Suzuki ready to hang em up

[Flames in 07]

Not really anything to do with Suzuki, but to show the massive gap between facts and common understanding across most people:

For many years, Cretien had believed to have saved the world from environmental disaster by signing Canada up to Kyoto.

What % of people actually knew that Kyoto had nothing to do with reducing emissions worldwide? It certainly did in Canada, Energy project would not be developed, reducing supply, would have sent energy prices through the roof ... and again for no benefit for the planet as less industrialized countries grew at staggering rates both in absolute size and emissions per capita.

A useless plan with massive support. The conservatives show up, basically say this is a tough one, we are looking at long term solutions but frankly we don't know how to get there. What that lacks in popularity it makes up for in spades in terms of practicality.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

The conservatives show up, basically say this is a tough one, we are looking at long term solutions but frankly we don't know how to get there. What that lacks in popularity it makes up for in spades in terms of practicality.

Doing nothing is practical?

[kipperfan]

Originally Posted by OILFAN #81

When I saw the thread of this title, I was thinking Ichiro LOL!!!!!!

Good ol' David Suzuki.

"You're watching the Nature of Things with David Suzuki, we'll be right back after this commercial break."

I thought the exact same thing.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Doing nothing is practical?

It wasn't doing nothing, it was very long term planning ... nothing concrete right now, but at least they are realistic about how hard this to deal with.

In a dozen years of liberals they had this amazing way of doing squat and meanwhile the populace seems content how things progress ... even though they didn't.

Canadians are getting a dose of real life. Real problems, real process, and albeit not with environmental concerns real answers.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

It wasn't doing nothing, it was very long term planning ... nothing concrete right now, but at least they are realistic about how hard this to deal with.

In a dozen years of liberals they had this amazing way of doing squat and meanwhile the populace seems content how things progress ... even though they didn't.

Canadians are getting a dose of real life. Real problems, real process, and albeit not with environmental concerns real answers.

Lol, you've taken shots at David Suzuki, the CBC, the Liberal party, Kyoto. I think i'm putting the peices together here..are you a conservative by any chance??

[Flames in 07]

haha ... give the man a cigar. In Canadian politics I certianly am.

For economic, legal, environmental things I tend to be right, social stuff I tend to be left.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

haha ... give the man a cigar. In Canadian politics I certianly am.

For economic, legal, environmental things I tend to be right, social stuff I tend to be left.

So as a canadian conservative, where does environmentalism stand on your list of priorities, and whose ideas do you support in terms of fixing environmental problems, if not Suzuki's? Just curious, I don't want to start a ****ing match.

Personally I tend to buy into the urgency that guys like Suzuki have presented, but maybe that's just because of my political views. I view the conservative approach as largely short sighted, kinda like sweeping the problem under the carpet for now.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by Igottago

So as a canadian conservative, where does environmentalism stand on your list of priorities, and whose ideas do you support in terms of fixing environmental problems, if not Suzuki's? Just curious, I don't want to start a ****ing match.

Personally I tend to buy into the urgency that guys like Suzuki have presented, but maybe that's just because of my political views. I view the conservative approach as largely short sighted, kinda like sweeping the problem under the carpet for now.

What has any other political party done? What single piece of action has the Canadian gov't done in the last 15 years that show any REAL action to managing emissions? Kyoto is not action, it passes the buck to the next regime and gives them an impossible problem to deal with ... again with no worldwide benefit.

To me, the Canadian gov't could take a more proactive approach to giving much better tax incentives to both lower emission energy production ... and dedicate current fossil fuel tax to R&D of more sustainable programs.
Right now fossil fuel tax generally goes into general revenue.

Also, as unpopular as it is, the only way to really drive human behavior is to monitize something. I'd like to see us tax fossile fuels in direct proportion to the magintude of emissions ... ie Diesel and JetA has a higher tax than gas. However recognize that meaningful change on the planet has almost nothing to do with Canadian driving habits as what we do is simply lost in the rounding compared to say coal or bunker fueled power production in China and India. Long term meaningful solutions will have to do with technological breakthroughs, not buying Toyota's Echo's.

I don't know what the magic bullet will be in terms of materially reducing emissions worldwide, but I have a guess that it will have to do with an efficient way of 'scrubbing' coal. remove much of the toxic material before it's used.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by Igottago

So as a canadian conservative, where does environmentalism stand on your list of priorities, and whose ideas do you support in terms of fixing environmental problems, if not Suzuki's? Just curious, I don't want to start a ****ing match.

Personally I tend to buy into the urgency that guys like Suzuki have presented, but maybe that's just because of my political views. I view the conservative approach as largely short sighted, kinda like sweeping the problem under the carpet for now.

Also, not to get into a ****ing match, but what makes you say conservatives are sweeping this under the rug, whereas others haven't and have actually been dealing with this head on?

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by Igottago

So as a canadian conservative, where does environmentalism stand on your list of priorities, and whose ideas do you support in terms of fixing environmental problems, if not Suzuki's? Just curious, I don't want to start a ****ing match.

Personally I tend to buy into the urgency that guys like Suzuki have presented, but maybe that's just because of my political views. I view the conservative approach as largely short sighted, kinda like sweeping the problem under the carpet for now.

Oh, and my other possible magic bullet is Gas Hydrates.

Nat Gas is clean burning, and to the extent it can replace heavy fuel oil, coal, and petcoke that will make a massive distance.

Gas Hydrates, if ever economical are estimated to be as plentiful as 50x the amount of current nat gas reserves world wide. We can liquify gas, ship it around the world (although not Canada ... yet anyway) we just need to extract it.

BTW gas hydrates are generally light hydrocarbons found either in ice and under ocean floors.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Also, not to get into a ****ing match, but what makes you say conservatives are sweeping this under the rug, whereas others haven't and have actually been dealing with this head on?

While I don't think Kyoto was a flawless plan, it was something. It was an acknowledgment of the problem. And perhaps being a part of an accord like that would make it possible to make the appropriate amendments to the accord, along with the other nations who chose to get on board. No plan will be fool proof. We can't afford to wait until the perfect plan comes along. So basically, to answer your question, I think the cons have kept going on about the problems with kyoto, without coming up with alternative proposals. And environment doesn't seem to be a top concern for the conservative party.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by Igottago

While I don't think Kyoto was a flawless plan, it was something. It was an acknowledgment of the problem. And perhaps being a part of an accord like that would make it possible to make the appropriate amendments to the accord, along with the other nations who chose to get on board. No plan will be fool proof. We can't afford to wait until the perfect plan comes along. So basically, to answer your question, I think the cons have kept going on about the problems with kyoto, without coming up with alternative proposals. And environment doesn't seem to be a top concern for the conservative party.

First of all, the Conservatives JUST ACKNOWLEDGED A PROBLEM ... double standard.

Also, based on this paragraph it safe to assume that that you would agree that the Liberals actualy did NOTHING right?