Making the playoffs or keeping our top-10 first round pick 2025?

[Macindoc]

What are the conditions for Montreal deferring the pick until 2026?

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Macindoc

What are the conditions for Montreal deferring the pick until 2026?

I don't think there is any. I think they either get ours or Floridas this draft.

[Rhett44]

We should be tanking if we want to contend one day, and have a chance at elite prospects. But obviously it is impossible to tell a team to tank.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

And yet Kadri was unsigned at that point.

Yes, and Conroy wanted to sign him because he needed a centre who was not broken. The only way to get that was to find a taker for Monahan.

It didn't work out, but I understand why he did it. The market was what it was. I would much rather have been selling cap space than buying it at that time, but that wasn't an option.

[Fan69]

Trade Anderson and let the chips fall where they may.

Top five out if the question just too many teams that suck. However trade Anderson and our defence will be in shambles, the losses will mount.

Would love to get 9 or 10, keep the pick, hopefully land Frondel who seems to be sliding a bit. Be far better set up for next year. Personally believe that the sales pitch for Anderson is a first and a Center prospect and the second that happens the trade is done.

While always happy to be winning games if you manage the next two years properly by which i mean accumulate some center prospects this team will win plenty. Still also of the opinion we use our plethora of wingers in a trade for a center.

Trade Anderson and Vladar who i think are really our only trade chips of value, relying on t o rookie goalies and a poor defence we should land right at the top ten. Keep the pick. Grab a center with it. Use the extra pick to grab another defender, use our picks and draft capital to get an already playing young center( yes i know easier said than done, pinto, cozens type of deal with an established nhl’er ) with multiple picks still coming in upcoming drafts, a wealth if wingers, a good group of defencemen and goaltenders, we have vets in Backs, kadri, weegs, lombo, only one thing really missing.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Macindoc

What are the conditions for Montreal deferring the pick until 2026?

If both Calgary and Florida’s pick are top 10 or something like that

It’s not going to happen

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Yes, and Conroy wanted to sign him because he needed a centre who was not broken. The only way to get that was to find a taker for Monahan.

It didn't work out, but I understand why he did it. The market was what it was. I would much rather have been selling cap space than buying it at that time, but that wasn't an option.

Don't you mean Treliving? Or was there something about Conroy as AGM?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Bingo

The Flames have been a .500 team since their 6 game unbeaten start.

The 10th place team is one game under .500.

This is nowhere near as decided as some seem to think it is.

This is where I have been, up until now. But the Flames keep refusing to slide and they are starting to define their lane:

Make the playoffs: almost no chance, IMO. There are 8 teams in the West that are at least +7 (and on pace for at least 96 points). I don't see any of them falling off - maybe VAN, but even if they struggle for a while here, I don't see us keeping pace. The Flames would have to get better in the 2nd half to make the dance - I don't see that happening.

Bottom 10: there are 8 teams that are at least -3 (on pace for 75 pts or less). And the ones that are -3 are MTL and ANA, so I don't have a lot of faith that they are going to suddenly get good. With the Flames at +5, these teams are getting too far away from us.

That leaves 8 spots, from 9-16. And unfortunately(?) the Flames are 16th. Here are the 8 teams:

16: CGY +5
15: UTH +4
14: PIT +1
13: STL +0
12: CBJ -1
11: PHI -1
10: NYR -1
9: NYI -2

In order to finish bottom 10, they need to fall behind 6 of those 7 teams. NYR will likely right their ship at some point, and UTH is playing pretty well. But we can't expect any of the other teams (except maybe STL) to pass us, we need to fall behind them.

The Flames need to start losing SOON if they want to sneak into the top 10. But right now, the safe bet is that they finish 12-16

[Enoch Root]

And if the Rangers do right the ship and get back into the playoff picture, that brings OTT back into the pack as another team we would have to fall behind.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

This draft isn't all that high-end anyways. Next year is when tanking can take on real meaning for our core.

If you can get in then get in!

What if we can play the role of upsetters over the no goods in round 1? That would be worthwhile to me.

Either way were keeping one of those FLA/CGY picks, so whatever. My vote is for the most fun path.

[Bingo]

I think two of Cgy, Pits, Columbus and Philly end up bottom ten.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Yes, and Conroy wanted to sign him because he needed a centre who was not broken. The only way to get that was to find a taker for Monahan.

It didn't work out, but I understand why he did it. The market was what it was. I would much rather have been selling cap space than buying it at that time, but that wasn't an option.

It wasn't Conroy.

My point is that you can't argue Montreal had Treliving over a barrel when Kadri was still unsigned. So saying it wasn't an option is just wrong, it was 100% a choice that the Flames made.

I put in an earlier post that I understood their reasons and there was definitely hope that the GM had salvaged the situation. But that is not the same as saying the individual deals were good ones.

[Aarongavey]

I still think Conroy trades a major piece out this year for more futures. He has had a pretty steady plan all along. Whether he ends up like the 22/23 Preds after he makes a trade or two is another thing but I think he still has a plan that he is sticking to.

But if a right shot dman who is on an affordable contract like Rasmus is available I think he could get a haul for him. He has a few other pieces too. If he does move a big piece dropping down (for those that want to drop) would not be that difficult.

[blankall]

The remaining vets are Andersson, Weegar, Vladar, Backlund, and Coleman... Maybe Kuzmenko.

Conroy's line is that he is moving out players that don't want to be here, not moving all the vets to tank. I'm sure Conroy will have discussions with all of these guys. If they don't want to stick around for a rebuild or want too much money to stay, they'll be gone. However, I don't see him trading them just to make the team worse either.

[Jiri Hrdina]

I think the deadline action could be limited. If someone pays up for Andersson that's one thing, but I think he goes in the summer.
Vladar goes eventually. But I'm not expecting a lot o action this deadline.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

It wasn't Conroy.

Of course it wasn't. My fingers typed what my brain wasn't thinking. It's been a long time since I had to type ‘Treliving’ regularly.

My point is that you can't argue Montreal had Treliving over a barrel when Kadri was still unsigned. So saying it wasn't an option is just wrong, it was 100% a choice that the Flames made.

What wasn't an option for the Flames was to play Montreal's role and sell cap space for high picks, because the Flames didn't have cap space to sell. I apologize if I was unclear. I wouldn't have been buying cap space at that price myself. Buying in a seller's market is a chump's game in general.

Treliving isn't nearly as bad a GM as a lot of posters want him to be in retrospect, but he has two big weaknesses: He's bad at hiring coaches, and he tends to get tunnel vision and want particular players at almost any price. He paid too much for Hamonic, and he paid too much to get the cap space to sign Kadri. He did much better in trades when he shopped around for offers and didn't get hung up on specific assets.

[Fan69]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

This is where I have been, up until now. But the Flames keep refusing to slide and they are starting to define their lane:

Make the playoffs: almost no chance, IMO. There are 8 teams in the West that are at least +7 (and on pace for at least 96 points). I don't see any of them falling off - maybe VAN, but even if they struggle for a while here, I don't see us keeping pace. The Flames would have to get better in the 2nd half to make the dance - I don't see that happening.

Bottom 10: there are 8 teams that are at least -3 (on pace for 75 pts or less). And the ones that are -3 are MTL and ANA, so I don't have a lot of faith that they are going to suddenly get good. With the Flames at +5, these teams are getting too far away from us.

That leaves 8 spots, from 9-16. And unfortunately(?) the Flames are 16th. Here are the 8 teams:

16: CGY +5
15: UTH +4
14: PIT +1
13: STL +0
12: CBJ -1
11: PHI -1
10: NYR -1
9: NYI -2

In order to finish bottom 10, they need to fall behind 6 of those 7 teams. NYR will likely right their ship at some point, and UTH is playing pretty well. But we can't expect any of the other teams (except maybe STL) to pass us, we need to fall behind them.

The Flames need to start losing SOON if they want to sneak into the top 10. But right now, the safe bet is that they finish 12-16

Both columbus and utah have a pile of assets and a couple of daft trades could really turn things around for them. Especially if the trade was something like us sending Anderson. It would probably hurt our short term and help theirs. Im happy even at ten. Maybe grab Obrian, or frondel and have a chance at the lottery.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by jayswin

It doesn't just need a rebalance, we need an elite 1st line center, plus will likely need a second line center, another star winger, and likely at least one elite D-man. At least two of those will basically only come from the draft, chances are great you'll only get them at the top end of the draft, to boot.

What you're describing is basically roll with this and start plugging holes through trades and signings to go upward right now. With Wolf that could make us a playoff team, but not likely a contender. So it would be another failed build for us.

Per above I said fill the roster out with young players. They have a number of good ones. Especially on D instead of Hanley and Barrie.

I’d resign Anderson if he wants to stay. He’s not that old and is arguably our best player. If you dump him you’re just going to have to find someone like him probably for more money.

The team has too much talent to be picking in the top 3. I think unless they get lucky the biggest deficiency center is going to have to be addressed via their cap space in free agency or a trade. Trade route would be harder. Who’s going to trade you a player like that?

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Goriders

Per above I said fill the roster out with young players. They have a number of good ones. Especially on D instead of Hanley and Barrie.

I’d resign Anderson if he wants to stay. He’s not that old and is arguably our best player. If you dump him you’re just going to have to find someone like him probably for more money.

The team has too much talent to be picking in the top 3. I think unless they get lucky the biggest deficiency center is going to have to be addressed via their cap space in free agency or a trade. Trade route would be harder. Who’s going to trade you a player like that?

lol serious ? Too much talent ?

You move Andersson because he’s going to cost 7 plus and is already isn’t the best skater and his offensive game is dropping off. We have a lot of guys in the pipeline.

You contradict yourself. We won’t be able to draft a center so we have to use cap space to get one via feee agency or trade, but who will trade is one. I mean we can go to free agency and get is a Chandler Stephenson. Rebuild complete.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Goriders

Per above I said fill the roster out with young players. They have a number of good ones. Especially on D instead of Hanley and Barrie.

I’d resign Anderson if he wants to stay. He’s not that old and is arguably our best player. If you dump him you’re just going to have to find someone like him probably for more money.

The team has too much talent to be picking in the top 3. I think unless they get lucky the biggest deficiency center is going to have to be addressed via their cap space in free agency or a trade. Trade route would be harder. Who’s going to trade you a player like that?

I understand what you're saying, but what you're describing - Re-sign Anderson to his 29-37 year old deal, let young players take all the spots and go to free agency to try to get the number one centre etc. Is going to leave us about 3 elite/star players short of being a contender, and then we'll just hang on as a middling/playoff bubble team until we need to tear down and rebuild again.

I just think you're underestimating what it takes to become a contender in this league. We're not a re-sign Andersson, fill out roster with young players and sign a centre in free agency away from being anything.