Family who are 'too lazy to work' say £22,000 worth of benefits is not enough

[OilersBaby]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I always thought the 'midwest' referred to the states of Iowa, Missouri, Kansas, Nebraska.

Ok not sure exactly what it refers to, but they're included too...

[4X4]

Originally Posted by OilersBaby

Ok not sure exactly what it refers to, but they're included too...

I don't know either. Was hoping that someone knew.

[Azure]

British Press?

Article was in the Calgary Herald.

I'm not going to 'argue' with you or something like this again. Both studies show that increased egg consumption does not negatively effect your cholesterol level. And yes, if an increased consumption of dietary cholesterol increases your HDL level, then it would decrease the risk of heart disease.

[Azure]

Ah hell, why not.

Dietary Cholesterol from Eggs Increases Plasma HDL Cholesterol in Overweight Men Consuming a Carbohydrate-Restricted Diet.

Increasing intake of dietary cholesterol from eggs in the context of a low-fat diet maintains the LDL cholesterol (LDL-C)/HDL-C for both hyper- and hypo-responders to dietary cholesterol.

http://jn.nutrition.org/cgi/content/abstract/138/2/272

This research provides further evidence to support the now established scientific understanding that saturated fat in the diet (most often found in pastry, processed meats, biscuits and cakes) is more responsible for raising blood cholesterol than cholesterol-rich foods, such as eggs.

(PhysOrg.com) -- Research published in The European Journal of Nutrition this week has finally cracked the myths surrounding eggs and cholesterol. The new study showed that people who ate two eggs per day, while on a calorie-restricted diet, not only lost weight but also reduced their blood cholesterol levels.

http://www.physorg.com/news139156140.html

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNew...hub=PrintStory

http://www.enc-online.org/GoodNews.htm

[J pold]

Eggs are the best!

[Swarly]

Originally Posted by J pold

Eggs are the best!

I agree, they are awesome.

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=69721

[4X4]

nm

[Ch40s]

Originally Posted by Azure

Dietary Cholesterol from Eggs Increases Plasma HDL Cholesterol in Overweight Men Consuming a Carbohydrate-Restricted Diet.

Increasing intake of dietary cholesterol from eggs in the context of a low-fat diet maintains the LDL cholesterol (LDL-C)/HDL-C for both hyper- and hypo-responders to dietary cholesterol.

Wow, why do I have to point this out to you? Just read it... the low fat diet is resulting in lower cholesterol/LDL; when cholesterol is increased on this diet, the LDL and HDL are maintained.

If someone who has high cholesterol values and only reduces cholesterol intake, their cholesterol values will lower. Not necessarily LDL cholesterol, and not necessarily HDL cholesterol (will rise).

This research provides further evidence to support the now established scientific understanding that saturated fat in the diet (most often found in pastry, processed meats, biscuits and cakes) is more responsible for raising blood cholesterol than cholesterol-rich foods, such as eggs.

Seriously why do I have to point this out to you? Can you not read?

They're saying saturated fat is more of a factor in blood cholesterol (doesn't specify which) than dietary cholesterol.

Your claim was

There is no link between high consumption of dietary cholesterol, and an increase in your 'bad' cholesterol.

Remembering there are 3 types of cholesterol; HDL, LDL and plain old cholesterol. Decreasing total cholesterol intake will help lower LDL and cholesterol.

Seriously, why are you making mindless claims? You read one article (incorrectly, I may add), and now you're an expert? This is pretty pathetic. Stop spreading misinformation, thanks.

[FireFly]

A single neck in that picture is bigger than my head. I'm just sayin.

[CaptainCrunch]

I took a couple of my co-workers out today to the Asian Buffet and had the old flashback to the fatty family as I was picking out food and came across a tray of hotdogs and bacon swimming in grease.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Ch40s

Remembering there are 3 types of cholesterol; HDL, LDL and plain old cholesterol. Decreasing total cholesterol intake will help lower LDL and cholesterol.

And increasing total cholesterol intake will do what?

Face it. Claims were for years, especially in regards to eggs, that a diet high in dietary cholesterol would also increase your cholesterol levels. Now, research is showing that SAT/TRANS fats may have a bigger effect on your cholesterol levels than dietary cholesterol does.

The studies I linked too had subjects increasing their dietary cholesterol consumption, and decreasing their fat consumption, and their cholesterol levels either dropped, or the HDL levels went up.

Showing that an increase in dietary cholesterol had no 'bad' effect on your HDL/LDL levels.

My initial claim....

There is no link between high consumption of dietary cholesterol, and an increase in your 'bad' cholesterol.

is saying exactly that. Research is showing that 'fats' affect our cholesterol levels more than dietary cholesterol does. Reversing the claim that for years, foods with high levels of dietary cholesterol were bad for you.

This is like the creatine debate all over again.

[Ch40s]

Originally Posted by Azure

And increasing total cholesterol intake will do what?

It will do the opposite, wow...

High cholesterol in your diet is a factor in having high blood LDL and cholesterol. Seriously, this is a simple concept.

Face it. Claims were for years, especially in regards to eggs, that a diet high in dietary cholesterol would also increase your cholesterol levels. Now, research is showing that SAT/TRANS fats may have a bigger effect on your cholesterol levels than dietary cholesterol does.

I'm fairly certain that there's always been more of a focus on saturated and trans fats, which are really quite terrible for you (especially trans), rather than on cholesterol.

And it remains true that a high cholesterol diet is a factor in having high LDL and cholesterol. There's a reason the RDA is 300 mg, which is about 2 1/2 eggs.

The studies I linked too had subjects increasing their dietary cholesterol consumption, and decreasing their fat consumption, and their cholesterol levels either dropped, or the HDL levels went up.

Showing that an increase in dietary cholesterol had no 'bad' effect on your HDL/LDL levels.

I just linked the snippets from the articles you are using. Please do not make such false claims; it clearly said both LDL and HDL stayed the same after they decreased from lower fat and cholesterol diets. Ie the now higher cholesterol caused the LDL and HDL to stop improving from the low fat diet; the cholesterol reversed the positive effects.

My initial claim....



is saying exactly that. Research is showing that 'fats' affect our cholesterol levels more than dietary cholesterol does. Reversing the claim that for years, foods with high levels of dietary cholesterol were bad for you.

Your initial claim suggested a high cholesterol diet had no effect on LDL and cholesterol levels. Completely wrong.

This is like the creatine debate all over again.

It's funny you mention that.

You are getting "facts" off the internet and either misreading or misclaiming them.

I am getting my information from my nutrition class notes (ie taught by a registered dietitian and nutrition researcher) and my textbook. I don't plan on interpreting studies or whatnot based on this information; just strictly reiterating the information here.

When I argued against protein powder it was because of my interpretation of an ACSM article which claimed it should not be substituted into the diet for a meal; of which I thought meant no one should use protein powder. I have since talked with said RD to confirm it meant as a meal substitute, and protein powder is fine if used correctly. Likewise with the creatine arguement and it's unneccesary use in weight training.

In fact, one of my physiology professors was just talking about articles (in the context of genes) and how they often come out before a study is duplicated or even confirmed.

So now I don't go assuming things about information on the internet. This is the whole reason we debated as we did about both protein powder and creatine.

I've since changed my naivety. Now it's your turn.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Ch40s

You are getting "facts" off the internet and either misreading or misclaiming them.

I am getting my information from my nutrition class notes (ie taught by a registered dietitian and nutrition researcher) and my textbook. I don't plan on interpreting studies or whatnot based on this information; just strictly reiterating the information here.

So I guess this is why you haven't posted a single credible link or reference or citation to back up your claims?

Oh and slightly off topic, but you were listed in a chapter in one of my anthropology texts:

Ch4os really enjoys monkey testicles in his spare time.

This is credible because my anthropology professor (He has his DOCTORATE!) is teaching the class.

[Ch40s]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

So I guess this is why you haven't posted a single credible link or reference or citation to back up your claims?

Oh and slightly off topic, but you were listed in a chapter in one of my anthropology texts:

This is credible because my anthropology professor (He has his DOCTORATE!) is teaching the class.

You want some links? I guess I overestimated people like you immensely; you can't even type "dietary cholesterol" into google...

You're laughable.

http://www.netrition.com/rdi_page.html

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...4214457AA1faUu

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cholesterol

http://books.google.com/books?id=yWC...ions_r&cad=0_2

Seriously, get a clue.

[Ch40s]

More links for everyone!

http://www.lowfatlifestyle.com/cholesterol.htm

http://www.americanheart.org/present...dentifier=4488

http://www.healthyontario.com/Featur...x?feature_id=1

You're questioning the simplest of concepts, seriously, it's like we're debating what position the Flames are in the Western standings (it's 3rd, by the way. Need a link to that?).

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Ch40s

More links for everyone!

No thanks!

I prefer Azure's links

[Azure]

Have you read Gary Taubes book 'Bad Calories/Good Calories?'

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/07/ma...g-fat-lie.html

Takes about 'fat'.....saturated fat specifically, and how Taubes/Atkins both feel it has no effect on our weight and health.

His book is fascinating. Once you get your head around the idea that the Federal Government and their nutrition advice has been wrong years upon years, its rather simple to see why refined carbs are the problem.

So, its quite hilarious to watch people vilify the 'fat'.....while saying that carbs are alright.

Taubes goes as far as to say that there is absolutely no scientific evidence to say that saturated fat is bad for you. I'm not really sure about that one, but for a perfectly healthy person, he might have a point.

Walter Willett, chairman of the department of nutrition at the Harvard School of Public Health, may be the most visible proponent of testing this heretic hypothesis. Willett is the de facto spokesman of the longest-running, most comprehensive diet and health studies ever performed, which have already cost upward of $100 million and include data on nearly 300,000 individuals. Those data, says Willett, clearly contradict the low-fat-is-good-health message ''and the idea that all fat is bad for you; the exclusive focus on adverse effects of fat may have contributed to the obesity epidemic.''

They say that low-fat weight-loss diets have proved in clinical trials and real life to be dismal failures, and that on top of it all, the percentage of fat in the American diet has been decreasing for two decades. Our cholesterol levels have been declining, and we have been smoking less, and yet the incidence of heart disease has not declined as would be expected. ''That is very disconcerting,'' Willett says. ''It suggests that something else bad is happening.''

EDIT: I'm not avoiding the 'debate' about dietary cholesterol either.....just don't want to get into a back and forth that makes absolutely no sense. I've already been though this kind of debate about protein powder/creatine with ch40s.

[Ch40s]

Originally Posted by Azure

Have you read Gary Taubes book 'Bad Calories/Good Calories?'

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/07/ma...g-fat-lie.html

Takes about 'fat'.....saturated fat specifically, and how Taubes/Atkins both feel it has no effect on our weight and health.

His book is fascinating. Once you get your head around the idea that the Federal Government and their nutrition advice has been wrong years upon years, its rather simple to see why refined carbs are the problem.

So, its quite hilarious to watch people vilify the 'fat'.....while saying that carbs are alright.

Taubes goes as far as to say that there is absolutely no scientific evidence to say that saturated fat is bad for you. I'm not really sure about that one, but for a perfectly healthy person, he might have a point.


EDIT: I'm not avoiding the 'debate' about dietary cholesterol either.....just don't want to get into a back and forth that makes absolutely no sense. I've already been though this kind of debate about protein powder/creatine with ch40s.

This isn't a ing debate like creatine use would be, my God you're thick.

You'd rather believe ATKINS who is TRYING TO SELL A PRODUCT (Atkin's diet), than OBJECTIVE, SCIENTIFIC, PROVEN facts. I just can't fathom this.

You must own every single product you see on TV. Magic fat burning pills? That person is wearing a white coat! It MUST be FACT! All that science and logic doesn't hold a candle to this advertisement!

Take a damn University course. Or are they out to get you, like these "wrong federal government facts"?

There is so much stupidity on the internet and message boards. This is inane.

I could stroll up to anyone in the health industry, present your little fun psuedo-facts, and they'd respond with "that's wrong, of course high cholesterol raises blood cholesterol". Yet I argue like a sucker.

I'm done with this.

[Azure]

Yeah, have fun. I don't think we need your condencending, arrogant 'advice' around here anyways.

Funny, I talked to my doctor about this when I saw him last, and he admitted that Dr. Atkins had be right after all. He just took it too an extreme.

Every single study being done on 'human health' is showing that our enemy is 'refined carbs'.....not 'fats' like the official federal government nutrition board has been telling us for the past 60 years.

[Itse]

There's tons of diets that don't see fat as a problem, Atkins is just the most famous one.

EDIT: "as THE problem" would be more accurate.