[News] NHL players will not participate in 2018 Olympics?

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by FAN

Are they really "throwing away NHL contracts?" It's going to be a legal battle before an NHL team can cancel/nullify a contract of a player who decides to leave the team and play in the Olympics.

No it wouldn't. There would be near 0 issues in terminating the contract. Players not honouring their contract and taking a month off in the middle of a season without cause would give them no legal grounds to fight a battle. What's worst is that player contracts are very specific and do prevent players from playing other sports, including hockey outside of the NHL, so not only are they no longer honouring their duties as an NHL player for the time but completely going against their contracts.

I agree with the other posts that it would probably be closer to fines and suspensions but for most Olympic class players leaving for even a couple weeks would cost them close to a million before any fines if they were suspended just during their time away.

And players would not be signing 3 year contracts to get around the Olympic ban. There's probably a couple super patriotic players but let's not kid ourselves, most NHL players also like money. They wont be leaving big contracts so they can play in Seoul and Kazakhstan.

I'm not saying the NHL will stop going to the Olympics, but if they decide not to there will be very little changes. Might see Ovechkin heading over and the Capitals turning a blind eye or a young player being released like the World Juniors, maybe giving a couple veterans a chance to leave. Unless the NHL itself took a hard-nose no going policy. But there's not going to be a great exodus of Russian players (in part because there's like only 10 of them over here anyways) and it's easy to be patriotic when it doesn't cost you 7 figures.

[vilzeh]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

If the NHL never went to the Olympics then people wouldn't really think about it. Everyone watched the 1972 Summit series, did anyone watch the 1972 Winter Olympic hockey tournament? Everyone watched the 1987 Canada Cup, did anyone really care about the 1988 Winter Olympic hockey tournament other than the fact that it was held in the Saddledome?

People want to see best on best wherever it is. If the NHL pulls out of the Olympics and starts up the World Cup again, there would be a lot of growing pains. The NHL had a great opportunity when the US won the 96 World Cup. The 2000 World Cup could have been in all those new buildings down in the SunBelt to promote the new teams down there. Instead they pissed that entire tournament away and went all the way to Japan. If a student were to write a business case, he would see how poor of a business decision that was to abandon a money-making tournament and to interrupt a season in Feburary (when there is no football or baseball going on) and be at the mercy of the IOC.

I'm not sure it was a good idea for the NBA to go either but at least it's in the off-season. And for soccer? Nobody watches the Olympic Soccer tournament.

What? what? and what? LOL.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by FAN

Are they really "throwing away NHL contracts?" It's going to be a legal battle before an NHL team can cancel/nullify a contract of a player who decides to leave the team and play in the Olympics and more often than not a team probably still wants to keep that player. Most likely, you're at worse looking at a team suspension and fine.

A suspension that the IIHF would honour. Any player who left his NHL team without permission and tried to act in violation of their NHL contract wouldn't be playing in the Olympics.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

You are missing who they are trying to get to watch. Yes, Canadians watched the summit series, the Russians likely did also, but that's it. Very few Americans have a clue as to what the Summit Series even is.

The NHL going to the Olympics was about one thing, and one thing only, selling the game to the Americans who do watch the Olympics. And specifically, the whole effort and starting in 98 was to iron out the kinks so that the NHLs best players were on the ice on 02 when the States were watching even more so and at prime time while they hosted the Olympics. Nathan's the only reason the NHL is there, and it was a smart choice, to milk the Salt Lake games for everything they were worth to the US audience when they hosted the games.

Following that, Vancouver hosting so closely after likely made they keep it going as it represented another opportunity to show case the NHL to the US fans at a prime time viewing games. Being in Russia likely has more to do with appeasing the Russian players and managing that element of them wanting the chance to play in their home games after the US and Canadian players just recently got the opportunity.

Now, not sure the same need exists to keep sending the players, to sell the game, especially to locations like Korea. The interest might peak again for the NHL should another North American games comes around, but until then there is next to no benefit for the league in being there, and I agree they should go back to the World Cup and copy what soccer does.

I agree but they could have done this after the US won the 1996 world cup. Americans won so Americans are excited. Host the next world cup in the US and get a tv deal out if it. It's your own tournament in your own time zone every time and you don't have to be at the mercy of the IOC putting the tournament in Sochi, Pyeongchang, Qatar or the Moon.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

A suspension that the IIHF would honour. Any player who left his NHL team without permission and tried to act in violation of their NHL contract wouldn't be playing in the Olympics.

Why would the IIHF do that. They would want defectors

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Why would the IIHF do that. They would want defectors

No they don't. Going to war with the NHL does absolutely nothing good for the IIHF. Particularly since it will want to be involved ($) in the World Cup. The IIHF is still very dependent on North America for its revenues and income. It won't rock that boat.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

No they don't. Going to war with the NHL does absolutely nothing good for the IIHF. Particularly since it will want to be involved ($) in the World Cup. The IIHF is still very dependent on North America for its revenues and income. It won't rock that boat.

Possible. Did the IIHF get money from Canada Cups and World Cups? I don't remember. What revenues do we give the IIHF now?

[PeteMoss]

If its in the Olympics... basically every country in the world is going to show it and it will get giant viewership in the US (since basically every TV show goes on hiatus while the Olympics are on). Even if its shown on a huge tape delay in the US its going to get big viewership.

If you have a World Cup/Canada Cup... you won't get nearly the viewership. It will go up against a regular TV schedule and if you end up with a Finland/Czech final, it will get a 0.0 TV rating in the US and everyone will be snickering about hockey support in the US.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

Legit question regarding the World Cup (Soccer) - do the team owners get money from this? Or does it all just go to FIFA?

This is a bit of an apples to oranges question, I'll try and break it down so it makes sense, for my own understanding too.

A) As far as I know, Hockey Canada and the NHL have nothing to do with each other right? I may be corrected but does any money transfer from one entity to the other. I believe they are totally separate. If there is money involved it's very small.

B) The World Cup is actually a prize money event. FIFA gives out prize money to the Countries soccer federation depending on how they finish. My numbers may be a bit off but for example if Canada had qualified for the World Cup, Soccer Canada, would have gotten 12 million dollars from FIFA for making it that far. The World Cup champion gets close to 50 million dollars I think. With that 12 million dollars Soccer Canada could do whatever it wants with it. They could use it for marketing, advertising, create a new league whatever. Using a more suitable example, The English FA could use that money for development or for prize money of their competitions. For example I believe the winner of the FA Cup gets a 1 million dollars.
So a tiny team in like the 8th division who makes the First Round Proper of the FA Cup receives $30000. That's a lot for a team from some village and it comes from the World Cup prize money pie.

C) Also in soccer national teams are playing all the time not just once every 4 years like in hockey. so the interruption to the season is just an inconvenience, So teams just have to put up with their players always going off to play for the countries and if they get hurt, too bad. Sure there are arguments but FIFA have mandated, these are the 10 days of the year you must release your player to play internationally and the clubs don't have a choice. Imagine if a superstar like Iginla played for Canada 100 times. So Flames would be playing Edmonton on a Saturday, Vancouver on a Wednesday and then there would be a break the following Saturday so that Iginla goes and plays for Canada. Then he comes back on the following Wednesday to play Detroit. That's how soccer is.

[BigTuna]

Originally Posted by troutman

They will be there because the players want to be there. The fans want them to be there. The NHL should want them to be there too. It grows the game. You don't see Bob Costas talking about Alex Ovechkin very often.

The NHL probably just uses it as a bargaining chip, and will always give it away in the end.

Not even when Ovechkin participates in the Olympics. NBC still doesn't cover hockey much.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by BigTuna

They should not be going. If you read into it, the NHl is making no money from this at all. They are shutting down their league for a month. No other league would do this.

I think it would be more accurate to say that every other league in the world does this all the time. .

All Euro hockey leagues make room for the world championships every year. While they move less money than the NHL. Finnish, Swedish, Russian and Czech leagues also make room and loan players for the Euro Hockey Tour (which is a set of four tournaments held every year that combine for the unofficial European championship).

Also, there's things like African Cup of Nations, which is held every two years right in the middle of the Euro soccer season, and the leagues don't go on break for those games. The best African players generally play in Europe, and their European clubs just have to do without them while that tournament is on.

Sure, the teams gripe, and the national coaches of the countries that are almost guaranteed to make the tournament sometimes use a second tier team to beat on the weaker teams. However, just to underline the difference in sports culture, the greatest superstars like Messi are generally always used, because it would be considered rude not to do that.

(Typically in soccer the qualification games are what makes the money for the national associations, since many countries only rarely or never make it to the tournament. This is also the reason a C-tier tournament like EHT exists in hockey, to make up for the fact that hockey doesn't have a similar qualification system.)

When you compare all this that is considered perfectly normal everywhere else in the world to loaning out your players to the olympics tournament for a couple of weeks every four years (which is already too little, as the tournament would be better if the teams had more time to practice together and the players could rest a bit), it really showcases how completely out of proportion the NHL's whining is.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

I agree but they could have done this after the US won the 1996 world cup. Americans won so Americans are excited. Host the next world cup in the US and get a tv deal out if it. It's your own tournament in your own time zone every time and you don't have to be at the mercy of the IOC putting the tournament in Sochi, Pyeongchang, Qatar or the Moon.

The World Cup had 0 draw in attracting new US viewers though. Nobody cares about the World Cup of hockey in the US except the hard core hockey fan that already watches. In fact many casual hockey fans likely had no clue the US won the World Cup, and if they did they likely didn't watch. I was actually going to college in the States in 06. Of the 10 people or so that I hung out with, one, a guy from Portland who watched the Winterhawks and personally knew Adam Deadmarsh (I bring this up because I believe the only reason he knew about the World Cup was through his relationship with Deadmarsh) new that the US won the World Cup or that the event even took place. But every single one of my friends there knew the US had won the gold medal with the Miracle on ice in 80 (and they all would have been 2 or 3 years old when that happened.

Point being, is its that kind of exposure the NHL was looking for. The whole US sporting world watches the Olympics, not just the already converted hard core hockey fan, and it was that unique opportunity to sell and showcase the game to potential brand new fans in Salt Lake is the reason why the NHL went to the Olympics in the first place, not something the World Cup of hockey can create.

[flamesfan1297]

Maybe the clubs have to release their players, so that it is up to management, owners and players. The NHL season would still carry on without a break, and players would get to go to the Olympics if their team released them. Basically like what the world juniors do with players already in the NHL.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

The World Cup had 0 draw in attracting new US viewers though. Nobody cares about the World Cup of hockey in the US except the hard core hockey fan that already watches. In fact many casual hockey fans likely had no clue the US won the World Cup, and if they did they likely didn't watch. I was actually going to college in the States in 06. Of the 10 people or so that I hung out with, one, a guy from Portland who watched the Winterhawks and personally knew Adam Deadmarsh (I bring this up because I believe the only reason he knew about the World Cup was through his relationship with Deadmarsh) new that the US won the World Cup or that the event even took place. But every single one of my friends there knew the US had won the gold medal with the Miracle on ice in 80 (and they all would have been 2 or 3 years old when that happened.

Point being, is its that kind of exposure the NHL was looking for. The whole US sporting world watches the Olympics, not just the already converted hard core hockey fan, and it was that unique opportunity to sell and showcase the game to potential brand new fans in Salt Lake is the reason why the NHL went to the Olympics in the first place, not something the World Cup of hockey can create.

I accept this argument. I somewhat disagree because I think they could have pounded the marketing on a 2000 World Cup in Dallas and LA with the World Champion American team but that might be my own wishful fantasy and I'm totally wrong.

Having said that then the NHL shouldn't be considering withdrawing from the Olympics to start up a World Cup that Americans won't watch. The owners really shouldn't be gripping about something that grows the game and interrupts two weeks out of every 4 years. That's just short-sightedness greed.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by BigTuna

Not even when Ovechkin participates in the Olympics. NBC still doesn't cover hockey much.

What?

They just shelled out 10 BILLION dollars to show the NHL...and they do show many games on their sports channel. (40 alone after the break and before the playoffs...likely more than any Canadian network)

Strange comment.

[T@T]

How is it Dreger can report something about the league that even they don't know the answer too?

[Itse]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

I accept this argument. I somewhat disagree because I think they could have pounded the marketing on a 2000 World Cup in Dallas and LA with the World Champion American team but that might be my own wishful fantasy and I'm totally wrong.

Purely speculating here, but I would say that marketing the world cup of any sport that people are not already interested in is remarkably difficult.

I don't think holding a tournament in Helsinki has ever had any effect on my sports viewing, and there's been a lot over the years.

(Of course the US sporting world is quite different in many ways to how things to here in Europe, so I'm surely not the best person to make educated guesses about this.)

[BigTuna]

Originally Posted by transplant99

What?

They just shelled out 10 BILLION dollars to show the NHL...and they do show many games on their sports channel. (40 alone after the break and before the playoffs...likely more than any Canadian network)

Strange comment.

I meant during the Olympics.

[BigTuna]

Originally Posted by T@T

How is it Dreger can report something about the league that even they don't know the answer too?

He's talked to the owners. They are not happy about this.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by BigTuna

He's talked to the owners. They are not happy about this.

They're never happy about it. It's meaningless at this point.