How long is the leash on Byron?

[AC]

Originally Posted by Hackey

I thought Jooris had a couple to start the year but I could be wrong.

Yeah Jooris has at least 2. Columbus and Montreal.
Mono just recently scored one vs LA.
Gaudreau had the fumble goal vs Edmonton.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Hackey

I thought Jooris had a couple to start the year but I could be wrong.

Yup, that was my thinking when I asked the question. Jooris is the only guy I could think of with more than one - and he has 2.

People scream and cry that Byron only has one breakaway goal. It's pretty funny when you think about it.

[flamesfever]

I predict he'll get rid of the "monkey(s) on his back", and start putting them in.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by flamesfever

I predict he'll get rid of the "monkey(s) on his back", and start putting them in.

I thought I had you on "ignore"?

Oops... my mistake. It's flameswin I have on ignore. For some reason I always get you guy mixed up.

Everything is good.. carry on.


P.S. I agree with you. He'll eventually start scoring again. He has talent and its just a matter of time.

[Finger Cookin]

People scream and cry that Byron only has one breakaway goal in at least eight chances (almost all where Calgary is either trailing by one or tied, so at key times) and hasn't scored a goal in 28 games while players like Baertschi, Bollig, Gaudreau, Jones, Jooris, Raymond, Stajan, and Wideman have been healthy scratches more often than Byron. It's pretty reasonable when you think about it.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

People scream and cry that Byron only has one breakaway goal in at least eight chances (almost all where Calgary is either trailing by one or tied, so at key times) and hasn't scored a goal in 28 games while players like Baertschi, Bollig, Gaudreau, Jones, Jooris, Raymond, Stajan, and Wideman have been healthy scratches more often than Byron. It's pretty reasonable when you think about it.

No, it's really not.

The reasons those other players have been scratched have nothing to do with Byron. Most of the scratches this season (not all, but most) have been the result of either not enough effort, or they were struggling and not performing their role.

Byron's effort all season has been unquestionable. And he has been consistently doing what's asked of him.

The only problem is that he isn't doing what some fans demand of him - score goals like he is a top line player.

[Finger Cookin]

Yes, it really is. Byron is struggling as much as any of those players have been at various points in the season. Byron shouldn't be immune from consideration for being scratched for a game or two just because he has a low dollar contract or because he tries really, really hard to get no results.

He doesn't need to score goals like a top line player. Could he score once every 10 games though? That would be nice.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Yes, it really is. Byron is struggling as much as any of those players have been at various points in the season. Byron shouldn't be immune from consideration for being scratched for a game or two just because he has a low dollar contract or because he tries really, really hard to get no results.

He doesn't need to score goals like a top line player. Could he score once every 10 games though? That would be nice.

He is not struggling - he is playing well. His forecheck, PK, and energy have all been great. He hits, his possession numbers are good. He is a very effective 4th liner.

And has been pointed out many times in this thread already, his production is better than average for his role.

He will break the goal drought. And when he does, he'll likely go on a roll.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

He is not struggling - he is playing well.

We disagree there. 4th worst forward on GF% relative to the team (5v5 ZS adjusted). 5th worst forward in PDO (5v5 ZS adjusted). 4th worst forward in SH% relative to the team (5v5 ZS adjusted). Top 4 in SH TOI on a PK group that is 5th worst in the league.

I don't think it's unreasonable to suggest someone one else gets a chance for a game or two while he sits out. This has worked for other players on the roster this season.

[GioforPM]

Struggling = lack of effort, not getting chances when effort is given (meaning not getting in good positions), not playing defence well, causing goals for the other side.

Not scoring but getting lots of looks = snake bitten.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Yes, it really is. Byron is struggling as much as any of those players have been at various points in the season. Byron shouldn't be immune from consideration for being scratched for a game or two just because he has a low dollar contract or because he tries really, really hard to get no results.

He doesn't need to score goals like a top line player. Could he score once every 10 games though? That would be nice.

He has 5 goals in 49 games. He is on pace for what you want out of him, 8 goals in 80 games.

[flamesfever]

His play epitomizes everything that our team is about i.e. all heart, hard working, never give up, and obviously the coaches can see this. Regardless of whether he scores on breakaways or not, IMO removing him would lessen our team.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Struggling = lack of effort, not getting chances when effort is given (meaning not getting in good positions), not playing defence well, causing goals for the other side.

Not scoring but getting lots of looks = snake bitten.

You keep defining things like it's the only possible interpretation. This is a results business. Struggling = not getting results. Trying really hard to not get results or coasting around to get results is ultimately the same thing - maybe not for a shift or two, or for a game or two. But for 28 games? Same difference.

Originally Posted by kyuss275

He has 5 goals in 49 games. He is on pace for what you want out of him, 8 goals in 80 games.

Yes, he had a little more puck luck early in the season. I was speaking of the 0 for 28, which is why the mere suggestion that he get considered for a healthy scratch has been raised. This thread didn't get made when he had 5 goals in 21 games.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

You keep defining things like it's the only possible interpretation. This is a results business. Struggling = not getting results. Trying really hard to not get results or coasting around to get results is ultimately the same thing - maybe not for a shift or two, or for a game or two. But for 28 games? Same difference.

The struggling that gets you benched is how I defined it. Not what you think. Especially on Hartley's team, and especially for a bottom 6 player.

He is getting results. Just not the ones you want.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

He is getting results. Just not the ones you want.

Successful ones? Agreed. And I apologize, I mixed you up with Enoch Root when I was talking about definitions.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Successful ones? Agreed.

Pushing the play = successful result.

Good defence = fewer goals against = successful result.

Putting other team on its heels = successful result.

Tell me exactly how sitting will help a player who is getting lots of chances, has great effort, is a good defensive player and key on the PK, and is a heart and soul guy generally get the result you want, which is to score on a breakaway.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by AC

Yeah Jooris has at least 2. Columbus and Montreal.
Mono just recently scored one vs LA.
Gaudreau had the fumble goal vs Edmonton.

Don't forget that Byron created a breakaway for Backlund his first game back.

Anyways, Byron is struggling offensively with his confidence right now, and over-thinking everything. He's not a bad puckhandler, he's not slow, and he's not wildly missing the net. Right now he can't beat NHL goaltenders but that doesn't mean the game won't start to slow down for him and come more naturally. He might be 25, but he's also only played 122 NHL games in his career. For reference Backlund who's also 25 and injury prone as anybody, has 266 under his belt.

He's practicing persistence, we ought to practice patience.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Pushing the play = successful result.

Good defence = fewer goals against = successful result.

Putting other team on its heels = successful result.

Tell me exactly how sitting will help a player who is getting lots of chances, has great effort, is a good defensive player and key on the PK, and is a heart and soul guy generally get the result you want, which is to score on a breakaway.

Again, it's not just about the breakaways. The PK isn't doing a good job of killing penalties, despite his effort. The team isn't scoring when he's on the ice, despite his heart and soul. It's about letting someone else play to see if the team results improve, and if the game or two off will also help Byron as it has helped many of the other players scratched this season.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Again, it's not just about the breakaways. The PK isn't doing a good job of killing penalties, despite his effort. The team isn't scoring when he's on the ice, despite his heart and soul. It's about letting someone else play to see if the team results improve, and if the game or two off will also help Byron as it has helped many of the other players scratched this season.

You don't really expect the team to score when a 4th liner is on the ice. If they do its a bonus. And the PK has been pretty good lately.

Which player do you want to experiment with on the PK to see if the team gets better?

[killer_carlson]

well, good for him to get a goal tonight. Let's hope that reminds him how it is done and he starts putting more in the net.