Once again Israel shows it doesn't screw around

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by nik-

Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. Sorry, the guy was non-violent and got attacked. I personally think he deserved it and am fine with a cop not arresting the guy, but you are the one who stated that the cop has to arrest the offender.

You can't have it both ways.

Sure arrest both of them, charge one with assault and one with inciting hate.

[J epworth]

Originally Posted by nik-

Interesting how your opinion flips when it's reversed. Really you should think that the cop has no other duty but to arrest the person committing the assault, not the counter protester.

Because his opinion is on two completely different actions. The first was protesters attacking counter-protestors, while this most recent was an idiot promoting hate and getting assaulted by security.

If you don't think placing a swastika on an Israeli flag and spitting Kill all Palesitinian children falls under this then I can see how you think he's being hypocritical, but it seems to me two totally different situations.

From the criminal code of Canada:
Hate propaganda" means "any writing, sign or visible representation that advocates or promotes genocide or the communication of which by any person would constitute an offence under section 319

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Bullsh%t

So I guess you're ok with white supremists walking down the streak calling people n%gger during their rallies and holding up banners that advocate lynichings.

Or the hastag hitler was right

Or Westboro Baptist church and their idocy, I guess that's freedom of expression and not inciting hate.

Or is it just in this case that you're ok with equating Israel with Nazi's?

Not sure about Canada, but in the US there is a very famous law case that guarantees exactly what you're railing against.

[nik-]

Hey, whatever makes you guys justify it in your heads, I don't really care.

It's an inverse situation that completely shows your bias. That's fine though, everyone has them in this situation.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Seems like this will only get worse now.

Gaza health officials say 15 people have been killed and more than 150 wounded by an Israeli airstrike in a crowded shopping area.

The Israeli military had no immediate comment.

Gaza health ministry official Ashraf al-Kidra says the area was busy Wednesday because residents thought a cease-fire was in place. The Palestinian Red Crescent confirmed the death toll.

Israel had earlier announced a "humanitarian window" in certain parts of the territory. It said it would not halt fire in other areas, including in Shijaiyah, where the strike took place.

Gaza militants had fired several rockets at Israel earlier.

http://news.yahoo.com/gaza-strike-ki...152917015.html

[_Q_]

I agree that putting a swastika on an Israeli flag is offensive, but so is waving an Israeli flag in front of a group of Palestinians. Trying to figure out which symbol is more offensive than the other is foolish. The point is, both the swastika guy and the Israeli flag guy did what they did to get a rise of the other side.

There are laws in Canada with regards to provocation, ie. if you you assault an individual that provoked the assault then you're innocent in the eyes of the law.

In my opinion, the police acted correctly in both these situations.

[CaptainCrunch]

And you don't have bias Nik?

If you can't see the difference between a guy wearing a nations flag and getting stomped for wearing that flag

And someone who puts one of the most Heinous symbols of the last hundred years and tries to insight violence, I have to wonder about your so called lacked of bias in this situation.

And your last post to me is pretty hypocritical, your bias, and everyone's bias including my own has been pretty much exposed in this thread.

[FlamesAddiction]

I found the sign offensive. Using a swastika around Jews in that fashion, you have to know that there is going to be an issue. Also, pulling the Nazi card pretty much kills any rational discussion.

Still, no excuse for a physical confrontation, but I feel the guy was provoking it.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by _Q_

I agree that putting a swastika on an Israeli flag is offensive, but so is waving an Israeli flag in front of a group of Palestinians. Trying to figure out which symbol is more offensive than the other is foolish. The point is, both the swastika guy and the Israeli flag guy did what they did to get a rise of the other side.

There are laws in Canada with regards to provocation, ie. if you you assault an individual that provoked the assault then you're innocent in the eyes of the law.

In my opinion, the police acted correctly in both these situations.

There were Palestinian's waving flags in their protests in front of the Israeli counter protestors would you consider that offensive as well?

And since when is waving a nation states flag offensive?

If that's all it takes to incite one side to violence then there's a problem.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by _Q_

I agree that putting a swastika on an Israeli flag is offensive, but so is waving an Israeli flag in front of a group of Palestinians. Trying to figure out which symbol is more offensive than the other is foolish. The point is, both the swastika guy and the Israeli flag guy did what they did to get a rise of the other side.

There are laws in Canada with regards to provocation, ie. if you you assault an individual that provoked the assault then you're innocent in the eyes of the law.

In my opinion, the police acted correctly in both these situations.

What, that's only true in self defense, as I said, with the guy with the Swastika you charge him with inciting hatred, and you lock up the idiot that got sucked into violence.

In the first case with the guy with the Israeli flag, you arrest the people that assaulted him.

But no, if I go up to you and verbally insult you, or if I go up to lets say a Canucks fan and wave a Flames fan in their face, you don't have a right to punch me out and your certainly not innocent.

Your interpretation is insanely weird.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

And you don't have bias Nik?

If you can't see the difference between a guy wearing a nations flag and getting stomped for wearing that flag

And someone who puts one of the most Heinous symbols of the last hundred years and tries to insight violence, I have to wonder about your so called lacked of bias in this situation.

And your last post to me is pretty hypocritical, your bias, and everyone's bias including my own has been pretty much exposed in this thread.

Yeah, like I said, everyone has bias. I didn't say it wasn't offensive, I actually said the guy deserved a beating, just like I said the guy at the other rally didn't make the best choice showing up with an Israeli flag at a Palestinian rally. I didn't say in that scenario that the guy deserved it, like I think the guy in this case did.

I'm just pointing out a pretty flagrant difference in opinion you have when the sides are flipped. Don't get mad about it, I'm not making anything up here.

[CaptainCrunch]

I'm hardly mad about it, we're just talking here. If I gave off that sense, I apologize, I'm pretty straight forward in how I discuss things.

Like I said, in my mind they are two different scenarios. But in both cases the violence was wrong. But in the lastest case I doubt anyone can argue that a guy that puts a Nazi symbol on a Israli flag is looking for a reaction and is inciting hate.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by nik-

Interesting how your opinion flips when it's reversed. Really you should think that the cop has no other duty but to arrest the person committing the assault, not the counter protester.

You either have no grasp of history, or are willfully ignorant to support your own argument. Either way, this comment is disgusting.

[nik-]

I agree that violence is wrong. However, both sides were looking for reaction with their actions. Yes, showing up to a Palestinian rally while attacks are occurring in Palestinian territories is inflammatory. Obviously just not as inflammatory as putting a swastika on an Israeli flag.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

You either have no grasp of history, or are willfully ignorant to support your own argument. Either way, this comment is disgusting.

I have a perfectly fine grasp of history ... thanks though.

[Flash Walken]

Freedom of speech only extends to the speech I like.

[CaptainCrunch]

If you want true freedom of speech then you have to be ok with all manners of hate speech. We as a society have said that we are ok with freedom of speech as long as it isn't based in spreading hateful messages or inciting violence through the application of hateful symbols or words.

.

[nik-]

Neo-Nazis were allowed to have a little march in our city a few years back ... I think it's pretty safe to say their entire message is hate.

[Fozzie_DeBear]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

If you want true freedom of speech then you have to be ok with all manners of hate speech. We as a society have said that we are ok with freedom of speech as long as it isn't based in spreading hateful messages or inciting violence through the application of hateful symbols or words.

.

The hateful speech part is a grey area...its tough to protect peoples right to be offensive but that is what we need. Just because people are offended is not enough of a reason to censor them...

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by nik-

Neo-Nazis were allowed to have a little march in our city a few years back ... I think it's pretty safe to say their entire message is hate.

Yes, but that doesn't mean that anyone had the right to assault them first of all. And I disagreed that the police didn't break up that protest or not allow it to happen.

If I remember correctly their message was based around white pride, but they didn't have banners up talking about genocide or sliding Jews into a oven. So it was pretty smart on the Nazi's part in a lot of ways that they tempered their message of stupidity in the protest.