[News] Kevin Hayes signs with the Rangers

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by mikeecho

Re: Tampering, the league seems to be pretty hands off with it for the most part but I wonder (if the league ever really drew a line) where the line would be.

If the Flames did a post season exit interview with Gaudreau and in a round about way told him told him they'd love to have a guy like Hayes on the team, he'd have a great opportunity, etc... knowing Gaudreau and Hayes would be spending a lot of time all summer together at camps and chit chatting about Hayes future... would that cross the line? Probably hard to prove most cases (as others have mentioned) without a smoking gun like an e-mail or something concrete.

Yes that would be considered tampering, technically. Players with NHL contracts cannot recruit another player whose rights are owned by another team. It is written in the player's contract and/or CBA, can't recall ATM.

[ClubFlames]

Originally Posted by BigFlameDog

sureLoss was dripping the sarcasm on there.....not sure if you picked that up.

Really?! No way! Darn!!!!

[StrykerSteve]

OldSchool Heel ‏@OldSchoolHeel_ 6m The #Pens are currently carrying 50 contracts. If the rumors of them courting Kevin Hayes are true, some sort of trade is a necessity.

[FBI]

This is interesting because in another 24 hours I will know if I have another prospect to religiously follow or if I will never care/think about Hayes again.

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by StrykerSteve

OldSchool Heel ‏@OldSchoolHeel_ 6m The #Pens are currently carrying 50 contracts. If the rumors of them courting Kevin Hayes are true, some sort of trade is a necessity.

not true at all, they are at 50 contracts but two of them are sliding, so they don't need to to make a trade unless Kapanen and Jarry make the team.

[Poe969]

lets hope it's done within 24 hours. I thought they would have picked by Saturday, then sunday and then I was hoping he would have signed today.... I hate this because every time I see that sureLoss posts I'm excited just to come here and see he hasn't. Waiting is the hardest part...

[CKPThunder]

Maybe this has been discussed before and I apologize. Why are players who use the Schultz loophole allowed to become free agents earlier than those who play 4 years in college? Basically, why was Schultz allowed allowed to sign with a new team in June and why must Hayes wait until August?

[mikeecho]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Yes that would be considered tampering, technically. Players with NHL contracts cannot recruit another player whose rights are owned by another team. It is written in the player's contract and/or CBA, can't recall ATM.

Technically, it makes sense, but I wonder about the reality.

Black and white if the Flames get Gaudreau to call Hayes and go over the script about how great the organization is, etc...

Probably a little more grey if Gaudreau and Hayes are out for a beer after a day of hockey camp and Hayes says, Johnny what do you think? Would Calgary be a good place for me?

I'm sure the company line is for Gaudreau to say, I can't speak to that as it would technically be considered tampering, etc... But I'm guessing those guys chitter chatter and gossip like most 21 year olds do, so it's probably more a more interesting dialogue.

That's partly what makes tampering such a tough thing to prove and so rarely addressed.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by CKPThunder

Maybe this has been discussed before and I apologize. Why are players who use the Schultz loophole allowed to become free agents earlier than those who play 4 years in college? Basically, why was Schultz allowed allowed to sign with a new team in June and why must Hayes wait until August?

Schultz played 1 year of BCHL after being drafted, then went to college for 3 years

[CKPThunder]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Schultz played 1 year of BCHL after being drafted, then went to college for 3 years

I understand that. I am just curious to why he was able to become a free agent earlier than Hayes? Why didn't Schultz have to wait until Aug 15?

[DOOM]

Originally Posted by CKPThunder

I understand that. I am just curious to why he was able to become a free agent earlier than Hayes? Why didn't Schultz have to wait until Aug 15?

Schultz "de-registered" from school which gave the Ducks only 30 days to negotiate with him.

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by CKPThunder

I understand that. I am just curious to why he was able to become a free agent earlier than Hayes? Why didn't Schultz have to wait until Aug 15?

Believe it is to give teams time to negotiate after graduation so that they don't have to pressure a prospect to sign while he is dealing with grad.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by CKPThunder

Maybe this has been discussed before and I apologize. Why are players who use the Schultz loophole allowed to become free agents earlier than those who play 4 years in college? Basically, why was Schultz allowed allowed to sign with a new team in June and why must Hayes wait until August?

When a team drafts a College player (or a player who becomes a College player within two years of being drafted), they retain his draft rights until August 15, following his senior year.

If the player declares his intentions to leave college prior to his senior year, he no longer has a graduation date, so his draft rights expire on June 1, four years after the year he was drafted (or 30 days after declaring his intentions to leave college, whichever is later).


So, there are three possible scenarios:

1. The player has already played at least one year of College hockey prior to being drafted (John Gilmour is an example of this). Gilmour played his freshman year in 2012-13 and was drafted in 2013. If he were to leave College prior to his senior year (2015-16), the Flames would retain his rights until June 1, 2017. If he plays his senior year, then the Flames will need to sign him prior to August 15, 2016, or they'll lose his rights.
   
   
2. The player starts his freshman year the fall after he was drafted (Mark Jankowski is an example of this). Jankowski was drafted in 2012 and started his freshman year that same fall. If he were to leave College prior to his senior year (2015-16), the Flames would retain his rights until June 1, 2016. If he plays his senior year, then the Flames will need to sign him prior to August 15, 2016, or they'll lose his rights.
   
   
3. The player is drafted one year but doesn't start his college career until a year later (Justin Schultz is an example of this). Schultz was drafted in 2008, but didn't start his freshman year until 2009. Had he played in his senior year, the Ducks would have held his rights until August 15, 2013. Instead, he declared that he was leaving college in late May, 2012. This invoked the 30 day out clause and the Ducks' draft rights expired in late June, 2012.

[Split98]

I think my favourite part of the Hayes discussion (besides the depth we add if he DOES sign here) is the ongoing discussion of whether or not Johnny Hockey's brilliance inflated his stats.

Either way... we win!

[ForeverFlameFan]

It'd be pretty sweet to see if the success of the BC line could translate onto AHL ice.

[dustyanddaflames]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

It'd be pretty sweet to see if the success of the BC line could translate onto AHL ice.

I hope the bolded part is not part of management's pitch to Hayes

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by dustyanddaflames

I hope the bolded part is not part of management's pitch to Hayes

Meh, if he thinks he's so entitled to an NHL spot, then I want no part of him on the Flames. That's just ridiculous.

[hurtin_albertan]

Originally Posted by Split98

I think my favourite part of the Hayes discussion (besides the depth we add if he DOES sign here) is the ongoing discussion of whether or not Johnny Hockey's brilliance inflated his stats.

Either way... we win!

I haven't followed this thread closely so not sure if this has been posted or not, and I know Lambert's opinion isn't highly regarded among Flames fans, but he posted this article last week and claims to have seen Hayes play quite a bit. If you don't want to read the article, Lambert claims that Hayes was a star no matter who he played with, and that his production wasn't all Gadreau-driven.

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nh...141345214.html

[FBI]

Yeah that was posted a few pages ago.

[Textcritic]

^
I wil admit that I—like Lambert, was more impressed by Hayes before the WC. He was pretty useless there.