestly, I don't think about it too much. It's completely out of our control, so I just go along for the ride.

I guess if I had to pick one, I would say sell and go for a top 10 pick. I'd be lying if I said that losses still didn't piss me off and that wins still feel good though. If I was paying thousands for season tickets, I'd probably just want W's.

I can’t see Conroy using that cap space unless something big pops up like an Eichel. If this was Treliving in sure the cap space would have burnt a hole in his pocket and we would be out the space and draft picks.

It also is nice to know we don’t have to worry about signing our young players coming off the ELC like Zary and Coronato. Bahl is up as well and they probably want to get Wolf done as well. Zary, Coronato and Bahl eat up what’s coming off the books and Wolf depending on how the season ends probably puts a bit of a dent on that 20M. We will also need a backup goalie.

[Sandman]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

My brain says top 10 pick, but my heart says playoffs. Anything but the mushy middle where the team is too good for a top 10, but still misses the playoffs though and I certainly don't want to see any trades with "making the playoffs" as the driving factor. I am pretty confident that Conroy won't do anything like that anyway.

Honestly, I don't think about it too much. It's completely out of our control, so I just go along for the ride.

I guess if I had to pick one, I would say sell and go for a top 10 pick. I'd be lying if I said that losses still didn't piss me off and that wins still feel good though. If I was paying thousands for season tickets, I'd probably just want W's.

I get what you're saying, but I think the "mushy middle" includes squeaking in to the playoffs to lose in the first round. That sucks almost as much as missing the playoffs entirely.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Sandman

I get what you're saying, but I think the "mushy middle" includes squeaking in to the playoffs to lose in the first round. That sucks almost as much as missing the playoffs entirely.

People talk about causing damage in the playoffs after we beat down Chicago. News flash we won’t be playing Chicago. You likely get Vegas or Colorado and the playoffs are a different beast. Teams make adjustments and do more game planning than a game in December before players are getting ready to vacation.

Roster isn’t even close to the 14/15 team we have no game breakers and we also played Vancouver a pretty poor team. Anaheim rag dolled us in the 2nd round.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

People talk about causing damage in the playoffs after we beat down Chicago. News flash we won’t be playing Chicago. You likely get Vegas or Colorado and the playoffs are a different beast. Teams make adjustments and do more game planning than a game in December before players are getting ready to vacation.

Roster isn’t even close to the 14/15 team we have no game breakers and we also played Vancouver a pretty poor team. Anaheim rag dolled us in the 2nd round.

You mean the same colorado that has played two more games than us and has three more points? What does a team from a decade ago have to do with anything?

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Goriders

You mean the same colorado that has played two more games than us and has three more points. The players must be hiding under their beds.

Now you’re just showing you have no idea what you’re talking about. Colorado had some of the worst goaltending in the league and made 2 trades and have climbed the standings.

I’m sure MacKinnon and Makar look at the almost complete Flames and say we don’t want to play them lol.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Huska has always coached poor offensive teams. The teams who dip into free agency for tjr big fish end up like Seattle or Nashville.

The teams doesn’t need good players. We need elite players. Outside of the draft it’s almost impossible.

Or your favorite team Vegas.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Now you’re just showing you have no idea what you’re talking about. Colorado had some of the worst goaltending in the league and made 2 trades and have climbed the standings.

I’m sure MacKinnon and Makar look at the almost complete Flames and say we don’t want to play them lol.

Do you want to bet on Colorado winning the cup? I bet they won’t. Should they trade away all of their players if they don’t?

[Paulie Walnuts]

What are you even talking about. You clearly are delusional and have no idea what a rebuild is.

Who said Colorado is winning the cup? Are you comparing us to them? I’m sure they are shaking at the thought of playing the Flames in the playoffs.

You just bounce around and make up ####. Calling Vladar great. Couldn’t answer what young forwards outside the obvious are taking huge strides.

Vegas traded for their players. Signed Pieterangelo. They are also a one off being an expansion team. Soon they will have to do what we are doing. You can just look at Seattle and see why it’s a one off. This isn’t the CFL you don’t rebuild overnight.