Agree to disagree, Gryba was a head first hit in my opinion.
Eller probably doesn't do a 180 if Gryba catches him with his body. I'm not saying there was intent to injure, I'm just saying that in the past we have seen guys suspended for hits to the head.
Stupid play by Diaz, and if you're Gryba you can't pass up a chance to hit a guy in that scenario or you'll wind up on the bench pretty quick. Unfortunate outcome as it looked like Eller turned up the ice just as he got the puck, and that changed Gryba's angle on the hit which made him clip Eller's head instead of getting all body.
Even if the head was contacted, that's allowed. As long as it's not from the blind side, which it wasn't.
How can you have an opinion like that when there's video evidence? Head was NOT first. That's a fact.
Just because you believe it was not head first, doesn't make it fact. At no point have I said everyone else is wrong, I was just stating my opinion on the issue. In my opinion the angles of the video replay aren't clear enough to change my mind on the issue.
I feel that if Gryba did hit Eller body on body Eller would not have spun like he did, he would have been knocked back and that is what I am basing my opinion on. I believe the last second change in direction Eller did altered the angle of the hit Gryba was going to deliver and it caused him to miss Ellers body and clip his head (first) with possible hip contact after the hit to the head.
Edit: In the video you posted I see that both players are leaning slightly forward, you can see Eller's head in contact with Gryba's shoulder. With both players leaning forward Gryba and Ellers hips would not be in contact with eachother until after the initial head contact.
Last edited by Hockeyguy15; 05-03-2013 at 08:25 AM.
I'm a Sens fan, and after seeing the hit multiple times, and in slow motion, I was mad about the penalty call. Who's ever heard of 5 and a game for interference? But I can't blame the refs for the call on the ice. You've got a guy lying in a heap out cold, blood everywhere (all from Eller hitting the ice by the looks of it). What else could they do but call the major?
It's in the rule book, actually. And the penalty is designed for plays just like this. If an injury results from what would otherwise be a clean hit, except the player doesn't have the puck, it's five and a game for interference.
Of course, the penalty also covers the "oh crap, someone's hurt and I can't think of another penalty call" scenario too, which is probably where this one comes from. It also covers "oh crap. I didn't see the play, but someone's hurt and the nearest guy MUST have done something illegal" - that you'll see somewhat frequently in Junior A.
"socially acceptable thing to do was to allow Eller to skate by. That's not how the game is played at any level". What a load of crap. Montreal was in full-scale track meet mode that period, and Gryba should have allowed Eller to blow by him on the break? Any coach in the league would sanction that hit.
I agree with you, however I actually interpreted Dreger's tweet differently. Whether true or not, I thought he was saying the socially acceptable thing to do was to allow Eller to skate by BUT that's not how the game is played at any level...meaning nobody playing competitive hockey should pass up that hit.
If not, then wow Dreger, you're an idiot.
Now that I think about it, I think you're right. Thanks for that as I actually thought I agreed with Dreger's comment but I definitely don't. Goof.
Worth watching. Not saying Frasier is the be all, end all, but a good explanation nonetheless.
A moment before they say "contact is made here" you can see that Ellers head snaps back before the rest of his body moves. It looks like an unintentional clip to the head to me. You can't really see it from other angles, but how else does his head snap back like that unless it makes contact with something?
Ah I see they address it. Don't really agree with what they have to say though.
Location: Wondering when # became hashtag and not a number sign.
Exp:
If you take the emotion out of things, step back and watch the hit again, and try to ignore the results (broken face, concussion and leaking blood like a water main break) then there is only one logical conclusion that takes all "opinions" out of the equation and leaves the only determination that one can come to.
It was a clean hockey hit, with unfortunate consequences.
There should not even have been a penalty assessed in fact, but I understand how that happened in the heat of the moment.
there will be no suspension, nor should there be, as that would be a defacto change in the rules of the game. People forget that hockey is a violent and dangerous game at times but that's a huge part of its beauty as well. Open ice hits like that are becoming rarer and rarer unfortunately, but that doesnt mean they are not an integral part of the fabric of what happens on the ice.
Hope Eller is OK and makes a speedy recovery, and I still think that the Habs win the series....but all of that stuff has nothing to do with a clean, hard and very nice hockey play by Gryba.
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I agree with you, however I actually interpreted Dreger's tweet differently. Whether true or not, I thought he was saying the socially acceptable thing to do was to allow Eller to skate by BUT that's not how the game is played at any level...meaning nobody playing competitive hockey should pass up that hit.
If not, then wow Dreger, you're an idiot.
Now that I think about it, I think you're right. Thanks for that as I actually thought I agreed with Dreger's comment but I definitely don't. Goof.
Your first opinion or Dreger's tweet was correct. Dreger was stating that letting the guy go free is simply not how the game of hockey is played at any level.
Dreger is saying that the "Socially acceptable" thing to do is never done, and never should be done. It would be "socially acceptable" in that a guy wouldn't have been injured on the play.
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Your first opinion or Dreger's tweet was correct. Dreger was stating that letting the guy go free is simply not how the game of hockey is played at any level.
Dreger is saying that the "Socially acceptable" thing to do is never done, and never should be done. It would be "socially acceptable" in that a guy wouldn't have been injured on the play.
I see that now that some others have called him out on the original tweet. He certainly didn't make it clear in the original message, he needed to put a "but" in there.
A moment before they say "contact is made here" you can see that Ellers head snaps back before the rest of his body moves. It looks like an unintentional clip to the head to me. You can't really see it from other angles, but how else does his head snap back like that unless it makes contact with something?
You don't watch the Canucks much, do you?
(Not that I am accusing Eller of embellishment in this case.)
Just because you believe it was not head first, doesn't make it fact. At no point have I said everyone else is wrong, I was just stating my opinion on the issue. In my opinion the angles of the video replay aren't clear enough to change my mind on the issue.
I feel that if Gryba did hit Eller body on body Eller would not have spun like he did, he would have been knocked back and that is what I am basing my opinion on. I believe the last second change in direction Eller did altered the angle of the hit Gryba was going to deliver and it caused him to miss Ellers body and clip his head (first) with possible hip contact after the hit to the head.
Edit: In the video you posted I see that both players are leaning slightly forward, you can see Eller's head in contact with Gryba's shoulder. With both players leaning forward Gryba and Ellers hips would not be in contact with eachother until after the initial head contact.
What? You do understand that body on body doesn't mean a head on collision, right? You can clip someone across the chest at an angle, which is exactly what happened here, and the result is that the force of the collision turns the body.
His shoulder is squarely planted in his chest, i have no idea why you're even talking about his hip.
A moment before they say "contact is made here" you can see that Ellers head snaps back before the rest of his body moves. It looks like an unintentional clip to the head to me. You can't really see it from other angles, but how else does his head snap back like that unless it makes contact with something?
Ah I see they address it. Don't really agree with what they have to say though.
What? You do understand that body on body doesn't mean a head on collision, right? You can clip someone across the chest at an angle, which is exactly what happened here, and the result is that the force of the collision turns the body.
His shoulder is squarely planted in his chest, i have no idea why you're even talking about his hip.
If you go to the 36 second mark and watch, Eller's head snaps when Gryba's shouldler makes contact with it. It it not shoulder to chest, it is shoulder to head. It's possible that the shoulder makes contact with his chest after, but the initital point of contact is his head.
Not sure what there is to argue here, if you watch the video above it's pretty obvious Gryba drives his shoulder into Eller's chest, I mean they pause it and zoom to a perfect angle.
Obviously his head whips back...its attached to his body. Clean hit, brutal result.
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Not sure what there is to argue here, if you watch the video above it's pretty obvious Gryba drives his shoulder into Eller's chest, I mean they pause it and zoom to a perfect angle.
Obviously his head whips back...its attached to his body. Clean hit, brutal result.
I see it differently. I see that his head is turned to the side, as it would if a Gryba's shoulder hit his chin. If it were whiplash Eller's head would snap back in the opposite direction of the hit, it wouldn't turn to the side like he was clipped on the chin. But then that's my opinion, just trying to explain why I see it that way since everyone seems so confused on why I have a different opinion.
If you go to the 36 second mark and watch, Eller's head snaps when Gryba's shouldler makes contact with it. It it not shoulder to chest, it is shoulder to head. It's possible that the shoulder makes contact with his chest after, but the initital point of contact is his head.
Again, it's called whiplash.
Try this experiment. Get out your camera and set up some sort of bar at chest height and run full speed into it. Take a look at the results. I guarantee you your head snaps back despite no contact being made with your head.
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Try this experiment. Get out your camera and set up some sort of bar at chest height and run full speed into it. Take a look at the results. I guarantee you your head snaps back despite no contact being made with your head.
I have never said you were wrong, I'm just trying to explain my opinion there is no need to be like that.
I outlined why I thought his head motion was different from whiplash in a post before this.
I have never said you were wrong, I'm just trying to explain my opinion there is no need to be like that.
I outlined why I thought his head motion was different from whiplash in a post before this.
I get the sense that you think that body movements are much more predictable and linear then they are, which explains your position. The way you're built, the way you brace when sensing contact, the angle of that contact and a host of other things are going to contribute to the way your body reacts.
What? You do understand that body on body doesn't mean a head on collision, right? You can clip someone across the chest at an angle, which is exactly what happened here, and the result is that the force of the collision turns the body.
