[OOT] Mens Hockey, Feb. 19 with 3 games.

[flames_fan_down_under]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

How is Kessel's role with Vancouver different from:

Sharp's role in Chicago
Bergeron's role in Boston

?


It is more than a stretch to say that Kessel is an elite player, yet players with similar roles, more success, and better health over the last 4 years - and on more successful teams - are "role players"

Kessel plays for Toronto and he is their leading scorer so I'm not sure what you're getting at.

[19Yzerman19]

He obviously meant to say Kesler. And yeah, Kesler is a supporting player. Though he's really led for USA in this tournament.

[flames_fan_down_under]

Originally Posted by 19Yzerman19

He obviously meant to say Kesler. And yeah, Kesler is a supporting player. Though he's really led for USA in this tournament.

I'm sorry but I just disagree with what you said about the USA not having elite players, having more role players that have accepted their roles because they're not the go to guys.

Oshie and Backes are first and second on their team in points.
Pacioretty leads the Habs in goals.
Kessel and JVR leads the leafs in points.
Kesler leads the Canucks in goals.
Kane obviously leads his team in points.
Pavelski leads his team in goals

How are they role players with their respective teams?

[PIMking]

[killer_carlson]

Originally Posted by flames_fan_down_under

Kessel plays for Toronto and he is their leading scorer so I'm not sure what you're getting at.

Sorry, I meant to say Kesler.

Kessel is a bonafide star in my opinion.

Sharp is leading his team in goals as well. He also has 20 more points than Kesler.

He isn't a role player. He is asked to play a role, but he isn't a role player.

[19Yzerman19]

Oshie and Backes aren't elite players and it's hilarious to suggest that they are. St. Louis is a team that wins by committee - they're deep, they're strong at both ends of the ice, and they have impenetrable team defense.
Pacioretty is a very good offensive player, but not elite. Who's "the guy" on Montreal? It's pretty obviously Subban, and if you had to pick another central figure on that team it'd be Price.
Kessel is clearly elite, so is Kane, I acknowledged that so I don't know why on Earth you'd be bringing it up again.
Kesler is a second line centre on the Canucks. He's had one elite season and hasn't reproduced it since. He is another very good player who isn't the go to guy for his club.
Pavelski is the third best centre on the Sharks, it's laughable to suggest he's in the same conversation as the Getzlafs, Tavareses, Toewses and Crosbys of the world.

I'm not saying any of these guys suck. They're excellent players, many are all-star caliber. But if the Canucks lose a series, you're not going to say "well Kesler didn't step up enough", you'll talk about the Sedins and Luongo. If the Sharks lose a series, it's not going to be because they didn't get enough from Pavelski. You'd better damn well believe the Montreal faithful are going to be quicker to blame PK Subban for any series loss than Pacioretty. These guys are excellent players. They're not superstars. When we look back in ten years, we will not remember David Backes like we remember Sakic and Forsberg and Jagr, we'll remember him like we do Jason Arnott and Bill Guerin. Very good players who were leaders on their own team but not among the greats of the sport.

[burnin_vernon]

Is there anywhere online that I can find a good highlight reel from today's games? All I've seen is the CBC one that only shows the scoring plays. Everywhere else just shows still photos.

[19Yzerman19]

One of the things that really GMG about these olympics is how hard it is to find highlights of the games. As far as I know the CBC ones on youtube are the only ones we've got.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Not really sure how Finland winning is an upset, as the commentators have suggested. This will be back to back quarterfinal exits for Russia, and I'm not sure they've looked interested in playing this entire tournament outside the US game. Russian hockey is a total mess right now, lots of elite talent but nothing close to resembling a team.

Late to this thread, but the last time we played them in the olympics was in Turin, which ended 4-0 for Finland. Goes to show that we were missing our #1, #2 and #3 centers...

We also beat them twice in the 2011 WC (again they had a star-studded roster) and I think what hurt them even more, we beat them in OT in the semifinal in Moscow in 2007. Russia was the overwhelming favourite with stars like Ovetchin, Malkin... I'm thinking little old Finland might be in their heads a bit at this point

Btw, IMO people are somewhat unfair in blaming those top Russian forwards.
Mostly I think Russians have two problems;
1) Lack of quality defensemen. It's just a fact of modern hockey that without good defensemen who can join the rush and move the puck, both your offense and defense will struggle.
2) They are badly coached. When facing a well-organized team-defense, you need to have a plan to break it apart. Just telling the players to go do it isn't very effective.

They also handle pressure poorly, but that I would pretty much rack up to poor coaching and partly to lack of defensemen. In the Russian national team, a very small group of elite forwards are basicly required and expected to do everything. They can't lose the puck because they can't trust the defense or the goalies (generally). They can't not-score, because again they can't win by shutting the other side down. Plus they don't have much in the way of shut-down energey forwards.

And when the team fails, it's all on them. It's not on the goalie who let in the softie, it's not on the coach who couldn't come up with anythign resembling a plan, it's not on the defensemen who can't hold on to the puck under pressure. It's basicly on Ovechkin and Malkin.

[sureLoss]

Chuck Gormley @ChuckGormleyCSN
Caps GM George McPhee says Alex Ovechkin's father had heart issues that required surgery. He's out of ICU and stable condition.#CapitalsTalk

Chuck Gormley @ChuckGormleyCSN
McPhee said Ovechkin's father, Mikhail, suffered the heart condition on Sunday and Alex was not informed until after Wednesday's loss to FIN