This is a rebuild

[browntrout]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

My problem with the Flames thinking they could acquire an elite long-term piece (centre or a defenceman) by trading a couple of late 1st round picks or other similarly valued trade chips is that the team that is giving up on that 22-24 year old thinks that he won't become that elite player. I don't know if I believe that the Flames think they can acquire a new core this way.

That's not to say you can't go out and win trades, but I think the Flames need to have faith in their amateur scouts. This is an organization that should be approaching draft capital similar to Carolina. This team should truly try to pick as many times over the next two to three drafts as possible.

If you can't have that kind of faith in your scouts to rely on them in times like these, nothing really matters then.

The team may tinker, but they are not going to trade their own first round picks or the Vegas one, they know they are going to be bad, they won't risk potentially trading away a lottery ticket that ends up going first overall....that would be suicide and fans would revolt if they traded a first overall pick

[InternationalVillager]

lol @ anyone thinking this team isn't capable of bottoming out if they get rid of Markstrom.

See the demolition job by Panthers and Hurricanes only likely to be continued by the Avs and Knights later this week.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

No it isn't, there are worse rosters for sure. I think this is just the rebuild crowd in denial wanting the team to bottom out fully. I don't see it happening.

Looking at the pure talent I find it hard to find 5 worse teams on paper

Anahiem , Chicago and SJ I would expect to all be in bottom 5

Everyone else looks as good or better then Calgary IMO and has younger players likely to keep improving

Which other 2 teams do you think will be worse than the Flames next year ? Columbus and Phoenix ? Maybe ?

A super hot Markstrum could potentially steal enough wins to vault us into the 6-7 range , but I suspect he’s gone before next year

[Backstop]

Probably already been said, but Im in agreement with anyone saying it's time to start from scratch with our Goalie coaching staff as part of the rebuild.


When you can argue it has not been terrible just as easily as arguing it has not been great, thats when the mediocrity merits new blood top to bottom.



Honorary mention to our Power Play staff.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Looking at the pure talent I find it hard to find 5 worse teams on paper

Anahiem , Chicago and SJ I would expect to all be in bottom 5

Everyone else looks as good or better then Calgary IMO and has younger players likely to keep improving

Which other 2 teams do you think will be worse than the Flames next year ? Columbus and Phoenix ? Maybe ?

A super hot Markstrum could potentially steal enough wins to vault us into the 6-7 range , but I suspect he’s gone before next year

And yet the team is like 8 games over .500 since their bad start. Unless they overhaul their teams somehow I think Anaheim, Arizona, Chicago, Columbus, Minnesota, Montreal, Philadelphia, San Jose, St Louis, Seattle, and Washington all have worse lineups than we will.

[Ba'alzamon]

[Burning Beard]

That's kinda the thing with rebuilds. You never know how long they take due to lady luck. Strike big on some mid round picks while having a decent supporting cast and you can be done.

Flounder a couple of top picks and lose the supporting talent and you are looking at a long one.

I've been worried about a full, on-purpose tank because as we are all aware, the Flames have no luck. Our top pick never panned the way the club imagined and is now playing elsewhere. Our other top players forced their way out. I'm just really hoping Conroy can change that luck and draft well and get the franchise back on track ASAP.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

And yet the team is like 8 games over .500 since their bad start. Unless they overhaul their teams somehow I think Anaheim, Arizona, Chicago, Columbus, Minnesota, Montreal, Philadelphia, San Jose, St Louis, Seattle, and Washington all have worse lineups than we will.

You should be judging them after the trade deadline though because that's the team moving forward. Out of all the teams you listed the only one I see being worse for sure is San Jose. All of those other teams either have more or equal talent. The Flames being bottom 5 next year seems like a real possibility if nothing drastic changes.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Hackey

You should be judging them after the trade deadline though because that's the team moving forward. Out of all the teams you listed the only one I see being worse for sure is San Jose. All of those other teams either have more or equal talent. The Flames being bottom 5 next year seems like a real possibility if nothing drastic changes.

No,you are seeing what you want to see because you want the team to go full tank. If you think a team like Chicago has more or equal talent then either you are a crappy judge of talent or as I said, you are just seeing what you want to see.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

No,you are seeing what you want to see because you want the team to go full tank. If you think a team like Chicago has more or equal talent then either you are a crappy judge of talent or as I said, you are just seeing what you want to see.

Chicago, Anaheim and San Jose are awful. Hard to imagine any of those teams finishing above the Flames unless the Flames make more big trades plural in the offseason. Hard to imagine Blue Jackets being better either. I have them beteeen 5-8, I have a hard time finding 8 teams that I think will be worse than the Flames next year. I am fine with that, being the 12th worst team next year would be a nightmare scenario thanks BT’s trade.

[dissentowner]

I see the Flames being about where they are this year. I am absolutely not opposed to the team finishing bottom 5, not at all. I just don't think it will happen because I expect this team to add at least a couple key young pieces in the offseason.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I see the Flames being about where they are this year. I am absolutely not opposed to the team finishing bottom 5, not at all. I just don't think it will happen because I expect this team to add at least a couple key young pieces in the offseason.

Imagine drafting 27th overall next year or worse because the Flames were just barely good enough because of some offseason adds to end up around where we are now in the standings. That is the stuff of Flames nightmares.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

No,you are seeing what you want to see because you want the team to go full tank. If you think a team like Chicago has more or equal talent then either you are a crappy judge of talent or as I said, you are just seeing what you want to see.

They’re going to have Bedard, (likely) Celebrini, and also have a massive amount of cap space and a pretty solid young group of players.

Blackhawks will be a better team next year.

This is how things happen.

As far as being where they are this year, I think we’re about to get a pretty good indication of just how bad this team now is down the stretch. I’d expect us to be drafting 8th-11th this year.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Imagine drafting 27th overall next year or worse because the Flames were just barely good enough because of some offseason adds to end up around where we are now in the standings. That is the stuff of Flames nightmares.

Or imagine drafting around 27th overall next year because the team turned the corner quickly and their own pick was in the early to mid 20's. Not everything is going to turn out worst case scenario. We will have to wait and see.

[activeStick]

So many things are going to factor into what the Flames do. I can see them getting to work after the lottery takes place and they see where they'll be picking. If there's a group of players on their list they anticipate to be available at that spot that their scouts believe can be that 1st line center or top pair defenceman, they'll keep the pick, but if the scouts think they peak as a 2nd line guy or 2nd pair D (even if it's a 9th overall), they'll start working with other teams they already have in mind and see if there's an interest in sending the players already on Calgary's radar in the 22-24 year old range for that 1st+.

And then the Flames will also be thinking about next year's 1st and it potentially going to Montreal if the pick ends up being 11th overall or lower and what the hell the best plan is there. Poor Conroy is going to be insanely busy again, very soon.

[NewFan]

Let's see. If it's rebuild, after how many years we would have a good team that can compete in the playoffs multiple years?
Minimum after 3 season?
So what future core players we have at the moment?

Wolf - Core, starting Goalie
Yegorov, Sergeyev - Backup

Defence
Kylington, Weegar, Andersson - Top 4 D
Morin, Brzustewicz, Poirier - Top 4 D Future
Solovyov, Kuznitsov, Grushnikov, Miromanov, Okhotyuk, Jurmo, Hurtig - Top 6 potential

Forward
Coronato, Zary, Honzek, Pelletier, Pospisil - Top 6?
Lipinski, Bell, Jones, Suniev - Middle 6?
Klapka, Jones, Ronni, Schwindt, Kerins, Damiani, Hunt, Bishop, Stromgren, Nikolaev, Ciona - Bottom 6?

If the bolded players become permanent players for us after 3 years, it looks like, Conroy and management have a lots of work to find and develop remaining players including to find franchise star players.
We really need a couple of top 3 picks to find top line and top pairing D, and find 2-3 later picks that become part of core players.

[GreenLantern2814]

^^^I’m optimistic about Wolf, but he’s far from a core piece at this point.

The defense looks to an area of strength, as is usually the case for Calgary. They have a lot of guys who look like they could take a regular shift in the NHL.

Forwards, I would go so far as to say that only Zary so far looks like he could be a bonafide first line player. I get Jordan Eberle vibes from him.

Everyone else seems like 2nd-line-at-best.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

No,you are seeing what you want to see because you want the team to go full tank. If you think a team like Chicago has more or equal talent then either you are a crappy judge of talent or as I said, you are just seeing what you want to see.

Don't bother...the usual suspects called me a homer for not saying they were a bottom five team the Summer before they last won the division title.
The Flames just played Tampa, Florida, Carolina, with Zary and pops out...with 3 new D and no practice time.
They won ONE of them, did we expect them to win 2 or 3? like seriously?

Best thing to do is get some sucker to bet you that the Flames will be 5th or worse and cash in.

Last summer I was the biggest idiot on CP because I dared to say the Penguins wouldn't get 95 points lol. That bet was a laugher

I also see that Markstom is gone but we are getting nothing back in some of these predictions? IF they trade Markstom there will be a quality young NHLer coming the other way.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

They’re going to have Bedard, (likely) Celebrini, and also have a massive amount of cap space and a pretty solid young group of players.

The 32nd overall team in the standings has a 25.5% chance of ending up with the 1st overall pick.

Chicago isn't even a lock to finish 32nd. They're tied with the Sharks, who have two games in hand but are quite capable of blowing them both.

It is most probable that Celebrini doesn't go to Chicago.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

That argument is flawed regarding Tampa
Although they managed to get Kuch, Vas and Point lower , they started the build with Stamkos and Hedman. Two top foundation picks

Nah, they drafted Stamkos and Hedman in 08 and 09. If that was a rebuild, it flopped and saw them once again drafting top 3 four years later (which they blew by drafting Drouin). They were still rockin' with older players like Vinnie LeCav, MSL, Brewer, by then, so I'm not sure how it was even a rebuild. Do most rebuilds take 10 years?

It was the emergence of Kucherov, Point and Vasilevsky that pushed them to the top.