[PGT] Flames 2 Blues 5

[N-E-B]

At the end of the day, the Flames are beating themselves. Way too many stupid penalties. The good thing is that the problems the team is having are very fixable. All will be good, the Flames aren't going to win every game. They're going to lose more games, and it's not because they're terrible or because Gulutzan can't take them to the next level. The players just have to stop shooting themselves in the foot.

[FBI]

Versteeg is frustrating the hell out of me on the PP.
he only has one move and nothing else except turnovers.

[Party Elephant]

Versteeg has not looked very strong on the puck these last few games. He seems to be losing a lot of board battles and giving up possession.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by FireGilbert

and didn't let in any bad ones.

I've seen alot worse but the third one was bad. I thought with proper positioning he should have had the first and fourth one too but that third one was weak.

[868904]

Originally Posted by GoJetsGo

This is a brutal take.

Hamilton was excellent last year. While he's struggled so far this year, it's certainly not indicative of suggesting "that's why Boston game up on him".

He's a stud, and has all the tools to be a #1 d-man.

He hasn't hit his stride this year but that's no reason to suggest this is why Boston gave up on him.

Just a bizarre take to jump to that negative of a conclusion.

No he put up points and if you are a defenseman fans will overlook your defensive shortcomings especially if you are young. He wasn't and has never been good defensively, which is fine as long as he puts up points, but don't suggest that he is some defensive stud. He lacks hockey sense in the defensive zone, makes terrible reads and dumb decisions but the physical tools are tantalizing.

Why is it wrong to suggest the Bruins gave upon him? They saw enough to know he wasn't the complete package. He is still a good player just not very good in his own end. His struggles to begin last year are well documented, his better play in the second half had as much to do with being partnered with Gio then him figuring things out. Every game Gio is bailing Hamilton out and it's no coincidence that Brodie no longer looks all world since not being paired with Gio.

You are right that he has all the tools to be a number one, the physical tools but he lacks the head and the hockey sense to take that step from a 2 or 3 to a number 1. I just don't see it in him but I'd love to be proven wrong.

[crapshoot]

I thought it was a pretty good game for the Flames, at least considering it was the second game of a b2b on the road. They came out really strong and fell away at the end, which is pretty common in that situation. I thought they controlled the game for long stretches, and got sunk by bad PK, a horrible giveaway and a couple of pretty soft goals Läck should have had.

The big issue for me remains that they can't score goals and they really need to get out of that funk immediately. 0 goals from the bottom six game after game wont cut it, so someone seriously needs to bury one soon. It's not like there aren't any chances, Lazar for example has had about a million fantastic scoring chances, many of them set up by Bennett, but can't even get his shots on goal anymore. It has got to stop at some point, and it better be real soon.

[nemanja2306]

Wow, a lot koolaid drinking on this forum.

Fact of the matter is, they lost. Since starting the season 3-1, the Flames are 2-4. You can try and spin it any way you want, that is not good. Especially since the Flames are going into 'win now' mode. More should be expected and not be satisfied with a 5-5 record and moral vicotries. That is just Oilers-esque. And most of the wins we have are because of Smith who carried the team. If you rely on your goalie to win you games, you won't be successful.

Many people here defend Gulutzan, but I have yet to see why people think he's a good coach? Because of a fluke 10 game run last year? If you go back to last year, most of those came against non playoff teams and due to an easy schedule.

Currently, we have 10 points. Last year at this point, we had 9. Monahan carrying an injury, Gaudreau missed training camp, new coach and new system, Elliott ,Wideman...those were all excuses last year (and some of them were valid). Since then, we have added a legitimate #1 goalie and a top 4 d-man, Gaudreau and Monahan are started out hot unlike last year and we only have 1 point more? That is brutal.

[robaur]

one of those nights of heavy drinking that I wished we had Crosby....

[crapshoot]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

Wow, a lot koolaid drinking on this forum.

Fact of the matter is, they lost. Since starting the season 3-1, the Flames are 2-4. You can try and spin it any way you want, that is not good. Especially since the Flames are going into 'win now' mode. More should be expected and not be satisfied with a 5-5 record and moral vicotries. That is just Oilers-esque. And most of the wins we have are because of Smith who carried the team. If you rely on your goalie to win you games, you won't be successful.

Many people here defend Gulutzan, but I have yet to see why people think he's a good coach? Because of a fluke 10 game run last year? If you go back to last year, most of those came against non playoff teams and due to an easy schedule.

Currently, we have 10 points. Last year at this point, we had 9. Monahan carrying an injury, Gaudreau missed training camp, new coach and new system, Elliott ,Wideman...those were all excuses last year (and some of them were valid). Since then, we have added a legitimate #1 goalie and a top 4 d-man, Gaudreau and Monahan are started out hot unlike last year and we only have 1 point more? That is brutal.

Yeah? Well, there is basically no separation in the standings yet, there is no hole to dig out of. Last year the team was playing from behind from the very start, and even if they got off to a poor start, the big drop that really got the team in the hole was from game 12 to 16. Hopefully they can avoid any 4 game losing streaks in the upcoming weeks, and then I guess we'll see how it looks in mid november.

[gunnner]

Versteeg was pretty hot and cold last year also. He finished strong so thats what we all remember., but had an awful stretch not long before also. I dont think his body holds up well for 82 games, he could benefit from some nights off.

Great points in this thread about the PP. That setup isnt working anymore, the other team has adjusted and is closing off both the shooting lane and the monahan redirect as soon as Versteeg gets the puck. time for a new formation with Hamilton and Brodie both on and Johnny on his offwing halfwall setting up Hamilton for a one timer.

[longsuffering]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

I'm waiting still for this improved D to soundly shut down an opposing team.

(Anaheim yeah some credit, but they still peppered Smith)

Not saying they won't get there. But it's been a few weeks and I'd like to start to see it.

It's impossible for 2 defensemen to shut down 5 players. While our D have to win more battles in the corners and behind the net and learn to make a good outlet pass, the forwards have to play better positionally. I don't quite understand our system. Our forwards don't cover the points and don't cover the boards to receive the ring around pass.

[nemanja2306]

Originally Posted by crapshoot

Yeah? Well, there is basically no separation in the standings yet, there is no hole to dig out of. Last year the team was playing from behind from the very start, and even if they got off to a poor start, the big drop that really got the team in the hole was from game 12 to 16. Hopefully they can avoid any 4 game losing streaks in the upcoming weeks, and then I guess we'll see how it looks in mid november.

A legit contender doesn't have to dig themselves out of any holes. Like I said, at this point, we're at the exact same spot we were in last year. Considering Monahan, Gaudreau and Brodie (or 3 most important players ,minus Gio) are playing well, which wasn't the case last year, the additions of Stone and Hamonic on the backend, Smith in goal, no Wideman, this start should be disappointing because it's near identical to last year.

While it's early, yes, I expected more out of this group at this stage of the season.

[crapshoot]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

A legit contender doesn't have to dig themselves out of any holes. Like I said, at this point, we're at the exact same spot we were in last year. Considering Monahan, Gaudreau and Brodie (or 3 most important players ,minus Gio) are playing well, which wasn't the case last year, the additions of Stone and Hamonic on the backend, Smith in goal, no Wideman, this start should be disappointing because it's near identical to last year.

While it's early, yes, I expected more out of this group at this stage of the season.

I agree with you, 5-5 is not what I hoped for either. But at this stage I'm most disappointed in the losses against Edmonton and Ottawa. Over the last handful of games the team has started to control the play more and are trending in the right direction, at least from my point of view. They should have won against Minnesota, and they could very well have won against the Blues as they were in no way outplayed, even though they couldn't quite muster a good enough effort in the third.

With a bit of puck luck, better discipline and a little bit of secondary scoring they could very well have come away with a few more wins from this last string, but here we are, and I'm not worried because I think it looks like this is a team that will keep a pretty good pace through the season. I'm also saying that the optics of it all would have been very different had they managed to be 6-4 or 5-3-2 right now, Chicago has just two more loser points and are off to a pretty good start according to just about everyone, but in this sample size it's a very slight difference really. Call it kool-aid if you will, but I think this team will get it done. After all, the bottom six can't go though a full season without a point at even strenght. At least I hope...

[Flames_F.T.W]

As others have said, the PP has been a major source of frustration. Versteeg, Brodie and Gaudreau are all pass first players and its obvious because they're happy to pass it around all day long and never shoot.
What's driving me crazy is how Gio and Hamilton are never on their off wing for a one-timer. I used to marvel at Hamilton's ability to get pucks through to the net, but he has been barely shooting this year on the PP.

Disappointing that special teams have been our Achilles heel this season thus far, but it's encouraging too because that's something that can be fixed internally. Once/if we get some secondary scoring we should be a much more consistent team

[Five-hole]

If you told me we'd allow 4 PP goals and get 0 ourselves in back to back games on the road against Nashville and St Louis but still walked away with one win, I'd take it.

Then I would say that we need to fix the special teams and stop taking penalties.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by N-E-B

At the end of the day, the Flames are beating themselves. Way too many stupid penalties. The good thing is that the problems the team is having are very fixable. All will be good, the Flames aren't going to win every game. They're going to lose more games, and it's not because they're terrible or because Gulutzan can't take them to the next level. The players just have to stop shooting themselves in the foot.

Haven't Jets fans been saying the same thing for years now? It's not a streak of beating themselves. It's been happening for the better part of two seasons now. I think we just have to accept that this isn't that good of a team. They aren't getting better. This organization hasn't won it's division or had a 100 point season in over a decade and there's no sign of that changing. Sure they may make the playoffs as a bottom seed every couple of years but this team isn't even at the level of Blues or Wild mediocrity that make the playoffs annually and have 100 point seasons and win their division. It's more like Islanders mediocrity. Ten games into the season and I feel like I'm watching a re-run of last season. Lets hope this year's team has a couple of long winning streaks in them like last season because they are going to need them again.

[GoJetsGo]

Originally Posted by 868904

No he put up points and if you are a defenseman fans will overlook your defensive shortcomings especially if you are young. He wasn't and has never been good defensively

This is flat out incorrect. He looked good defensively most of last year. He and Gio were one of the best pairings in the league last season.

So for you to label him as not good defensively and state that is the reason why Boston "gave him up for magic beans" (implying they just got rid of him) is asinine.

Suggesting they wanted to move him because "he wasn't the complete package" when he was just 22 is an equally suspect take.

You can say he needs to be better and hasn't played to his potential so far this season without putting that ridiculous spin on it.

[Regorium]

Replace Brodie and Versteeg with Gio and Hamilton on PP1.

Brodie and Stone on PP2.

[kukkudo]

So the team has improved by 1 point at the same mark last year. That was with a new coach new system, and some players injured and missing training camp. IMO don't see much of an improvement compared to last year so far accept having a legit goalie now.

This seems like the same mediocre Flames team we have seen in the past and I don't know if its the players or the coach. Yes its too early but if they have a sloppy November they are going to need another flukey 10 game winning streak to save the season again.

[flambers]

Interesting game, my biggest concern with the Flames is their lack of offense.

Flames had a solid 1st period, and they could not score.

3rd & 4th lines have generated nothing in terms of offense... that has to change.