General Ongoing Coyotes saga thread

[Northendzone]

My observation has likely been noted elsewhere in this thread, the time seemed right to mention it again.......

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Having a future is relevant, and in order to have a future, Phoenix needs an owner.

Bouw is right in this case - Next season is no litmus test at all. Now, if Jamison's group does come into control of the team, I would say 2013-14 would be the true litmus test.

We've been saying this for two years now though. And it really should have been. And in many ways it is. It just seems like the league and the board does not want to move.

They're biting their own ass. Tired of fretting about it. Like when I realized Bush was going to win the 04 election, I finally let go, smiled and said, well let's see how bad the damage can get.

[troutman]

Daniel Blanchet ‏@mxdan316
Bill Daly confirms to @patrickcaisse that NHL accepted to give Glendale an extra 30 days to reach a deal and make it work. #Coyotes

[PegCityFlamesFan]

The joke that never ends.

[Resolute 14]

Makes sense. The team clearly is not moving before next season, so the 30-day extension is meaningless wrt timelines.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Makes sense. The team clearly is not moving before next season, so the 30-day extension is meaningless wrt timelines.

If there is no threat of the team moving before next season, what's the incentive for Glendale to agree to cover the losses?

That's what I don't get about this all extending so long.

[Resolute 14]

There isn't, which is why I opined before that the Jamison bid is the last chance. The NHL is actually caught at the moment, as the city has agreed to a lease that would make Jamison's ownership viable but nothing can move until we know it will survive a potential challenge in a referendum. If it doesn't, the Coyotes are finally done in Phoenix, imnsho.

At any rate, it is doubtful that the other markets are in a state of preparation similar to where True North was last season. A snap relocation was always going to be challenging this time around.

[Resolute 14]

Also, and it very likely has been mentioned a few times in the Doan thread, but Shane Doan's choosing to go the FA route is also a pretty good sign that Phoenix is at the end of the line. He had said previously that he was settled in Phoenix and didn't want to leave. His choosing free agency now is a strong sign that he doesn't believe the team will last, and he wants to choose his own fate now rather than let the NHL do it for him next year.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Makes sense. The team clearly is not moving before next season, so the 30-day extension is meaningless wrt timelines.

I think it is still 50/50 that the team moves this season - the CBA battle is likely going to delay the season 2-3 months. QUE is ready to go on 3 days notice.

On another tangent - I saw a report the other day that an economist predicts the CDN $ to be at 0.85 in 2013. This would be significant to the CDN franchises, especially the smaller markets.

[topfiverecords]

Luckily for Glendale another Monday comes every 7 days.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by troutman

Daniel Blanchet ‏@mxdan316
Bill Daly confirms to @patrickcaisse that NHL accepted to give Glendale an extra 30 days to reach a deal and make it work. #Coyotes

Their just waiting for the lockout now. Which works in Phoenix's favour. Course it pisses me off even more. People ask why fans in Canada get so upset about this saga. It's because it's literally starting to bring the league down.

Just let them die already. Move em. Doesn't even have to be to a Canadian city, just a city where it'll work better than this.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by troutman

I think it is still 50/50 that the team moves this season - the CBA battle is likely going to delay the season 2-3 months. QUE is ready to go on 3 days notice.

On another tangent - I saw a report the other day that an economist predicts the CDN $ to be at 0.85 in 2013. This would be significant to the CDN franchises, especially the smaller markets.

Not that I know better than an economist, but do you happen to remember the reasons for this?

Even if it does happen, 0.85 is still WAY better than 0.63 as I believe was the low many years ago. (with 0.68 being the number it hovered around most)

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Daradon

Their just waiting for the lockout now. Which works in Phoenix's favour. Course it pisses me off even more. People ask why fans in Canada get so upset about this saga. It's because it's literally starting to bring the league down.

Is it? I am sure you have evidence of this?

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Daradon

Not that I know better than an economist, but do you happen to remember the reasons for this?

Even if it does happen, 0.85 is still WAY better than 0.63 as I believe was the low many years ago. (with 0.68 being the number it hovered around most)

Economist sees Canadian dollar sinking to 86¢ in 2013


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...rticle4370816/

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by troutman

I think it is still 50/50 that the team moves this season - the CBA battle is likely going to delay the season 2-3 months. QUE is ready to go on 3 days notice.

On another tangent - I saw a report the other day that an economist predicts the CDN $ to be at 0.85 in 2013. This would be significant to the CDN franchises, especially the smaller markets.

I don't believe for a second that Quebecor can be ready in 3 days. Also, a lockout would not facilitate a relocation. Good luck trying to hire 1000 staff on the promise that they might get to work... someday. Nevermind that the league simply can't move forward on the assumption that they will just use the lockout to extend timing on a relocation. No, if it was going to happen this year, it would have happened already.

A lower dollar would be interesting for the league, as it would cut into the cap.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Is it? I am sure you have evidence of this?

How much money is it costing to keep this team running? And I know they believe they'll get it paid back with any future sale, but that hasn't happened yet.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Daradon

How much money is it costing to keep this team running? And I know they believe they'll get it paid back with any future sale, but that hasn't happened yet.

I already noted a few pages back that the cost to the NHL (less than $500k per team) was very likely less than the cost due to increased salary cap that a relocation would have caused.

So no, I do not accept your wildly subjective, completely emotional argument as evidence that the Coyotes are "literally bringing down the league".

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

I already noted a few pages back that the cost to the NHL (less than $500k per team) was very likely less than the cost due to increased salary cap that a relocation would have caused.

So no, I do not accept your wildly subjective, completely emotional argument as evidence that the Coyotes are "literally bringing down the league".

By themselves no, but how many other teams are in trouble?

Besides, even if you do think it comes close to evening out between the cost to keep them there and the possible increase in salary cap, that still doesn't take into account the increase revenues a successful team would bring into the league. You know, the ones that give money to teams like Phoenix?

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Daradon

By themselves no, but how many other teams are in trouble?

How does the struggles other teams may be experiencing mean that Phoenix is "literally bringing down the league"? More over, how does relocating the Coyotes help those teams?

Besides, even if you do think it comes close to evening out between the cost to keep them there and the possible increase in salary cap, that still doesn't take into account the increase revenues a successful team would bring into the league. You know, the ones that give money to teams like Phoenix?

Take Phoenix out of the revenue sharing pool, and you only move someone else in. Pretty much a zero-sum game there.

So again, I'm not seeing the justification for the hyperbole. The Coyotes situation is not a great one, but at the same time, it is not significantly harming the league's overall health.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

How does the struggles other teams may be experiencing mean that Phoenix is "literally bringing down the league"? More over, how does relocating the Coyotes help those teams?

Take Phoenix out of the revenue sharing pool, and you only move someone else in. Pretty much a zero-sum game there.

So again, I'm not seeing the justification for the hyperbole. The Coyotes situation is not a great one, but at the same time, it is not significantly harming the league's overall health.

Not if you move them to a place that makes money (for them and for the league).

Is revenue sharing a static number? If it is, then maybe I have misunderstood something. But I would imagine that if revenue doesn't NEED to be shared, it isn't.

And yes literally bringing down the league was a extreme statement. But they are the biggest part of the revenue problem. Which is why we are going to a lockout AGAIN. Something no hockey fan wants and is completely justified in getting upset over.

They have been in trouble the longest, they have been propped up the longest, and worst of all, there is no end in sight. Even if they do get this magical deal they think they will, do you think that will solve their problems? Will fans start showing up in enough numbers that they can put ticket prices up? Will balance sheets start balancing? With black numbers instead of red?

Take this dog out back and shoot it already.