[News] With the 21st overall pick Flames select C Mark Jankowski

[nik-]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

There would be 100x less obsessive hate. Guys like myself, Caged Great, getbak etc etc would still be talking about him just as much.

Probably not. No one can say for sure though.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by nik-

If Jankowski wants to be top 6 on this team, he better gain 20 more pounds and be playing Right Wing.

Hey...that's not such a bad idea...

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Hackey

EDIT: Let's not get into an arguement over if there is a board or not.

We should't, because there isn't.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

We should't, because there isn't.

Yes officer.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by dieHARDflameZ

I'm not justifying why or why not Jankowski was picked. I'm saying given hindsight, it's really easy for people to say now "we should have taken Ceci, Maata, or Girgensons"...etc. Quite frankly at the time, I don't think the Flames were in a position to draft a long term project.

It's not hindsight. At the time of the pick, Jankowski was a reach. People on this forum, and the media - pretty much everyone except Feaster and Weisbrod - were surprised by the pick. If the Stars take John Roslovic 12th overall in the upcoming draft, you will see similar puzzlement and second-guessing.

Originally Posted by Da_Chief

Seriously is it so damn hard to understand this concept?

I understand the concept that for some fans there is never a legitimate time to express doubt about a prospect. Heck, there are some Flames fans only now reluctantly admitting that John Ramage may not be a sure-fire 2nd pairing defenceman. I just wish the fan cops would tone it down and let other fans express their opinions without opening fire.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

There would be 100x less obsessive hate. Guys like myself, Caged Great, getbak etc etc would still be talking about him just as much.

For me, its more tempered expectations. He looks more like Greg Neimsz than an Emile Poirier at this point. I hope I'm wrong.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Hackey

And if we hadn't traded down and passed on a number of perceieved better players and picked someone that was considered off the board.

EDIT: Let's not get into an arguement over if there is a board or not.

Holy crap, get over it. We picked Jankowski.

[GreenLantern2814]

If you've ever wondered how Tywin Lannister could hate Tyrion so much, just read this thread front to back.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Hackey

And if we hadn't traded down and passed on a number of perceieved better players and picked someone that was considered off the board.

Whose perception? There were a number of picks in that draft that were "off the board" or unexpected. Believe it or not, THN does not have any great insight into the players. They base their list off an aggregate of what they cull speaking to scouts from various teams. Their list is not the end-all-be-all and is not going to be like any specific team's.

EDIT: Let's not get into an arguement over if there is a board or not.

Let's not, because there isn't.

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

For me, its more tempered expectations. He looks more like Greg Neimsz than an Emile Poirier at this point. I hope I'm wrong.

And you've seen him how many times, because Mark Jankowski is nothing like Greg Neimsz. There is nothing in their games that makes them comparable in any way.

This is the part of the argument about Jankowski that drives me up the wall. Those that have not watched the kid make wild assed assumptions based on his stats from the hockeydb. Those that actually have opportunity or take the time to watch the kid come away impressed and are quickly converted to fans. They can see he has all the tools and is working hard in improving where the Flames and his coaches tell him to. He is the epitome of a prospect working on his game. It is funny, but Baertschi was considered as a great prospect by those same people who watch prospects by the hockeydb, yet he quickly turned into a poor prospect. That was because Baertschi refused to do what was asked of him and he brought a piss poor attitude to his development. Jankowski is the opposite. He's a draft pick that has turned into a damn fine prospect because he does what he is asked to do, showing an incredible willingness to be part of the team in what ever role is asked of him. He has the attitude of a winner. He has the character to be a player. This is why the Flames like him and still look at him as a player with a future.

[The Fonz]

If asked whether or not I believe in The Board, I'd answer the same as when I'm asked if I believe in God.

"Which one?"

Religious people do not like this answer, and I'd suspect Board people do not like it either.


There are hundreds of different Boards. Just because someone does not follow the one you've chosen to believe as being the correct Board, does not mean they're going "off the board". Maybe it's your Board that is wrong... Or perhaps... there is just no Board, and so arguing about who's is the correct one is just silly.

Board.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by New Era

Whose perception? There were a number of picks in that draft that were "off the board" or unexpected. Believe it or not, THN does not have any great insight into the players. They base their list off an aggregate of what they cull speaking to scouts from various teams. Their list is not the end-all-be-all and is not going to be like any specific team's.

Let's not, because there isn't.



And you've seen him how many times, because Mark Jankowski is nothing like Greg Neimsz. There is nothing in their games that makes them comparable in any way.

This is the part of the argument about Jankowski that drives me up the wall. Those that have not watched the kid make wild assed assumptions based on his stats from the hockeydb. Those that actually have opportunity or take the time to watch the kid come away impressed and are quickly converted to fans. They can see he has all the tools and is working hard in improving where the Flames and his coaches tell him to. He is the epitome of a prospect working on his game. It is funny, but Baertschi was considered as a great prospect by those same people who watch prospects by the hockeydb, yet he quickly turned into a poor prospect. That was because Baertschi refused to do what was asked of him and he brought a piss poor attitude to his development. Jankowski is the opposite. He's a draft pick that has turned into a damn fine prospect because he does what he is asked to do, showing an incredible willingness to be part of the team in what ever role is asked of him. He has the attitude of a winner. He has the character to be a player. This is why the Flames like him and still look at him as a player with a future.

I meant Neimsz in terms of his development path... not in their playing style.

And I suspect most of the people who are vehemently supporting Jankowski also supported Neimsz and Pelech until the bitter end as well. Nothing wrong with being optimistic, but I try to look at these guys with a skeptical eye if they aren't producing prior to being in the toughest league in the world.

I see Jankowski becoming a Brian Boyle type player (although Boyle was a much bigger scorer in college) at best at this point.

[tvp2003]

Janko's almost like an anti-Gaudreau. Johnny put up huge stats at BC, but people fixated on two numbers: his height and weight. In the end, it was his hockey ability that he was able to translate to the NHL level that has made him successful -- it's obvious when you watch him play but you wouldn't know it if you simply looked at the numbers.

Similarly, Janko has good measurables (great size, weight going in the right direction), but his scoring stats are not impressive. Again, it will be his hockey ability and whether he can translate those skills to the NHL that will dictate his future.

So the moral of the story is, unless Jankowski earns a roster spot in 2016/17 and gets nominated for a Calder, he's a bust. Wait, what?

[neo45]

The Jankowski pick was fine at 21. He is not a boom bust prospect, especially not now that he has played NCAA. His size, skating, and hockey sense actually make him a safe bet to make the NHL at some point in his career. Grimaldi is a boom bust prospect, for example.

The dumb part about that draft was trading down seven spots in the mid first round. Too much and the return wasn't particularly great from Buffalo

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by neo45

The Jankowski pick was fine at 21. He is not a boom bust prospect, especially not now that he has played NCAA. His size, skating, and hockey sense actually make him a safe bet to make the NHL at some point in his career. Grimaldi is a boom bust prospect, for example.

The dumb part about that draft was trading down seven spots in the mid first round. Too much and the return wasn't particularly great from Buffalo

It's hard to say at this point. Seiloff is now a long-shot to become an NHLer, but who knows how much farther along he'd be without that missed year. At the time of the pick, it seemed he may be a decent bottom 4 defensemen and good replacement for Cory Sarich.

If Seiloff was still a relevant piece from the 2012 draft, this thread would have a completely different tone.

[Niemo]

It would be a mistake to let Jankowski go. I'm surprised that we didn't sign him, but management must be confident that he will sign with us after his senior year of college. Jankowski is not a kid that you give up on. He's been progressing and has the tools to be an impact player - whether that's 2nd line winger or 3rd line C. His size and skating combo is not something that can be taught, and the kid has skill!

He is like a Joe Colborne type project with a higher upside IMO. A year in the AHL after his senior year and I think he may be ready for NHL 3rd line action. He'll only be 23 yrs old, which is not bad for breaking into the best league in the world at his size. Hopefully he gets to be a 220 lbs by that time or a strong 215 lbs.

[dieHARDflameZ]

I'd be curious to know how many of the posters bashing the Jankowski pick have even watched him play...

[Caged Great]

Another thing you have to consider is the quality of Janko's linemates. In the games that were shown, you could see him make a good play that the other players on his line were just not prepared for and the play died. If you put him with similarly talented offensive forwards, he would definitely have more goals assists and points. Look at Monahan in his first year in Calgary, he could create offense by himself, but his linemates were all below average. That resulted in him scoring almost twice as much as he assisted on. Now that he has proper linemates that mesh with his own abilities, he went from 34 points up over 60. I'm not saying that Jankowski will magically become an awesome 1st line forward, but if he was put on a line with two competent forwards, he should produce a lot more because he has good offensive instincts.

[Dime_On_Flames]

Did management reach by trading down and drafting Jankowski? Hell yes! It doesn't make him a bad prospect but it does give us fans a certain level of expectation from him (realistically or unrealistically)

I agree that if Seiloff was progressing at a higher rate then the merits of the trade down wouldn't be argued as fiercely.

I'll temper my expectations and look for him to be the next David Steckell, as per Burkie. If that's what becomes of Janks I guess that wouldn't be the worst first round pick the Flames have ever made.

[GioforPM]

I feel like there are posters who have urealistic expectations of Jankowski and/or over-deefnd him based on his draft position and a need to defend Feaster (which is evident in other threads).Sort of like those who were heavily invested in Sven Baerstchi and defended him notwithstanding his lack of progress.

On the other hand there are posters who overly criticize and are negative towards his potential based on his draft position and the fact it was viewed as an off-the-board pick. Sort of like those who bash player X based on salary, and not what they aer actually contributing (i.e. Stajan).

To me the only questions are whether he is developing satisfactorally and has a decent shot at the Flames, or the NHL in general.

[polak]

I'm a huge Feaster fan/supporter and I still think this pick was pretty bad.

It happens.