[News Roundup] Garbage bag day: Monahan had 4 surgeries!

[GoJetsGo]

I think I'd be okay with Sutter back as head coach, but you'd have to think with how much involvement he had in running the franchise a while back and how it ended in him essentially going mad scientist, there must be some difficult optics with ownership / upper management that may make bringing him back difficult.

[Erick Estrada]

Brent Sutter was considered a pretty big fish when the Flames got him. The Devils did not want him go as he coached the team to 99 and 106 point seasons in succession.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Brent Sutter was considered a pretty big fish when the Flames got him. The Devils did not want him go as he coached the team to 99 and 106 point seasons in succession.

Couldn't handle the horses on "The Best D Corps in the League" TM

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by howard_the_duck

My god. I'm going to make an example of Tkachuk and the Flames in this case, but the NHL really needs to take a look at correcting this mentality. It really perpetuates the stigma around concussion and the implications they have on mental health and longer term side effects. There's been so much progress in this area yet the NHL and NFL's of the world still aren't getting it right.

A concussion isn't an injury you can rush back 'if the games matter'. If symptoms were telling the Flames Matthew isn't right, then no matter the game importance I sure hope he'd sit out for the full duration.

He wouldn't have been able to come back without medical clearance.

What he is saying is that, despite the clearance, there was no point in coming back once the season was in the toilet. If the games had mattered, he was healthy enough to play.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by keenan87

He was an agitator when he came into the league. That was supposed to be his role in the league. Someone who can open up space for other players on his line, agitate, and pot some goals.

How many times did Ferland make a bone-crushing hit this season? How many times did the other team call him "Ferklund" or even acknowledged his presence post-game?

Before you say that top line players don't need to play that game, there are plenty of guys who do it (Perry, Marchand etc.). He is obviously not as good as those guys but he was extremely effective against Vancouver in the playoffs. Especially when playing with guys like Monahan and Gaudreau - Guys who aren't naturally mean natured on the ice.

Personally, I would take playoff beast Ferland on the third line putting in 10-15 goals a season rather than what we saw this year with his 20 goals. How sweet would it be if we had both Tkachuk and Ferland agitating the crap out of other teams.

Sorry. I don't agree at all. There is no possible way that Micheal Ferland—nor any other human being, for that matter—could maintain the same level of physical intensity in the seven game stretch of the 2015 first round of the playoffs over the course of a full season.

Like I said: this is NOT a matter of Ferland making a decision about what sort of player he is. It is rather tied to his placement on the roster—a coach's decision—combined with the need for him to manage his game over for the duration of +82-games. A MUCH more reasonable explanation of Ferland's performance this season is tied to the health of his centreman.

You are never going to get "playoff beast Ferland" every game of the year regardless of which line he plays on.

[howard_the_duck]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

He wouldn't have been able to come back without medical clearance.

What he is saying is that, despite the clearance, there was no point in coming back once the season was in the toilet. If the games had mattered, he was healthy enough to play.

I hope so. I haven't seen enough from the league to feel safe about that assumption, though.

I find it odd holding back a 20 year old kid who's still in a critical development phase, that's been deemed healthy by the medical staff, would have been held out based on the unimportant games.

I guess my complaint would be the same kind of caution should be exercised with head injuries no matter the importance of the schedule.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by The Boy Wonder

Yeah that pretty much sums it up.

I still think most fans have watched other teams go out and get great coaches and the whole not even being in on Boudreau last year and it just gets frustrating.

Kinda feels like the one thing we haven’t tried as an organization inthe last 25 years is getting a top quality coach. We’ve tried being fast, we’ve tried truculence and every type of front office possible, but still very limited success.

I think that does make sense, but I also think you need to look at this as a pre and post lock out thing as well (04/05).

Calgary was a budget team pre salary cap era. They couldn't afford to "compete" with the big boys per say, and that didn't just apply to player salaries. I actually think the ownership group did hire closer to the top of the pile with the D. Sutter choice, so that's something.

After the cap era, I agree easy to look back on the choices and feel underwhelmed, but how much of that had to do with lack of desire to spend? Obviously I don't know, but here's how I would break down the coaching choices at the time.

- Playfair - I'm sure he was cheap, rookie head coach. That to me though was likely more about promoting from within, and likely the fact that our GM (and former coach) probably still wanted to try and do both jobs, so that choice allowed him the most chance at doing that.

- Keenan - When the above didn't work, our GM went out and hired a guy who he felt coached like him and he was familiar with. Again, less likely to be about budget.

- B. Sutter - everything I remember hearing is that D.Sutter was forced by ownership to turf Keenan even though he didn't want to. That is the opposite of being cheap, they spent more on coaches because of that. And the hire being B.Sutter, who was the hottest coach in the NHL at the time. So they did go out and land the "big fish" so to speak when it came to coaches.

- Hartley - I'm going to guess he was cheap as well. Obviously he was tight with Feaster, but I'm also guessing that the owners didn't want to invest heavy in a top flight coach for what was the beginning of a scorched earth rebuild, and to that I say fair enough.

- Glue Gun - As mentioned before, I've heard he was cheap. But again, did we pick him cause he was cheap, or because BT wanted to hire a "new style" or "new generation" coach. I actually don't know, but wouldn't surprise me if it was the latter. Something tells me BT wasn't hamstrung on budget for coaching. Now whether he got his man or had to settle on a 2 or 3rd option that ended up being cheaper, who knows.

I'm with you though, I'm hoping we get an established high end coach for next season, so fingers crossed.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Brent Sutter was considered a pretty big fish when the Flames got him. The Devils did not want him go as he coached the team to 99 and 106 point seasons in succession.

I don't recall it quite like that, but certainly expectations were high. But those two seasons were his only two NHL coaching seasons at that point. Pretty different from truly established coaches.

[browna]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

When exactly did Ferland make this decision?

Through his first 55 games of the season he was pretty consistent and experiencing the most success of his professional career. I think it is much more likely that his production plummeted in tandem with Sean Monahan's injuries.

Well, 3 goals his first 13 and they were starting to be experimenting with Jagr on the top line, until Jagr got his first injury. So that’s 5 goals in 48 book end games or so, with the other 16 coming in less than 30 games.

And last year too, 5 goals in his first 50 games. He then got moved up and went on his streak, scoring 9 of his 15 goals in a 16 game stretch mid season.

2 years ago he got 4 goals all season on the thirdish line.

Definition of streaky and I’m not sure the Flames can be dependent on their top scoring line waiting for him to catch a hot streak.

And the additional issue is,when he’s not on the top line, he has point totals similar to the first half of last season and all of two seasons ago. Nor is he the wrecking ball he was in the 1st playoff series 3 years back.

[dammage79]

Flames website has the Treliving presser live feed up. Did I miss it or am i waiting.

[activeStick]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Monahan with 4 (!!!!) surgeries since being shut down (per Wes G, and noted above)

How did he even play those last few games? Wow.

I guess this is a real eye opener for those that predicted that Monahan was one of the players that Francis mentioned as not caring enough.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Sorry. I don't agree at all. There is no possible way that Micheal Ferland—nor any other human being, for that matter—could maintain the same level of physical intensity in the seven game stretch of the 2015 first round of the playoffs over the course of a full season.

Like I said: this is NOT a matter of Ferland making a decision about what sort of player he is. It is rather tied to his placement on the roster—a coach's decision—combined with the need for him to manage his game over for the duration of +82-games. a MUCH more reasonable explanation of Ferland's performance this season is tied to the health of his centreman.

You are never going to get "playoff beast Ferland" every game of the year regardless of which line he plays on.

He has suffered a few concussions that we know about?

Had to modify his game to stay in the line-up and for long-term health?

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Flames website has the Treliving presser live feed up. Did I miss it or am i waiting.

Hasn't started yet.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

I have to defend Brouwer a little because he gets what it takes, even if he isn't able to necessarily do what it takes himself.

The interviewer asked him about missing the playoffs and he said this is only the 2nd time since junior that he's missed, and he doesn't like the feeling at all.

Another question was proposed to him about the high shot count and low goal total down the stretch and what can be done to fix it. He was pretty clear on his analysis. The strategy was to take a lot of shots from the outside simply to get the puck to the net, and then get 2nd and 3rd chance opportunities in close and bang home some goals. He said that the team simply wasn't able to generate those 2nd chances, so they were often 1 and done, and the stats don't indicate that. He said flat out that guys need to get stronger or become more determined or be able to free up their sticks in tight in order to give themselves an opportunity to score some goals. On that subject, he also added that moral victories don't mean anything, actual victories do.

Sorry guys, but Brouwer gets it. He might not be the most effective player on the ice physically, but he knows how to play the game at this level. I wouldn't be shocked to see him get bought out, but here's one thing that hasn't been brought up yet:

We all think Gulutzan hasn't gotten the most out of this roster, and people often bring up the play of guys like Brodie, Bennett, etc. Brouwer hasn't played under anyone besides Gulutzan here in Calgary. Is it possible that Gulutzan screwed up Brouwer's game too? Did he not play to Brouwer's strengths?

I don't know the answer to that one, but I think it deserves consideration at least before we punt him off the team.

[Toonage]

This is why a new coach has to come in and assess the roster alongside the GM before major changes are made.

Could Brouwer (among others) benefit from a whole new system? Sutter for example would probably get more out of him.

[nik-]

If he gets it so much, but clearly can't do it, maybe he should take up teaching.

Mental comprehension without any ability to execute really doesn't help us at all.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I have to defend Brouwer a little because he gets what it takes, even if he isn't able to necessarily do what it takes himself.

The interviewer asked him about missing the playoffs and he said this is only the 2nd time since junior that he's missed, and he doesn't like the feeling at all.

Another question was proposed to him about the high shot count and low goal total down the stretch and what can be done to fix it. He was pretty clear on his analysis. The strategy was to take a lot of shots from the outside simply to get the puck to the net, and then get 2nd and 3rd chance opportunities in close and bang home some goals. He said that the team simply wasn't able to generate those 2nd chances, so they were often 1 and done, and the stats don't indicate that. He said flat out that guys need to get stronger or become more determined or be able to free up their sticks in tight in order to give themselves an opportunity to score some goals. On that subject, he also added that moral victories don't mean anything, actual victories do.

Sorry guys, but Brouwer gets it. He might not be the most effective player on the ice physically, but he knows how to play the game at this level. I wouldn't be shocked to see him get bought out, but here's one thing that hasn't been brought up yet:

We all think Gulutzan hasn't gotten the most out of this roster, and people often bring up the play of guys like Brodie, Bennett, etc. Brouwer hasn't played under anyone besides Gulutzan here in Calgary. Is it possible that Gulutzan screwed up Brouwer's game too? Did he not play to Brouwer's strengths?

I don't know the answer to that one, but I think it deserves consideration at least before we punt him off the team.

Fair post. And worthy of consideration. I am happy with what he said about the shots counts stuff.

I've been banging that drum for a while.

[EVERLAST]

Why on earth does Glen get another shot here because this is what it looks like.
Man i tell ya this has to be the worst news outside of the fact Brad admits this team was a huge disappointment.

Am I the only one that thinks that this is horse shirt??? Soft threats do nothing, short leashes etc ...... WOW.

Get rid of GlueGun FFS.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by The Boy Wonder

It’s more of a “owners are cheap because they haven’t spent on a top quality coach since 1990...” that’s basically the gripe for most people and just a sense that we haven’t had much success over the past 25 years so we blame the one thing that’s been pretty much constant over that period.

Despite the fact that this is repeated over and over on thread after thread, this is completely untrue. Both Darryl and Brent were paid at the top of the scale for coaches at the time of their hiring.

[dammage79]

Presser is going live. Mic check. tap tap tap.