So yeah.. We need to make a change, what should it be?

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by vanisleflamesfan

Well first of all, you said Cammy would get a 1st, I said he wouldn't and now you want to bet on a 2nd? Hmmm...

Anyway, before your bravado to back up your ridiculous claims makes you do something stupid like try to make several $100 bets, just look at some facts. Over the past 2 years, 5 players have fetched a 1st rounder in a trade:

Thomas Vanek
Bobby Ryan
Cory Schneider
Some Iginla guy
Jay Bouwmeester

Now, do you really think that Mike Cammalleri, the same guy who hasn't scored 50 points since 09-10 is going to fetch a 1st?

Sorry I forgot Jordan Staal.

Jason Pominville got a 1st and other prospects, he is definitely comparable stats wise to Cammy. It will be interested to evaluate the return that Burke gets on his trades.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by dean00007

This team has no talent yet. I think it was a mistake not sending Monahan back to juniors or to the WJHC. Stempniak is a Bouma clone right now, works hard has no offensive touch and no puck control. Stajan almost invisible despite hard work ethic. Giordano is a damn fine defenseman, but I'm worried the local media is building him up to be something he's not. Gio is a 3rd or 4th defenseman. Goaltending is ok in my opinion. Team misses a stud defenseman, I don't care what people say, letting Phaneuf go was a mistake. Not enough playmakers, we rely on only Hudler to make plays since Burke sent Baertchi down. That's all I got... can't wait til the draft!

[macrov]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Jason Pominville got a 1st and other prospects, he is definitely comparable stats wise to Cammy. It will be interested to evaluate the return that Burke gets on his trades.

Martin Erat also fetched Filip Forsberg who is basicly at least a first (probably worth more because 1 in the hand is worth 2 in the bush)

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[vanisleflamesfan]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Jason Pominville got a 1st and other prospects, he is definitely comparable stats wise to Cammy. It will be interested to evaluate the return that Burke gets on his trades.

I would not say that Pominville is comparable to Cammy stats wise. He had 73 points the season before and it has been 4 or 5 years since Cammy breathed that kind of air.

Cammalleri has been trending down for a long time. However, you are right, I did miss Pominville.

[vanisleflamesfan]

Originally Posted by macrov

Martin Erat also fetched Filip Forsberg who is basicly at least a first (probably worth more because 1 in the hand is worth 2 in the bush)

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Erat AND a pretty good prospect got Forsberg.

[vanisleflamesfan]

At any rate... simmer down there Gamblor. I think that your projections are way off the mark but I am not going to make some silly bet with you over it.

[macrov]

Originally Posted by vanisleflamesfan

At any rate... simmer down there Gamblor. I think that your projections are way off the mark but I am not going to make some silly bet with you over it.

Lol. Funny that.

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[the2bears]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

How on god's green earth is edmonton still not just one, not Two, but THREE points behind us still?

Mind destruction.

Bottles the mind.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by vanisleflamesfan

Over the past 2 years, 5 players have fetched a 1st rounder in a trade:

Thomas Vanek
Bobby Ryan
Cory Schneider
Some Iginla guy
Jay Bouwmeester

Now, do you really think that Mike Cammalleri, the same guy who hasn't scored 50 points since 09-10 is going to fetch a 1st?

Sorry I forgot Jordan Staal.

Carter
Jagr
the rights to Varlomov
Quincey
Gaustad

If you go back another year, the list includes
Penner
Versteeg
Brouwer
Burns
Kaberle

Of course, almost all of these players were traded in packages that included other pieces, but I don't think for a second that it is in any way unusual to expect that Cammalleri could return a first round pick. Don't make the mistake of thinking that player values are entirely based on past transactions, and set in stone. If a team really wants a player, and really believes that he could help them succeed, then that team will pay the price to acquire such a player.

Cammalleri has to be an intriguing trade possibility for a team in the playoff mix, since he has always been such a great playoff performer. The year that the Canadiens went deep and he was one of their MVPs, he scored 26 goals in the regular season, and he is on pace to match that this year.

[flames_fan_down_under]

Tis the reality of a rebuild. It certainly isn't fun or easy to watch your favourite team get demolished night in and night out, however this is what needed to happen unfortunately. Flames needed to get rid of their aging vets, and they did, plus they lost their franchise goalie to retirement.

Luckily for us is that there is a brighter future ahead. Monahan is only going to improve, Poirier, Klimchuk, Jankowski (fingers crossed), Jon Gilles, Gaudreau, all coming up the pipeline. Surely some of those are going to turn into quality NHL players.

Hopefully Burke can do some magic and Cammalleri can net us a 1st overall of some type, or maybe a decent prospect in return. Martin Erat fetched that Forsberg kid for crying out loud.

I just hope teams are desperate at the trade deadline this year! Desperation means us sellers can have a hey day!

[stemit14]

Not sure if Burke will look for a first round pick in this draft in exchange for cammalleri... He'll probably prefer to acquire a good D-Man prospect with a year or two of development. Less risk in that by acquiring a 20 year old defencemen whose projection is more accurate at this point than a 17-18 year old prospect chosen 25th overall in a draft that many consider to be pretty weak.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by flames_fan_down_under

...I just hope teams are desperate at the trade deadline this year! Desperation means us sellers can have a hey day!

With how ridiculously competitive the West is this year, maybe this is something Burke can leverage to his advantage to increase the return for the Flames's trading pieces.

St. Louis, Chicago, LA, Anaheim and SJ have to all feel that they can win, but how much will each load up in an effort to pull ahead of the other four? Vancouver probably recognises that they have one or two more shots at this before they are on the outside of the playoff bubble, and planning for a rebuild. Will they feel pressure to make a final push with the Sedins, Kesler, and Luongo still in their prime?

[dammage79]

Even rebuilding teams score goals. This one just up and died. I don't think a trade at this point would be reactionary. Team needs a spark in the worst way. I'm ready for the losses, just not getting shut out three times a week and getting out scored by 5 goals every darned game.

[Poe969]

This biggest change needed by the team, management and fans is attitude. They need confidence and the fans need less of it. Think of the flames as a junior team compared to the rest of the league, they're going to suck but in time they'll get better we just have to wait. Expecting too much at this point is only going to get everyone upset, just give it time and try to find some positives.

[Phil Russell]

The changes you want will begin happening at the deadline. Vets will be moved out for prospects and picks and players will be called-up. At that point things slowly start to get a little more entertaining--likely not a lot of wins but we will get to watch kids who care and dream about a better future. Turn the games off if you can't handle it. Relax and think of high draft picks.

[FlameZilla]

This team surprised most of us because they came out of the gates full of energy. What they lacked in size they made up for by playing with a lot of heart. Now we're more than halfway through the season and they seem to have run out of gas. I can't fault them, because most games they're at a significant physical & skill disadvantage to the other teams. You can only overachieve for so long before you burn out.

The St. Louis game shouldn't be too worrying; they're one of the best teams in the league this season. We out-shot them and played well but Halak (and a couple of posts & lucky bounces) kept us off the scoresheet & killed all momentum. A couple of weak goals conceded by Ramo didn't help. By the 3rd period you could tell that the players had pretty much decided it wasn't to be their night. As the season progresses & this happens more and more I think the vets are going to get more & more complacent.

I don't think many of us are that upset about the losses (because of the desire to draft early) but it's the manner of the losses. I would personally be very happy to get one of the top 2 picks in this draft, but to do so we'll need to be worse than Edmonton which seems damned near impossible. With every loss I'm gutted, but half excited that we might close the gap and pip the Oilers to that 2nd overall draft pick.

To keep (some of) the fans on board through this it's obvious that we need more energy out there. The fans like seeing the youngsters do well & they like seeing the team giving her all out there. Paul Byron has been one of the bright spots this month, and I think the energy injected in the lineup from his call-up gave the team a bit of a boost in December.

While we wait for the veterans to get offloaded, I'd like to see Billins, Granlund and maybe Hanowski called-up to give us a much-needed energy boost. Obviously this won't improve our record, but having hungry young pros in the lineup, eager to impress & make their mark, should improve the manner of our losses. Once Sven gets his mojo back I think a call-up would make games a lot more fun to watch.

[Torchdemall]

The change... your mindset.

Stop thinking there is going to be a quick fix, enjoy the games that are good as a pleasant surprise, and expect the ones that are bad, if you can't bare it then don't watch. There is no magic bullet, its slow and methodical process that is going to take years, and firing coaches, or sending down a few of your NHL'rs to bring up guys who are still developing is not going to right the ship.

Draft picks gives you a potential future, not a guaranteed one, and not one that will be appreciable in a year or two. It's a rebuild, what did you think this was gonna look like?

This is where you find our the character of players, where the veterans show leadership and show the young ones that you earn your stripes in in the trenches when times are tough and you show up to sweat and work your ass off the next day after having it kicked and then chewed out. Welcome to professional sports, you don't have to look far to see worse outcomes then a couple of games losing streak.

Ya its ugly, but I seriously hope the players have a hell of lot more grit then some of the fans. Try living in places where there is not high quality hockey to see live, granted some nights its hard to watch but even on those nights you are still seeing half of the game being played by talented individuals, and some of our own show up to battle.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by six pack

Still amazing how a talent like jaybow can be so good in st. Louis but so bad here and people aren't questing the system Hartley uses when evaluating our talent. Face it we have a coach who will not adopt as well.

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He had his best season as a Flame under Hartley....you should be bashing Brent Sutter

[Gord Wappel]

Curious why the list of tradable assets does not include Hudler.

He seems to be consistent and solid and in prime - a valuable asset - one of few that could entice a higher draft pick.
Do people think that he will still be here when Flames are competitive ?
Or is it respect for the honeymoon period of recently recruited free agent ?

[edslunch]

While I don't care about wins and agree it's a rebuild and we just need to live through it, this last stretch reeks of bad karma over and above the low talent level of the team. If this is indicative of a bad attitude seeping into the team (only the team knows if that's the case) then I would advocate an early move or two to shake it up. It seems the whole team is wound too tight waiting for the other shoe to drop, maybe dropping a shoe lets them loosen up and at least compete.