2011 Canadian Election Thread

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by SebC

Allow me to rephrase... a Prime Minister who had de facto lost the confidence of the House of Commons proroguing parliament to avoid a confidence vote set a bad precendent that can never be erased from history. There's nothing revisionist about that

And let me rebut this...

There was no confidence lost whatsoever. It was a behind the scenes coup by those who had just been defeated in an election and were facing economic measures that would have crippled them. They tried to color it and spin it as anything but, however the Canadian people weren't fooled and niether was Harper and the elected government.

To call it anything but is disingenuous. This was proven even further IMO when the supposed leader of the coup, Stephane Dion, was ousted by his own party a week after the failed attempt and agreed to step down....yet he was good enough to lead the country after the power grab?

[SebC]

Originally Posted by transplant99

There was no confidence lost whatsoever. It was a behind the scenes coup by those who had just been defeated in an election and were facing economic measures that would have crippled them. They tried to color it and spin it as anything but, however the Canadian people weren't fooled and niether was Harper and the elected government.

A plurality in the House of Commons does not constitute confidence. Confidence is support from a majority of MPs, which Harper didn't have.

[llama64]

Sadly, what Canada needs is a government that can figure out how to fix the massive tax burden that losing the GST has left us with.

Only way to do that - tax more, spend less. Have yet to see a political party willing to go there, and I highly doubt we will. Short sighted baby-boomer pandering will cause even more debt the younger generations will need to deal with. Thanks parents!

Not a single one of parties represent the interests of people under the age of 45. I honestly wonder if there will be a reason for me to vote in this potential election. Elections used to be fun - then I got educated.

[SeoulFire]

Originally Posted by SebC

A plurality in the House of Commons does not constitute confidence. Confidence is support from a majority of MPs, which Harper didn't have.

Is this based on the assumption that the MP's are acting in the best interests of the country or of the party? Massive difference.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by SebC

A plurality in the House of Commons does not constitute confidence. Confidence is support from a majority of MPs, which Harper didn't have.

Yet he has had it ever since? Sure thing.

It was what it was...a power grab by a bunch off pissed off politicians who were facing devastating economic pressures on their individual parties. They weren't acting in the best interests of their constituents as evidenced by poll after poll at the time, they were trying to save themselves. Its undeniable. In hindsight, I dont blame them at all for trying to do what they did, and in the end they saved their federal party dollars, but again thats what it was all about...nothing more and nothing less.

Prorogueing parliament while that was worked out was actually a pretty good thing when all was said and done. Canadians got what they wanted (gov't stability), the Libs and NDP got what they wanted (money), and the Cons got what they earned (forming the govt).

[Knut]

Nothing to add here for me. I am just enjoying the back and forth here. Like i do every time a possible election comes. Keep up the good work !

[Bertuzzied]

haha. whats the point of arguing politics on CP.

The only way i will ever vote federally for the conservatives is if Klein runs for PM which will never happen now, Nenshi runs for PM which might happen 10 years from now, or if Rob Anders gets thrown out of the conservative party, which may happen 70 years from now.

and did someone actually quote Sheila Copps to debate me???? hahahaha

[transplant99]

The only way i will ever vote federally for the conservatives is if Klein runs for PM which will never happen now

Just a side note here...unfortunately Ralph is in really bad health these days. Tough SOB but this one is going to get him in the end.

[killer_carlson]

not to mention that greasy jack and dion both said during the campaign that they would not form a coalition only to try to do so days later. id have loved them to take a coalition to the polls and be obliterated

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Each province receives a percentage of the seats in parliament in direct proportion to its population -- that's the exact opposite of being skewed. You may not like it, but that doesn't make it "skewed and broken".

Currently a few provinces are either slightly over- or under-represented because electoral districts have not been redrawn recently to reflect population data from the latest census. Alberta, BC, and Ontario have a few seats less than they should; Quebec is the only province with exactly the right amount of seats that their population mandates.

So you're saying the percentages are pretty close to representation by population? Because that's very far from true.

Example: Population of PEI: ~135,000 but has 4 Federal seats.
Peace River, Alberta, Population ~138,000 with 1 Federal seat

Seems to me that PEI has 4x more rep per pop.

PEI is the most egregious example, but numerous provinces have 1 seat per 70-80,000 people, while the bigger provinces have 1 seat per 110,000 people.

http://www.elections.ca/content.aspx...t=index&lang=e

[billybob123]

Originally Posted by llama64

Not a single one of parties represent the interests of people under the age of 45. I honestly wonder if there will be a reason for me to vote in this potential election. Elections used to be fun - then I got educated.

I often have difficulty finding someone to vote for. I live in Rob Anders' riding, so there's pretty much no reason for me to vote. I used to go vote to protest and spoil it every time, but I get lumped in with the idiots who can't figure out the ballot. I just give up. I rarely vote federally (I did vote in both the municipal and provincial elections since both were really up for grabs); I'm especially unlikely to vote this time since every vote these idiots get gives their party money. Why should I support any of these bozos?

Make it work. That's what Canadians want. Not these idiotic political games, and most of all, no election!

[Ashartus]

Originally Posted by billybob123

I often have difficulty finding someone to vote for. I live in Rob Anders' riding, so there's pretty much no reason for me to vote. I used to go vote to protest and spoil it every time, but I get lumped in with the idiots who can't figure out the ballot. I just give up. I rarely vote federally (I did vote in both the municipal and provincial elections since both were really up for grabs); I'm especially unlikely to vote this time since every vote these idiots get gives their party money. Why should I support any of these bozos?

Make it work. That's what Canadians want. Not these idiotic political games, and most of all, no election!

I think living in Anders' riding makes it even more important to vote - the party won't do anything to get rid of him until people start voting against him. If you can't support any of the parties vote for an independent (there was a fairly credible-seeming independent running in the riding last time around). Even if the candidate you vote for doesn't win, if Anders' percentage of the vote declines enough the party will start to take notice.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by Ashartus

I think living in Anders' riding makes it even more important to vote - the party won't do anything to get rid of him until people start voting against him. If you can't support any of the parties vote for an independent (there was a fairly credible-seeming independent running in the riding last time around). Even if the candidate you vote for doesn't win, if Anders' percentage of the vote declines enough the party will start to take notice.

I don't think that will work. Even competent conservative candidates can't oust Anders. He must have a Harper sex tape or something.

I went to University with Anders, and he is a first class ahole.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by SeoulFire

Is this based on the assumption that the MP's are acting in the best interests of the country or of the party? Massive difference.

Given that polls show that the Conservatives are in a great position right now to go into an election, I would have to lean towards the opposition parties truly believing that the budget proposed was crap. None of the opposition parties should really "want" an election right now, but being in a poor position in the polls isn't really a good reason to support a budget that they don't like either.

I think Harper is being pretty sneaky here. He started the attack ads a couple of months ago while stating they were not wanting an election. He saw the polls and introduced a budget that he knew would not get passed thereby calling an election without having to be the one to actually "call" it. He can claim that it was not his idea.

I'm not a Harper hater, but it looks pretty obvious to me that he is the one bringing this election in.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Prorogueing parliament while that was worked out was actually a pretty good thing when all was said and done. Canadians got what they wanted (gov't stability), the Libs and NDP got what they wanted (money), and the Cons got what they earned (forming the govt).

A plurality does not earn you "forming the govt", only the right to make the first attempt at forming the govt.

[automaton 3]

I'm not stoked at all about the person who will be running for the party I generally suppport.

Will probably still end up voting for him unless a strong independant steps up though. I can't stand any of the other parties and refuse to support them in any fashion.

[GirlySports]

Taxes are needed but today no party in the Western world dares to raise taxes in fear of not getting voted in.

Is it the people today that are too selfish and can't accept more taxes. I just listen around my office and people think taxes should be LOWER!

[automaton 3]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

None of the opposition parties should really "want" an election right now, but being in a poor position in the polls isn't really a good reason to support a budget that they don't like either.

I agree they don't want an election but disagree on the budget, it looks to be pretty benign.

IMO the opposition parties (in particular the Liberals) have either painted themselves into a corner or allowed themselves to be maneuvered into that position.

[Slava]

The reason that Ignatieff says the budget isn't credible is based on the fact that some of these costs are not quanitifed accurately. The fighter jets is the most major of these costs, and that revelation came about not from the Liberals themselves, but a parliamentary budget officer (if memory serves?).

Arguing politics on CP is basically a waste of time. The Harper apologists take every issue and basically say "Its not a big deal" or "(fill in opposition leader) is not a good alternative".

To me the worst comment though is "sponsorship scandal" or something else from years gone by. It makes it sound as though its OK that Harper and his cronies have committed some transgressions because the other major party screwed up a few years ago. Why voters should accept that as any sort of defence just boggles the mind.

[killer_carlson]

Originally Posted by Slava

The reason that Ignatieff says the budget isn't credible is based on the fact that some of these costs are not quanitifed accurately. The fighter jets is the most major of these costs, and that revelation came about not from the Liberals themselves, but a parliamentary budget officer (if memory serves?).

Arguing politics on CP is basically a waste of time. The Harper apologists take every issue and basically say "Its not a big deal" or "(fill in opposition leader) is not a good alternative".

To me the worst comment though is "sponsorship scandal" or something else from years gone by. It makes it sound as though its OK that Harper and his cronies have committed some transgressions because the other major party screwed up a few years ago. Why voters should accept that as any sort of defence just boggles the mind.

actually, those of us who work for a living outside a union environment find spending policies and taxation policies of the NDP and Liberals to be distasteful. that is why they are not an appropriate alternative. I can't afford to live under their government plans.