[PGT] Flames lose 2-1 in Carolina

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

I can't believe our now highest paid player took a bonehead penalty in the 3rd with a tie game and all the momentum in the Canes favor.

He's got a long way to go before he's ever going to wear a C for a team. Monahan disappearing isn't new but Tkachuk has been a big disappointment so far as he's stood out for the wrong reasons.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by dino7c

he was in a headlock for 5 seconds and both guys got shots in...pretty tough call

I feel like there is two versions of this play going around. From what I saw he clearly punched the Canes player in front of the official snapping the player's head back. That was such an easy call.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

He's got a long way to go before he's ever going to wear a C for a team. Monahan disappearing isn't new but Tkachuk has been a big disappointment so far as he's stood out for the wrong reasons.

Back to back games where he's been a part of the key play that lost the game.

[Press Level]

Originally Posted by midniteowl

I shouldn't have come in to a PGT after a loss, it's toxic in here, I'll show myself out.

Are we in the dressing room?

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Mattman

Man, this is the first game I've been able to sit down and watch entirely in a few weeks. I thought these guys played good hockey despite the result.

Rittich
Lindholm
Hanifin
Kylington

Saw some good stuff from Quine and Bennett. Brodie was invisible on the score sheet but made 8 blocks tonight.

Everyone else was just completely invisible, disengaged, or just bad... Monahan, Andersson and Tkachuk, I'm looking at you guys.

I guess the question is who are the vets on the team? Your core guys should be the guys showing leadership. To quote Darryl Sutter ,"Your best players have to be your best players". Everything flows from there, and if those guys are not showing leadership it makes it harder for the rest of the team to show up. Monahan and Gaudreau, Tkachuk, these are the guys getting paid good money and looked on as core pieces, if they are not showing leadership then they need to be challenged.

It seems that this season it less about scoring goals and more about playing with a lead. This may be throwing a wrench in the way guys usually play.

The core needs to step up and lead the team.

[Chingas]

My frustration tonight lies mostly with the officiating. Gios hook was weak as f, Tkachuck was in a head lock for 10 seconds and then exchanged shots, BS if you ask me. Then no call on spear on the goalie on the ensuing pp to top it off.

[Titan]

Am I doing this right?

NSFW!

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I feel like there is two versions of this play going around. From what I saw he clearly punched the Canes player in front of the official snapping the player's head back. That was such an easy call.

By the letter of the law there were lots of "easy" calls there...both guys got a punch in. There was at least 5 seconds of headlock.

I mean Monny got puched with the blocker at the end of the game, easy call? Cross check on Mangi?

The problem is the standard suddenly changed midway through the third

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Trading players that are in a slump...what could go wrong?

fans are too reactionary

Team needs another top six winger...this game could have been put away in the first with a little finish/luck. Everyone knows it. Making bad trades now because the lackluster play would backfire big time. Hate watching Neal put up points? You are gonna really hate with JG scores 120+ for another team where he isn't the main driver.

Honest question, how many teams in the NHL have a full set of 6 players that are qualified as top-6 players? For successful teams that have had playoff runs over the past few seasons. How many had two lines were each player was a top-6 player? What is even the expected output of a top 6 player?

Would it be fair to say that the Flames have at least 4 in Gaudreau, Monhana, Lindholm, and Tkachuk? That's 4 players out of 6. Meaning 2 players out of the 3 are on the ice when the lines are out. And during the PP, 4 of them are on a line together, plus Gio who is a Norris defenseman. When you literally have all your best players on the ice together, with a man advantage, and yet have such a abysmal PP, I think that says a lot of what the issue is.

I don't think the Flames lacking another top 6 forward is the issue. They have enough top end talent that they should be productive on a regular basis. But in the NHL, talent can only get you so far. To truly win in this league, it comes down to effort and execution, and that's what the Flames are lacking right now. The Flames are getting their chances, but then fail in executing successfully. Meanwhile, the opposing team, when they get their chances, they're opportunistic, and force Flames goaltender to make a tremendous save, or successfully get the puck into the net.

Prior to the All-Star game last year, the Flames, and more in particular, the top line was firing on all cylinders because they were incredibly opportunistic, and took advantage of their chances. Since then though, it hasn't been the case. I feel that's because that's because the effort level has dropped. This team doesn't have the same energy that it had beforehand, and as a result, I believe the confidence has dropped with it. It doesn't come as easy as it did beforehand, and now the sense of doubt is more prevalent. This is why the Flames look like such #### on the PP, and move like their caught in molasses. They're not dictating the play, and being to passive. The team down a man on the PP is putting in effort, while Flames are not.

In sports, what really makes successful teams is outworking your opponent, and being opportunistic. There's a reason why upsets happen, and how cinderella teams come around. The 04 Flames, as well as the 15 Flames were not the most talented teams, but they greatly exceeded expectations thanks to their work ethic. If Flames are going to start getting goals again, they need to increase their drive, to lead to more scoring chances. With the increase in chances, they'll have more opportunities to get pucks in the net. Only getting a small handful of them isn't going to cut it since not all are going to result in a goal. But get a fair amount of great opportunities (open net, point blank in slot, one-timers, etc.) and some will get behind the goalie.

Flames have enough talent on the top end of their roster to be successful. They gotta earn their wins. There needs to be more fire in this team's heart.

[I_H8_Crawford]

Meh, as we have seen twice before, this is the M.O. of this core.
Overachieve one year with a coach, next year tune him out, miss playoffs and get him fired.

First Hartley, then GG, now Peters faces the same thing. Coach killers.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

He's got a long way to go before he's ever going to wear a C for a team. Monahan disappearing isn't new but Tkachuk has been a big disappointment so far as he's stood out for the wrong reasons.

Ugh I'm not totally surprised, players that miss camp often have bad starts, but I would have loved to be proven wrong on this one.

I love Tkachuk, he's probably my favourite player, but get it together bud

[Cali Panthers Fan]

I thought that was a good game from the Flames for two periods against a very good team, especially on the road.

But then they flat out didn't show up for the 3rd period. That's incredibly frustrating to watch.

More to the point, who is doing anything when the going gets tough for this team? I don't see any leadership other than Rittich who does his damndest to keep his team in games and seems to care a lot.

Sean Monahan has to get going. Johnny Gaudreau has to get going and stop making weak plays in his own zone. Matthew Tkachuk has to start drawing penalties instead of taking them.

Also, can we get a 2nd line winger? Quine had one nice chance that was a bit of a fluke, but after that, both he and Bennett were virtually invisible tonight. That entire line was a waste out there. When Lucic-Backlund-Frolik are generating far more offense than your line, you deserve to sit for a game.

I'm getting more and more concerned about where the offense is going to come from on this team. I think it's a rock solid team defensively and in goal, but where are the goals? Concerning so far this year.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

He's got a long way to go before he's ever going to wear a C for a team. Monahan disappearing isn't new but Tkachuk has been a big disappointment so far as he's stood out for the wrong reasons.

He's 21. He will be fine.

I think with Tkachuk we are seeing a guy that feels like he has to do it all by himself because he got a big new contract. The same thing happened with Gaudreau after he signed his big deal after an extended "hold out".

There is something wrong with the team as a whole for sure, but with MT I think he is too far inside his own head and trying way to hard to do what normally just comes naturally when he is in a good place.

Whats wrong with Johnny or Monahan though? No idea...Gaudreau has been just awful defensively lately and SM is invisible for the most part.....he needs a fight or something.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

He's got a long way to go before he's ever going to wear a C for a team. Monahan disappearing isn't new but Tkachuk has been a big disappointment so far as he's stood out for the wrong reasons.

Just to expand on this.
Tkachuk needs to have the mental discipline and situational awareness not to retaliate in that situation. The person retaliating getting sent to the box, is not a new or unusual thing. It happens ALL the time. He knows that.
It's mental weakness to take dumb penalties, turn the puck over in horrible spots, and not execute at the critical moments of the game.
Committed players amp up their mental focus in those situations.

When we talk about players being committed to winning - this is what it is. It isn't being mad when you lose. It isn't "trying hard". It's doing this stuff.

[3rd liner]

Hopefully this makes some of you feel better- oil lost to the wings. Small victories.....

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Just to expand on this.
Tkachuk needs to have the mental discipline and situational awareness not to retaliate in that situation. The person retaliating getting sent to the box, is not a new or unusual thing. It happens ALL the time. He knows that.
It's mental weakness to take dumb penalties, turn the puck over in horrible spots, and not execute at the critical moments of the game.
Committed players amp up their mental focus in those situations.

When we talk about players being committed to winning - this is what it is. It isn't being mad when you lose. It isn't "trying hard". It's doing this stuff.

Nobody should know this better than him either. He's built a good chunk of his career on tiling guys up so they retaliate either drawing a penalty or drawing them off the game.

If anyone should know not to get sucked in like that it should be him

[JohnnyB]

Mojo is missing. The Avs broke them. Don't know what it will take to get it back, but i hope it happens soon.

[Yamer]

Tkachuk plays with an edge, takes a bad penalty, OWNS it in the postgame interviews.

This kid is a leader.

[Strange Brew]

Nobody has ever won a game during the post game interviews.

[3rd liner]

Any NHL team that needs cheerleaders in the stands and grown men embarrassing themselves in on-ice celebrations is GARBAGE. Now I have more reasons to hate the canes than just me being a grumpy old fan....
I know the game was close- but could somebody please have beaten the **** out of Haula for the poke at Rittich?