The Energy Transition and technologies

[Geraldsh]

Then why is our New Democratic Party so ineffective?

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by Geraldsh

Then why is our New Democratic Party so ineffective?

Gotta give them some time. New parties need to be able to build up their base.

[Fuzz]

The federal nuclear safety regulator has authorized construction of an American small modular reactor (SMR) at the Darlington Nuclear Generating Station in Clarington, Ont., a crucial milestone for a project that has garnered worldwide attention.

The Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission granted the license to Ontario Power Generation on Friday for its Darlington New Nuclear Project. OPG has said it will finish building the first 327-megawatt reactor by the end of 2028, and begin supplying electricity to the province’s grid the following year. The reactor’s cost has not been disclosed publicly, but estimates suggest it could be several billion dollars.

The BWRX-300 is being designed by Wilmington, N.C.-based GE-Hitachi Nuclear Energy, a leading American reactor vendor. Its construction would make Canada more reliant on U.S. suppliers for enriched uranium fuel and other critical inputs at a moment when relations between the two countries are rapidly deteriorating.

OPG’s pivot to SMRs means the plant will generate far less power than originally envisioned. Under an earlier plan the site was licensed for up to 4,800 megawatts, whereas the BWRX-300s would possess a quarter of that capacity. (According to rough industry estimates, a single BWRX-300 could meet electricity demand from a city the size of Markham or Vaughan, Ont.)

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busi...dular-reactor/

Lots of interesting stuff here. Perhaps we should enrich our own uranium under the guise of powering these plants, that could then be leveraged into weapons if needed.

Will be interesting to see what the ultimate cost per MW is on these, and if they can actually build them so much quicker than full size plants.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Lots of interesting stuff here. Perhaps we should enrich our own uranium under the guise of powering these plants, that could then be leveraged into weapons if needed.

It's too bad we have government policy against building nuclear weapons not to mention the nuclear proliferation treaty prevents us from developing or buying any nukes.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

It's too bad we have government policy against building nuclear weapons not to mention the nuclear proliferation treaty prevents us from developing or buying any nukes.

Government policy can change, and nobody gives a #### about international treaties anymore. And there are provisions to leave the treaty if a nation has concerns and needs to do it.

[Fuzz]

The Ontario government approved Ontario Power Generation's plan to spend $7.7-billion to construct the first small modular reactor in a G7 country – a price far greater than independent observers deem necessary to spark widespread adoption.

On Thursday, the government announced its wholly-owned utility can spend $6.1-billion to build the first BWRX-300 reactor adjacent to OPG's existing Darlington Nuclear Generating Station. In addition, it can spend another $1.6-billion on common infrastructure such as administrative buildings and cooling water tunnels the new reactor will share with three additional BWRX-300s to be built later.

Those remaining units are expected to cost substantially less: all told, the 1,200-megawatt plant's estimated cost is $20.9-billion, expressed in 2024 dollars and including interest charges and contingencies.

Those costs are far higher than what independent observers argue are necessary for widespread adoption of SMRs. For comparison, a recently-completed 377-megawatt natural gas-fired power station in Saskatchewan cost $825-million.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busi...ly-21-billion/


Uhh...okay this is starting to sound like SMR's aren't really a cheap solution either.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busi...ly-21-billion/


Uhh...okay this is starting to sound like SMR's aren't really a cheap solution either.

These will be amonghe first SMRs to be constructed. Once they are into manufacturing these rather than designing these you would expect costs to come down dramatically.

But you shouldn’t compare this to unabated gas power or solar without backup. CCS doubles the cost of that gas generation plant and if you need to build a winter backup to solar that raises its cost significantly. We should also add increased grid transmission costs to the solar bucket as well.

So 16mm per MW versus 5mm per MW for CCS gas isn’t terrible for a first of technology. A factor of 4 reduction makes it credible for base load power.

[opendoor]

I'm kind of skeptical that there will be enough demand for production of SMRs to really introduce huge economies of scale. It's not like cars or something where you can build millions of them. Even something as simple as a house isn't any cheaper to build in a plant and then assemble on-site vs. building from scratch.

By their nature, SMRs are starting from behind because building one large thing is generally cheaper than building several small things to produce the same output. So they really need to create huge efficiencies to be viable, but it seems like that's mostly speculative at this point.

I don't know, maybe there are other examples of industries doing that, but I'm having trouble thinking of any. Like, would building 1,000 smaller ships in a factory be cheaper than building a 10 huge freighters in a shipyard per ton?

[Fuzz]

I think this particular SMR project is going to be compared to regular reactors. Do you build 6 of these or full size reactor? Their time scale seems very short compared to full size, so we will have to see, but given the initial cost estimate(rarely even close with nuclear) being so high, I'd also be surprised if they hit anything close to their dates. I get this is also a bit of a learning experience, but it is going to guide the industry going forward, and if it goes forward.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by opendoor

I'm kind of skeptical that there will be enough demand for production of SMRs to really introduce huge economies of scale. It's not like cars or something where you can build millions of them. Even something as simple as a house isn't any cheaper to build in a plant and then assemble on-site vs. building from scratch.

By their nature, SMRs are starting from behind because building one large thing is generally cheaper than building several small things to produce the same output. So they really need to create huge efficiencies to be viable, but it seems like that's mostly speculative at this point.

I don't know, maybe there are other examples of industries doing that, but I'm having trouble thinking of any. Like, would building 1,000 smaller ships in a factory be cheaper than building a 10 huge freighters in a shipyard per ton?

Liberty ships? I think if you scale the production of anything sufficiently it gets way cheaper.

I agree it's a question of how far down the learning curve you can get - if you're going to build 1000+ of the same design then I think SMR has a decent chance. 50 then not so much.

[DoubleK]

I'm surprised to see that SNC-Lavalin got the engineering for this.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

I'm surprised to see that SNC-Lavalin got the engineering for this.

I take back my enthusiasm

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

I'm surprised to see that SNC-Lavalin got the engineering for this.

Name changes do amazing things for the goldfish population.

[Faust]

MADE-IN-CANADA FUSION BREAKTHROUGH COULD CHANGE THE FUTURE OF GLOBAL ENERGY:

https://thedebrief.org/made-in-canad...global-energy/

Canada breaks world record with 600 million neutrons per second , bringing nuclear fusion closer:

https://glassalmanac.com/canada-brea...oogle_vignette

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by Wolven

Name changes do amazing things for the goldfish population.

There isn't really another option if they wanted a Canadian firm to do the engineering. Neither Stantec or WSP have that capability.