[Signing] Gaudreau to Columbus (7 x $9.75 million)

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by transplant99

So you assume he was possibly truly torn on leaving Calgary, but we dont know for sure...correct?

Yet we also do not know what JG/Gross said to the club leading them to believe he would stay but we dont know for sure....also correct?

But you have declared management at fault and all anger should be directed at them?

Sorry, whether or not you think BT is a good GM or not, one thing he is not...is dumb. He was not just hoping on a wish and a prayer that things would get done, there was clearly information that led him to believe that.

With the final destination and value of the contract decided upon, I think that validates it completely. JG was not returning at any price and there was no way that decision was reached 48 hours ago. That should have been relayed to the Flames long before July 12.

Originally Posted by transplant99

He still could have informed Flame management long before he did which would have allowed them to pivot to a different course of action at/before the draft and into UFA day.

There was zero reason to draw this out as he did when it was clear he was moving on as is his right.

Is this a game where you get to assume but I don't? Trelving put himself and the Flames in this situation. Not Johnny Gaudreau. That's a fact.

[bluejays]

Originally Posted by devo22

I'm not going to defend Tre, but it does appear to me that Gaudreau was stringing them along and, despite engaging in week-long negotiations, never had any intentions of staying in Calgary. There's plenty of blame to go around and the Flames better learn from this, but heaping all of the blame on Tre is not fair either. Gaudreau and his camp simply did not negotiate in good faith if he was happy to give up $15m without even going home.

Agree with this as well. If he has no intention, what is he negotiating and talking about? I really do wonder if they were trying to hit a home run at say $11.5M, and at that point anxiety be damned he’d come back.

[iloveicedhockey]

"we don't know what went on in the negotiations at all but what we do know for sure is that this is completely and utterly on Treliving and no one else". Some good posts on here.

I thinks there's a little of everything in here, some bad faith negotiation/changing of minds, some unwillingness to rip the band aid, some misreading of the situation, some poor advice, a genuinely difficult decision, and the scenario where we (and Johnny) were doing excellently in the season.

Maybe more comes out later that explains which of the above is more to blame but until then I'll believe that's its just a crappy mix of all the above. Also add me to the camp that thinks the last 3 years of that 8 x 10.5 offer could have been brutal. C'est la vie.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by iamca

. A chance to continue playing alongside Matthew Tkachuk and Elias Lindholm on what was the best line in hockey last season.

Good luck finding any of that with the Blue Jackets, a nondescript team in a college football town, which lacks a No. 1 centre and has spent its existence as a bubble team at best.

Elias Lindholm was never considered a number one centre... until he got to play with Gaudreau.

Kent Johnson is arguably sporting superior upside and will probably win the Calder if he plays next to Gaudreau.

Tkachuk is a great player, but Laine's probably more effective at his peak since he can bomb from anywhere on the ice and is a superior skater. He was a big part of Winnipeg's WCF run.

Zach Werenski is also a bonafide #1D with elite skating ability.

Kekkalainen is also no worse a GM than Treliving.

Is that every part pf the picture? No, but I so nonr real reason the CBJ can't be as competitive over the next ~four years as Calgary would have been. Coaching, maybe. Outside of that though our roster sans Gaudreau is pretty underwhelming.

[MRCboicgy]

Gotta get that NIL money from the boosters in Columbus I guess.


Maybe they'll let him dot the i this fall...

[Saqe]

Laine should hit 50 with Gaudreau

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Elias Lindholm was never considered a number one centre... until he got to play with Gaudreau.

Kent Johnson is arguably sporting superior upside and will probably win the Calder if he plays next to Gaudreau.

Tkachuk is a great player, but Laine's probably more effective at his peak since he can bomb from anywhere on the ice and is a superior skater. He was a big part of Winnipeg's WCF run.

Zach Werenski is also a bonafide #1D with elite skating ability.

Kekkalainen is also no worse a GM than Treliving.

Is that every part pf the picture? No, but I so nonr real reason the CBJ can't be as competitive over the next ~four years as Calgary would have been. Coaching, maybe. Outside of that though our roster sans Gaudreau is pretty underwhelming.

Cole Sillinger had a solid rookie campaign as well. I don't think the Jackets are going to be a powerhouse but the addition of Gaudreau will probably do for them what it did for the Flames which is a lot.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Gaudreau didn't owe the Flames anything. He fulfilled his obligations to the team and gave the Flames years of high quality play. I see no reason that he would purposely negotiate in bad faith here. If Johnny told his agent that he is still considering the Flames then the agent is going to try to sting things along as long as possible to get the best offer. That's probably all it boils down to but if you want to put on a tinfoil hat and conclude that he did this on purpose to screw Treliving or the Flames then good for you.

sorry, but "he didn't owe the Flames anything" is such a weak argument. Of course he didn't, but if a team drafts you, develops you and employs you for almost a decade, it would be more than fair to give them a heads up about his intentions to leave. And I'm not saying he did this on purpose, but still, it does leave a very bitter taste in my mouth how he and his camp have handled this. And I certainly don't need a tinfoil hat for that. I know just blaming Tre for everything is the hip thing to do, but I certainly didn't expect Gaudreau to play this the way he did.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

His parents can fly to Columbus in 90 minutes

Without crossing an international border. A border that was closed for much of the last two years.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Gaudreau didn't owe the Flames anything. He fulfilled his obligations to the team and gave the Flames years of high quality play. I see no reason that he would purposely negotiate in bad faith here. If Johnny told his agent that he is still considering the Flames then the agent is going to try to sting things along as long as possible to get the best offer. That's probably all it boils down to but if you want to put on a tinfoil hat and conclude that he did this on purpose to screw Treliving or the Flames then good for you.

I see plenty of reasons he would string them along. Maybe the Flames would make a truly dumb offer out of desperation that was so rich he could stomach it. Maybe he figured that leaks of high prices could help when he entered real negotiations with east coast teams. And we aren’t really talking about Gaudreau making all the decisions. Technically the player instructs the agent, but those guys are relied on heavily. My clients instruct me. But they start by saying “what should I do”. And I can’t recall the last time I was told to do something I recommended against. Stringing the Flames along wouldn’t be to harm the Flames. It would be to help his own cause.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Is this a game where you get to assume but I don't? Trelving put himself and the Flames in this situation. Not Johnny Gaudreau. That's a fact.

It's a fact is it?

How do you know that?

Is it not entirely possible that ownership insisted that BT try and re-sign him when BT wanted to possibly trade him?

Is it not possible that JG assured his teammates and/or management he wanted to return but did not really have that inclination?

I mean this thing should have been dealt with last summer IMO and if he wasnt signing...then see ya.

Something prevented/handcuffed them from accomplishing that. I'm going to assume it wasn't management doing it to themselves, so it was another force at play. I think that is a reasonable/logical position...no?

Either way, yes its a bad look...for every single entity involved other than the Blue Jackets. They are the only winners in all of this.

Im not defending BT as a GM here as I think its time for a change and a fresh approach among the braintrust, but in this particular case I cant lay the blame at his feet when the player was literally negotiating to the last day and then turns around and leaves for 15 million dollars less.

[The Fonz]

I just still can't make sense of why he didn't sign in NJ for the same or better money, that's what bugs me the most. I refuse to believe that NJ wouldn't have given him 10M x 7yrs.

Unless he legitimately believes that the future is brighter for the Jackets? And maybe it is - I'm not overly familiar with either roster TBH.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Elias Lindholm was never considered a number one centre... until he got to play with Gaudreau.

Kent Johnson is arguably sporting superior upside and will probably win the Calder if he plays next to Gaudreau.

Tkachuk is a great player, but Laine's probably more effective at his peak since he can bomb from anywhere on the ice and is a superior skater. He was a big part of Winnipeg's WCF run.

Zach Werenski is also a bonafide #1D with elite skating ability.

Kekkalainen is also no worse a GM than Treliving.

Is that every part pf the picture? No, but I so nonr real reason the CBJ can't be as competitive over the next ~four years as Calgary would have been. Coaching, maybe. Outside of that though our roster sans Gaudreau is pretty underwhelming.

Nah, Laine is nowhere near what people thought and “at his peak” is doing a lot of work there. There’s a reason he’s in Columbus. And while no one thought Lindholm was a 1C (which actually isn’t true - he was drafted as one), he is now considered one and was a top 3 Selke nominee. Johnson might become a 1C one day. But that’s years away, and Gaudreau is 29. When Johnson hits his peak, Gaudreau is 35. The next four years Calgary would have been the same or better (assuming some minor additions, and guys like Coleman and Toffoli getting their game back). CBJ would have been still trying to make up 20 points on the caps.

[Flamesfan05]

Treliving gambled and lost the franchise player and he is not without blame? Check your koolaid. How many team has lost their best player in his prime for nothing?

[flam12345]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Gaudreau didn't owe the Flames anything. He fulfilled his obligations to the team and gave the Flames years of high quality play. I see no reason that he would purposely negotiate in bad faith here. If Johnny told his agent that he is still considering the Flames then the agent is going to try to sting things along as long as possible to get the best offer. That's probably all it boils down to but if you want to put on a tinfoil hat and conclude that he did this on purpose to screw Treliving or the Flames then good for you.

Technically yes, but he was with the Flames for a long timeYou can do this at a company that treats you badly or a pointless job, but at a club where you've been for years, where you have friends, colleagues and teammates and fans who cheered you on for years, doing the bare minimum just doesn't cut it, if you want respect for your decision.
And that only refers to the negotiations with the flames up to the deadline, I don't care about anything that happened after that.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Treliving gambled and lost the franchise player and he is not without blame? Check your koolaid. How many team has lost their best player in his prime for nothing?

You seem incapable of acknowledging that this was not Treliving’s decision alone. Ownership is equally responsible, a twelve year old should be able to see that.

[djsFlames]

Again i think the best way to sum it up was that this was handled immaturely by Gaudreau.

The lack of transparency and honesty, while he had a set of "top destinations" that weren't Calgary is a bad look when all is said and done.

Does it make him a rotten guy? No, not really because he's within his rights. And I do think he had some consideration for Calgary until the week before, but he had to have known it wasn't going to be enough ahead of time.

I just look back to when I strung along people in my life. Or got someone's hopes up about something and left them hanging. In retrospect I felt it to be immature handling of those situations on my part and wished I had just been straightforward with them because then it would've saved them unnecessary pain.

So when I see how Gaudreau handled this with the Flames, how he was kind of casual and not clear on where he was leaning, leaving the GM's hands tied to do other things (and yes, the Flames also put themselves in that spot where they could be made vulnerable) and keeping them in the dark into the final day, I just see a guy that doesn't take these things seriously and didn't have a lot of consideration for his old team.

Its fine to get out of the spotlight. But this also shows that Johnny's maybe not the passionate guy we took him to be. He will take anonymity over a place where the game is celebrated and where he can play meaningful hockey, and so that should speak volumes about where the guy's motivations are.

Maybe what the Flames need are guys who want to be here and feed off of the passion around the game here rather than shy away from it.

It's strange, but this could be a blessing in disguise. Maybe Gaudreau, even with all of his skill, isn't the guy that you want driving your team if you're looking to win.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Treliving gambled and lost the franchise player and he is not without blame? Check your koolaid. How many team has lost their best player in his prime for nothing?

trying to paint these things as black or white is seriously frustrating. Of course Tre is not without blame, far from it. But heaping all of the blame on him is not fair either.

[The Cobra]

It's hard to find a set of facts that makes all of this make any sense.

Other than how much Johnny's social anxiety played into this decision.

Perhaps he was conflicted about leaving Calgary, because he liked Calgary so much and how well he was treated. And especially because he dreaded telling Calgary he was turning his back on them.

Perhaps he hoped that coming back to Calgary would become an option for him, but as time got closer to making a decision, his anxiety increased and he couldn't do it.

Columbus then became his preferred destination, where he can play with less pressure.

The latest playoff "run" and loss to hated rivals Edmonton may have clinched him going, as opposed to the prevailing thought that a long run would make him more likely to stay. I expect losing to Edmonton has resulted in a number of (differing) feelings among the Calgary players. I'm not sure we ever considered the fact that a player may be is thinking "I sure don't want to go through that again", losing to a hated rival in a rabbit Canadian market.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Treliving gambled and lost the franchise player and he is not without blame? Check your koolaid. How many team has lost their best player in his prime for nothing?

Well, the Columbus Blue Jackets for one.

Treliving gambled that Gaudreau was being up front with him, while in the knowledge that Johnny’s stock was at an all time low, and the return on a trade would be very unsatisfactory. If someone is still negotiating with you it normally means that they are prepared to accept an offer if it’s the right amount.

Basically you want Treliving to assume Gaudreau is lying and negotiating in bad faith.