2015/2016 Barclays Premier League Thread

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

in the same matchups this year vs last, Spurs so far have 4 more points, it's not as though they have had spectacular consistency

I just don't think rebuilding in the PL, in a climate where everyone is going to get an extra 40-50m next year is going to be so easy

doing a Liverpool and falling off for ___ amount of years is going to occur more often than consistency like the top 4 was in the 2000-2010 range, I could see anywhere from 6-8 teams finishing in the top 4 in the next 5 years

it's not a given that Chelsea can spend 150m and suddenly make up 30-40 points next season, look at what happened when United spent that much, especially when all it gets you now is 1 or 2 'world class' players, who may or may not fit the league

squad building is going to be much more important going forward I think

This. And it saddens me as despite LVG's failures, he has fostered United's youth movement, and Mourinho scares me in that regard.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

This. And it saddens me as despite LVG's failures, he has fostered United's youth movement, and Mourinho scares me in that regard.

Same. He's worked for Abramovich and Perez though - neither of those were interested in youth development, but prefered to buy big names instead. At United, it'd be the first time that Mourinho is at a big club that operates that way and my hope is that Mourinho will adapt to that.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

This. And it saddens me as despite LVG's failures, he has fostered United's youth movement, and Mourinho scares me in that regard.

What, Mourinho giving away De Bruyne and Lukaku only to sign worse replacements worries you?

[SuperMatt18]

Mourinho did it with Porto - and you could argue that was one of his most successful stops.

He managed from 2002-2004 for that team and built a squad of younger players - either through the internal system or through frugal transfers. It all peaked with them winning that Champions League in 2004.

It will be interesting to see how he does in a team that strives on developing from within, while also having deep pockets to go out and spend.

But yeah the De Bruyne and Lukaku moves should be worrying.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by devo22

Same. He's worked for Abramovich and Perez though - neither of those were interested in youth development, but prefered to buy big names instead. At United, it'd be the first time that Mourinho is at a big club that operates that way and my hope is that Mourinho will adapt to that.

How'd he handle youth development in Italy & Portugal?

EDITED: I asked the question before reading Bagor's reply.

[SuperMatt18]

At Inter Milan he didn't really have to or even have the chance to foster any youth.

That team has always relied on veterans and older players and less on it's youth set up.

That team ended up winning a treble though so he was doing something right. I would also say that Mourinho probably controlled Balotelli better than many of his other managers.

[devo22]

also worth noting that there aren't a lot of youth players at Chelsea right now that are ready to step up ... Hiddink also hasn't played a lot of youngsters. Guys like Ruben Loftus-Cheek and Kenedy haven't featured more often than under Mourinho. The only one to step up under Hiddink is Bertrand Traore, but Hiddink also only started playing him because of injury concerns.

Mourinho did play Zouma a lot even as a 19/20 year old, so maybe there's hope.

[Addick]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

it's not a given that Chelsea can spend 150m and suddenly make up 30-40 points next season, look at what happened when United spent that much, especially when all it gets you now is 1 or 2 'world class' players, who may or may not fit the league

squad building is going to be much more important going forward I think

Chelsea aren't running the table but they haven't loss since December. I don't think Chelsea and City will require major surgery to get the ship moving at speed again. On the other hand, United's path isn't as easy and they could well struggle next season to keep pace with the contenders. However, I can see them pulling it off.

[d_phaneuf]

to be fair to Jose's youth setup at Chelsea, while he didn't build the youth team at home, he did help build Vitesse while he was at Chelsea

[d_phaneuf]

The United youth set up thing is really strange, it's not something that should be an issue since they basically print money but I remember a report in january or something that they spend a third of what City do, and less than half of what Chelsea/Spurs/Arsenal do

[Locke]

Has there been any confirmation on the 'pre-contract agreement?'

Because I still think those terms are batcrap crazy.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

The United youth set up thing is really strange, it's not something that should be an issue since they basically print money but I remember a report in january or something that they spend a third of what City do, and less than half of what Chelsea/Spurs/Arsenal do

well the beauty of the emergence of guys like Rashford and Borthwick-Jackson this season is that the English press had spent months arguing how bad Uniteds youth setup is in comparison to other teams ... especially City. Yet now United continue to produce good young players and are about to win the U21 championship. No doubt they are a bit behind City and others when it comes to the younger age groups, but it'll take a couple of years for that to have an effect on the first team. In the 17-20 age group, United are still doing fine thanks to people like Warren Joyce and Nicky Butt.

[Barnet Flame]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Spurs problem will be the same old problem. Trying to retain their players.

I don't know about that. The paradigm has shifted. The TV contract means there is less need to shift their big players and they have a Manager that players are going to likely want to play for.

The big question is whether they can maintain a similar league position while making a credible go at the CL.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

the idea that Spurs are a 'selling club' is lazy fallacy

they are a selling club to Real Madrid, so is the rest of Europe

they haven't lost a player to an English team they wanted to keep since Berbatov 5 years ago to Man United and since then Levy has hold the supporters trust group they won't sell their players to their rivals that they want to keep anymore, i.e wont strengthen their rivals

Apart from Bale, who of interest could they have lost to one of the big four in the last 5 years?

Name me a top player since Hoddle that they have managed to retain. Berbatov, Campbell, Sheringham, Bale all left when they got the chance.

And Levy can say all he wants to supporter's groups (really, what else is he going to say) but he needs to start thinking about upping the wage structure or players are going to jump ship for more salary, and more ambition as has already happened on his watch, multiple times. He needs to prove Sheringham wrong and that they do indeed have ambition.

Will be interesting to see how he responds once offers come in for Kane and Dele Alli and they start realizing they could triple their money elsewhere.

We'll see.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Apart from Bale, who of interest could they have lost to one of the big four in the last 5 years?

Luka Modric.

[d_phaneuf]

Modric who they refused to sell the year earlier to Chelsea, like Levy said they wouldnt

also because of the tv money again, the wages aren't a concern

Spurs wage cap when Berba left was 60k per week, Bale was on 120k when he left, if he had stayed he'd be higher now

Levy has always spent within Spurs means to not lose money, he's not cheap, they just run a financially viable model, as the revenue goes up so have the wages

[Bagor]

Who wanted out ... badly to Chelsea and openly stated it

Only because Levy (according to Modric) reneged on a gentleman's agreement that they had.

Tottenham Hotspur remain adamant that Luka Modric will not be allowed to leave this summer and have strongly denied the player's claims that Daniel Levy, the White Hart Lane chairman, has broken a gentleman's agreement with the Croatian. In the latest episode of a transfer saga that has become increasingly acrimonious since Modric stated his desire to join Chelsea last month, the 25-year-old midfielder has accused Levy of threatening to make him "sit in the stands" if he refuses to accept the club's stance.
Modric, who said Levy had given a "twisted account" of their meeting at the ground last Wednesday, also claimed that the Spurs chairman had reneged on a promise he made 12 months ago in relation to any future interest from a "bigger club".
"I reminded the chairman of our gentleman's agreement when we were in Dubrovnik last summer and I agreed a contract extension with Tottenham," Modric told Sportske Novosti. "At that time, I had an open chat with Levy – that if a bigger club came in with a concrete offer, we would consider it and agree the best solution for all concerned. Now Levy doesn't want to talk to me and said there is no possibility that I can leave Spurs. He threatened me – he said if I didn't accept the club's stance, they would make me sit on the bench or in the stands."
"There is no doubt that Chelsea want me – they sent a concrete offer to Tottenham," Modric said. "I know that the new Chelsea boss [André Villas-Boas] said he wants me in his team. Of course I am flattered by this interest in me – it's a club that all players dream of joining, fighting for every competition available."

http://www.theguardian.com/football/...otspur-chelsea


Makes you wonder what Bale would have to say if he didn't have a gag order on him.

[d_phaneuf]

that gag order was in 2 other contracts that marca leaked, I think it's standard

Bale has said nothing but positive things since he left the club, and he signed a new contract 6 months before he was transferred, I imagine they worked out a deal then for the Madrid stuff in the summer

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

Modric who they refused to sell the year earlier to Chelsea, like Levy said they wouldnt

also because of the tv money again, the wages aren't a concern

Spurs wage cap when Berba left was 60k per week, Bale was on 120k when he left, if he had stayed he'd be higher now

Levy has always spent within Spurs means to not lose money, he's not cheap, they just run a financially viable model, as the revenue goes up so have the wages

Point is with Modric, they couldn't keep him. He wanted out. Bale wanted out. Sheringham wanted out. Campbell wanted out. They all wanted out.

There's something going on that they all want out.

And you can say all you want about the tv money and the wages aren't a concern but every club gets the tv money and their wages are going up also. Kane's going to be looking at Sterling every time he goes to an England camp with the knowledge that he earns close to x5 his wages. Don't kid yourself that that counts for nothing.

[d_phaneuf]

I dont get the point though, you said we will see when a top 4 club wanted a spurs player, there's an example of one and he didnt leave

players ask to leave clubs all the time, Di Maria wanted to leave United last summer does that make them a selling club?

if Rooney was still good enough to complain about it wouldn't he be asking the club to surround him with talent or sell him?

Arsenal sold RVP and Cesc, are they a selling club?

Liverpool with Suarez are they a selling club?