A Song of Ice and Fire **Spoilers** Now more TV talk!

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

I don't think she'll be Ramsey's plaything at all. The whole point of her conversation with Littlefinger was that it's her choice and it's time for her to stand up for herself. We've already seen her start to become a little more cunning and strategic, I think she becomes even stronger now knowing how much the Boltons need her name and she becomes the one to manipulate Ramsey, even if it's only subtly

I don't know. It be so much easier for the writers to take the Jeyne Poole as "Arya Stark" story from the books and have it be Sansa.

If somehow it's a ploy to empower Sansa and she manipulates Ramsey, fine. But I don't see it going there. I fully expect the explicit sexual abuse Ramsey forces on both Theon and Jeyne in the book to happen to Sansa and Theon.

[Bigtime]

I'm with Hemi, I think we are going to see Sansa take the bull by the horns and work Ramsey over without him even realizing it until it is too late. May not happen by the end of this season though, I think they need to slow burn it and build it up.

[Finger Cookin]

I was like "Who's Heidi?"

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

I'm with Hedi, I think we are going to see Sansa take the bull by the horns and work Ramsey over without him even realizing it until it is too late. May not happen by the end of this season though, I think they need to slow burn it and build it up.

You could be right, but I think of that slow burn has Sansa getting Joffrey'd again.

[Finger Cookin]

Sansa's not naive enough to get Joffrey'd again.

[Harry Lime]

I went directly to the bottom of the page in order to not read any posts. I don't watch television programs until after they have finished their runs, so I don't have to deal with commercials and seasonal breaks.

I noticed that this thread and the 'show' thread are 1 and 2 at the top of the contents page. Are these the same thing?

[Finger Cookin]

Essentially book readers can also discuss the TV show here without fear of discussing spoilers from the published books with people who are only watching the TV show. Of course, during this season and certainly in subsequent ones, it's possible the TV show may spoil developments from the unpublished books.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Sansa's not naive enough to get Joffrey'd again.

You're right. Smart women never get abused.

[Finger Cookin]

I never said she was smart!

[Mike F]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

I'm with Hemi, I think we are going to see Sansa take the bull by the horns and work Ramsey over without him even realizing it until it is too late. May not happen by the end of this season though, I think they need to slow burn it and build it up.

Ramsay's a super sadist who has shown no qualms about inflicting as much suffering on women as men. If the show lets Sansa "play him", it will do total disservice to the character they've built up to this point. Not saying it won't happen, but it would be weak.

I noticed that there was a shot in Moat Cailin (IIRC) where the camera distinctly stops on three women watching Sansa enter. I'm guessing those are the women sent with Mance Rayder who will help her and Theon escape, generally following the Jeyne Poole storyline..

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by Mike F

I noticed that there was a shot in Moat Cailin (IIRC) where the camera distinctly stops on three women watching Sansa enter. I'm guessing those are the women sent with Mance Rayder who will help her and Theon escape, generally following the Jeyne Poole storyline..

That was Winterfell, I was thinking the same thing about those three.

[GreenLantern]

During the bedding Ramsay has Theon strip his bride for him and makes Theon watch as he humiliates and degrades Jeyne.

I do not think this has a happy ending for Sansa... until Reek steals her away.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Mike F

I noticed that there was a shot in Moat Cailin (IIRC) where the camera distinctly stops on three women watching Sansa enter. I'm guessing those are the women sent with Mance Rayder who will help her and Theon escape, generally following the Jeyne Poole storyline..

Was that not the girl who was with Ramsay on one of his hunting outings last season? The one where they had the dogs rip apart the young woman. Under that assumption, I took it as more of threat to Sansa as Ramsay's psychotic love interest isn't going to be too happy with her bae getting married.

Or maybe I was wrong completely.

[Lego Man]

Did anyone catch E04 of "Game of Thrones: A series based loosely on one chapter from AFFC and one two chapters from ADWD"?

[GP_Matt]

I did and was very sad at the end.

[Bigtime]

Well, we never see Selmy kick any ass in the books. So I guess on one hand it was awesome to see him throw down, but to end up with him potentially dead?

Maybe if they kill him off it sets up a nice position for Jorah to return to his Queens side when he delivers Tyrion to her? That is if they make it unscathed, seeing them on the boat makes me think the storyline with them both being captured by a slave ship is still potentially in play.

More setup about Sansa playing Ramsay, Littlefinger dropping the line on how he is very taken by her. Gives us that little bit of opening that perhaps he will be slightly blinded by his bride to be and won't see it coming until it is too late.

Stannis status: Still the man, loves his daughter (saying it without saying it ).

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Well, we never see Selmy kick any ass in the books. So I guess on one hand it was awesome to see him throw down, but to end up with him potentially dead?.

Woah, disagree there. His battle with the the Titan's ####### was awesome, he beats the commander of the Seconds Sons with a staff and pretty much apologizes for not ending the battle quicker. Mero was no slouch.

At the end of Dances with Dragon he practically toys with Khrazz, a celebrated fighter, and pretty much feels sorry for Khrazz because he knows he has no chance. He's kicking so much ass here that it's not even a big deal. His thought process was "oh, one of the best fighters east of Westeros, better see if he will throw down his weapon so I don't have to kill him." No urgency at all because he knows he has it in the bag with his armour.

[Bigtime]

Oh wow, you are right Oling. I REALLY need to re-read the books.

[Boblobla]

With how close they stuck to the books up until this point I am pretty surprised they have decided to completely deviate in almost every aspect. I wonder if GRRM has an influence and they are writing the series removing characters he doesn't really want any more? I am surprised it seems they have removed the Aegon storyline.

[Finger Cookin]

Just goes to show what a meandering mess A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons were.