Rock Bottom

[timbit]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

People expecting Burke to perform some kind of trading magic to improve this team in any meaningful way are going to be disappointed. This is an asset poor team. That deficiency is rarely addressed by trades, which involve swapping different kinds of assets. It took years of extremely poor drafting and development to starve this franchise of assets. It will take years of strong drafting and development to restore them. The purpose of trades at this point should be to put more bullets in the chamber at the draft.

And no, that is not the Oilers approach. They never stockpiled picks to rev up a rebuild. They just sucked and expected those high picks to be their saviours.

Dead on.

[Lucifer]

So we aren't discussing the Rock's finishing move, the Rock Bottom?

[calgarywinning]

Owners impatience for a product, misdirected money which should go to drafting/scouting research and that alone. The quicker we get onto this, the sooner we can rebuild. Okay with the losses, but we don't know what the strategy is. Management and ownership seems wobbly and confused.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by 19Yzerman19

Now imagine how bad the Sabres would be WITHOUT Ryan Miller, and then realize that that's exactly how bad they'll be next year, since he'll be gone (and likely Matt Moulson too). It's going to be really hard to win the McDavid sweepstakes.

I am fine with either Eichel or McDavid, I think if the Flames get one of those two along with Ekblad this year they should be positioned to be competitive in 2017. Which is not a horrible timeline. Hopefully at least 2 of Poirer, Klimchuk, Jankowski and Gaudreau turn into top 6 players, add that to Monahan and McDavid or Eichel and you have a decent forward core. A defence of Ekblad, Brodie, Giordano and Wideman should be half decent in 2017 as well. A couple later round homeruns will be needed to ensure a very good team, but that is where the scouts hopefully continue to make some hay (like with Brodie, Gaudreau)

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

If you are going to argue against something I never said, please don't waste your time or mine by typing out a response.

I never said anything about not making deals like that. I was speaking to deliberately making no effort to improve the on-ice product so the Flames can tank for McDavid. And if Burke's strategy is "lets just suck for a few years and let #1 picks roll in", he needs to be fired right now. That is the very model up north that we have spent several years laughing at and it is incredibly hypocritical to propose it as a plan of action for the Flames.

The Flames need to be doing a lot of things right now. And if Burke is half the genius people make him out to be, fleecing a few teams in trade is part of it. And not just for picks that might help this team in three years when kids like Monahan have spent their NHL careers learning to accept losing like Hall, Eberle and RNH have. But young players who can step into the lineup and help move this organization forward.

The problem the Oilers have encountered though is that with all their draft picks, they haven't done a good job at picking good players. They've been swinging strikes numerous times with picks outside of the first overall. That's why the Oilers are in the position they're in. They've failed in the one thing they can only do in order to improve. Drafting good players. They don't have any assets they can give up in order to gain great players, that doesn't involve sending off a blue-chip prospect. And they can sign top tier free agents that would help their team now since players don't want to play for them.

They're inability to find good players in the second, third, and later rounds is what's going to keep them in the same position they are currently; until they finally start making improvements in that regard. It's the same issue others clubs like the Blue Jackets, the Thrashers/Jets, Panthers, and other clubs have/had.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by $ven27

How so?

Tell me how that Avs 2012-13 roster drafts 1st overall? Largely the same roster they have today with the addition of Mackinnon?

They saw an abbreviated season with Mackinnon at the end of it and they took a dive.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Locke

Tell me how that Avs 2012-13 roster drafts 1st overall? Largely the same roster they have today with the addition of Mackinnon?

They saw an abbreviated season with Mackinnon at the end of it and they took a dive.

Actually I think they saw Jones at the end, but the new management team came in at the end and took a different direction.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by nik-

Actually I think they saw Jones at the end, but the new management team came in at the end and took a different direction.

Either way they were drafting #1 or #2. That same team is likely going to have home-ice advantage in this season's playoffs.

Thats a hell of a turnaround.

[nik-]

Oh they tanked for sure. There's no way a team that cared doesn't fire Sacco more than a quarter into the season.

[$ven27]

Originally Posted by Locke

Tell me how that Avs 2012-13 roster drafts 1st overall? Largely the same roster they have today with the addition of Mackinnon?

They saw an abbreviated season with Mackinnon at the end of it and they took a dive.

Except their roster isn't the same as last season. Half of their D corpse is new, in addition to Talbot and Tanguay. Had an overhaul in a mediocre upper management that refused to fire the worst coach in recent NHL memory in Sacco and also finally got a goaltending coach, something they've never had for a number of seasons. Just look at their defense now, still horrible. Sacco had no idea how to coach that team (As a few players have said as much) so it was no surprise that they did horribly last season. They didn't tank, they just sucked.

[AcGold]

I think if we don't get any assets for our ufa's, dont sign any new ufa's, do worse next year and have an average draft next year will be rock bottom when people really start to realize it may not be a rebuild and just a long period of sucking until we luck into the next Crosby or Stamkos. Once despair and sadness is replaced with apathy, then we will know rock bottom. Just like people refused to admit that we needed to make changes a few years ago people don't see the catastrophe on the horizon.

[CaptainCrunch]

If we lose our free agents we're going to have to sign some just to stay at the salary floor.

So the option is to decide which of the current group we sign and want to keep, or move them out the door for draft picks and then aggressively pursue UFA's who are willing to take short term contracts with a rebuilding team in exchange for an over pay.

If we move out Cams Cams, Stajan, Step, Russell, Butler and don't qualify a guy like Galiardi, you remove 16.5 million dollars from the payroll, you can't just bring in rookies making a million dollars each to replace them.

Depending on the floor, we'd probably still have to bring in 6 to 8 million bucks onto the payroll depending on how much the cap goes up.

I think the floor is 44 next year, if the cap goes up 8 million its going to be 52.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by dying4acup

This is rock bottom. I hate it. It sucks. I love this team to death. I will be here until the end. We knew there would be times like these.

I will defend the flames (and explain loyalty) to Canucks fans while I live in Vancouver. I will never give up. I expect another rock bottom moment or 2.

BUT

I expect to become a champion. A Stanley cup champion. I expect to be a better team than than the oilers and Canucks ever were.

I expect that my team will never pull hair or dive. I expect they will never bite fingers and I expect the will never cheat to win.

I also expect that they will never lose on purpose. I will never cheer for a loss. I will never boo my team either. I might get frustrated, but I won't discredit their effort. But there better be effort.

Bottom line is: I will be here until the end!

[Singularity]

Ask a Oiler fan what rock bottom is.