[News] UPD: Sharks claim Duehr off waivers from Flames

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by flambers

Flames are so thin at center, why would they do that?

Flames do lack center depth so they shouldn't waive him..but I'm actually less convinced that Rooney should stay in the lineup just because he's a natural center anymore.

We have Backlund and Kadri.

Sharangovich has probably looked better at C than he has W (and that goes back to last season).

Zary is injured but he looked comfortable playing C at the NHL level.

Kerins is a natural center who we have shifted to wing to get his feet wet in the NHL.

So really we have lots of guys who can play center, they are just generally bad at faceoffs and a bit inexperienced...so Rooney has experience and is at 46.9% on faceoffs so not like it's some huge strength for him anyways.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

He hasn’t shown energy for 2 years now

That was his point - Duehr came in 2 years ago with a bit of a dash and then cooled right off. It's possible he will have a similar burst off the bat in SJ.

[Coach]

That'll Duehr.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Bingo

I'm not against it for a limited period of time for sure.

But it's not 1 shift

The top six averages about 14 minutes of 5 on 5 a night, Rooney about 7.5, other fourth liners about 8.5

14-8 is 6 minutes, and the average shift length is 40 seconds.

That's 9 shifts per game for a fourth line call up ... and then arguably more because they were playing closer to 18 minutes a night in the AHL.

My point on the 2 shifts is that if the 4th line is averaging 8:30 today, and you want to get them up to 10:00 minutes (Like Ryan and Mangiapane played in 18-19) then all it is is one shift from each of your top 2 lines (45 seconds each shift) and now they are at 10:00 minutes up from the 8:30.

And I think the big thing is how you structure the 4th line...if you're keeping Rooney and Lomberg and you're just going to call up Stromgren to play him next to those two...then you might as well leave him in the AHL.

But if you're going to create a 4th line that's much more of a skill line, that's going to get sheltered offensive minutes against other team's bottom lines, then I think it's worth it.

I'd argue for guys that have already played 100+ AHL games, that I'd rather they play 10 minutes in the NHL per night (+practice time with NHLers, and more practice time due to generally easier travel schedules), than them playing 18 minutes a night in the AHL.

But that's in a world where it's a line like Hathaway-Ryan-Mangiapane was, not just throwing a young guy with two grinders.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

My point on the 2 shifts is that if the 4th line is averaging 8:30 today, and you want to get them up to 10:00 minutes (Like Ryan and Mangiapane played in 18-19) then all it is is one shift from each of your top 2 lines (45 seconds each shift) and now they are at 10:00 minutes up from the 8:30.

And I think the big thing is how you structure the 4th line...if you're keeping Rooney and Lomberg and you're just going to call up Stromgren to play him next to those two...then you might as well leave him in the AHL.

But if you're going to create a 4th line that's much more of a skill line, that's going to get sheltered offensive minutes against other team's top lines, then I think it's worth it.

I'd argue for guys that have already played 100+ AHL games, that I'd rather they play 10 minutes in the NHL per night (+practice time with NHLers, and more practice time due to generally easier travel schedules), than them playing 18 minutes a night in the AHL.

But that's in a world where it's a line like Hathaway-Ryan-Mangiapane was, not just throwing a young guy with two grinders.

And that line worked because you had two out of nowhere players with a 6th round pick.

You weren't breaking in the Zary types that way.

As I said I'm good with it in short doses, for the right player, with the right players.

[activeStick]

Happy for Duehr to continue his opportunity to find a permanent home in the NHL and hope he does this in San Jose. As for the replacement callup, I'm hoping for Hunt for now given his chemistry with Kerins and Pelletier and at the top of my priority list at the moment is for the Flames to make the playoffs. Would be great if he gets the call up, clicks with his old linemates and doesn't look bad, helping the Flames make the post season, but if they don't, someone else will get the opportunity if he returns to the Wranglers.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

I honestly don't think it as an effort thing though. He just couldn't keep up with the speed of the game. And when that's the case it looks like you aren't trying, but the reality is you are just constantly behind.

I hope he finds an opportunity with SJ. But for the Flames I think this is a good thing.

Of course it's a good thing. Rooney needs to go too tbh as he is another guy that really doesn't move the needle.

Between Kerins, Morten, Stromgren, Klapka and Honzek there are 4-5 guys that deserve to get a shot at the NHL level down the stretch.

[Yeah_Baby]

Best of luck, Walker

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by flambers

Flames are so thin at center, why would they do that?

Not convinced that Kerins or Hunt are a downgrade from Rooney. Or Stromgren, for that matter. But the organizational C depth definitely needs help. Honzek made the team out of camp and would also be an instant upgrade. You can argue that ideally he would be slotted higher up in the lineup, but you could also argue that the 4th line should be a young and hungry line instead of a line with no offensive skill and no game plan other than to try to grind the opposition down.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by HighLifeMan

FWIW (Since Sutter left)

With Rooney (213 minutes)
CF - 40.8%
SF - 42.93%
xGF - 42.55%
SCF - 38.59%
HDCF - 43.9%

Without Rooney (85 minutes)
CF - 54.27%
SF - 54.93%
xGF - 62.97%
SCF - 56.58%
HDCF - 59.38%

I can see why the Sharks would see some value in Duehr. He has the tools to be a solid bottom sixer.

This tells us more about Rooney IMO. Whether Duehr's linemates were better or worse with him would be interesting.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Macindoc

you could also argue that the 4th line should be a young and hungry line instead of a line with no offensive skill and no game plan other than to try to grind the opposition down.

It's rare for a team to have enough depth to have offensive skill to spare for the 4th line. Usually, coaches put together three lines that work well together, and the fourth line consists of whoever is left over. If forwards 10 through 13 on the roster are plugs, that's a management issue, not a coaching issue. If forward #10 is skilled and 11 to 13 are plugs, the #10 guy is going to be stuck with crappy linemates through no fault of his own and his numbers will suffer.

The real argument, I think, is not about even-strength minutes, but about getting young players minutes in all situations. A 4th-line player is not getting a sniff of PP time, and unless he's very experienced, he's unlikely to be a regular on the PK.

Up to a certain point in his development, a young forward gains more by playing 18 minutes a night in the AHL, with plenty of special teams, than half the minutes in the NHL at even strength only. Last year and this year, the Flames have been pretty good at judging when a prospect is ready to move up, and they're not afraid to jettison a Duehr to promote a Kerins.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

This tells us more about Rooney IMO. Whether Duehr's linemates were better or worse with him would be interesting.

Duehr was on the ice with 10 players for 25 minutes or more.

Of the 10 only 1 was better off with Duehr (Pachal), two were neutral, and 7 were much better off without him.

[jatylo]

He was my favorite Wrangler since the AHL team came to Calgary. I wish him all of the best as he carves out a journeyman career in the NHL

[Dion]

Here's hoping Walker can carve out a career with the Sharks.

[OILFAN #81]

Perhaps not the only move between the 2 before the trade deadline. Flames continue to be a handful of teams who have had dialogue about Ferraro as recent as this week.

And slightly off topic but Mikael Granlund has had more than 10 teams inquire about him. Vancouver, Colorado, Minnesota among those interested.

[Goriders]

Too bad. He started with a bang but never sustained it. Hopefully a change of scenery will help him.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by flambers

Flames are so thin at center, why would they do that?

They are thin at center with Rooney or without. Might as well save a few bucks and give some career AHL player a shot.

Another silly Treliving contract to muse over.

[SeeGeeWhy]

Makes room to finally bring in a Giveur.

[Titan2]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

One thing forum etiquette could improve on is if there’s an update to a thread topic the OP (or thread title) states which post the update occurs on so people don’t have to swim through and find it.

Just a suggestion

Do you know about "View Last Unread?" button. The little red box with the white v in it? In the thread listings, before the title of the thread, if there are new to you posts it will take you to the last place you were at. This only really helps if you are up to date on the thread though.

Also at the top of the first post. Maybe you knew about this but hopefully it helps someone. I know it was a revelation for me.

[savardandjokinen]

Duehr scores already