[Trade] Hathaway and Orlov (75% ret) to Boston for Smith, 23 1st, 25 2nd, 24 3rd

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

that is a big haul for WAS, for a couple of depth guys (even though they are both solid, depth guys)

Orlov isn't a depth guy

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Orlov isn't a depth guy

I’d take him over Gavrikov for sure

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

It's not that much different.
Even the 2003 draft, rightly held up as an amazing draft, from 27-33 has Brian Boyle who had a long but not really notable career. But Cory Perry is sitting there at 28 and Loui Eriksson at 33. Perry makes that draft at that spot. The rest - same 'ol same 'ol.

Drafts are largely defined by what is available at the top, and how deep you can go before it normalizes.
The key is to go beyond the hype. Because the hype ain't accurate.

2003 was pretty nuts throughout, but I generally agree with your premise.

It's also really hard to know how COVID will have impacted player development in those key years. I would posit that the guys with supernatural talent would be impacted less, while other players will be more of a crapshoot in terms of draft position, and probably need more development time

Originally Posted by dustygoon

What the actual hell...

Seravalli saying the wild got that 5th pick for spending cash of $88k. And got the 4th pick in the O'Reilly deal for $74k of cash.

Who gives a crap about cap space right now? We don't need it. I'm a huge supporter of Treliving, but this team needs those picks more than cap space unless he has something cooking that has longer term implications.

Tre could have made the same offer and simply not been picked. Sweeney and Guerin overlapped a few years on the Bruins; sometimes these are just relationship/favour deals.

[OptimalTates]

Ah yes that 25 minute a night top pairing “depth” defenseman. Are people downplaying Orlov because the Capitals made a move the Flames would never do to try and bolster their team in the future at the cost of today? Otherwise I don’t get the posters pretending that Orlov was a depth pick up.

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

Lol, yup Capitals totally dismantling their core by selling a 19 point aging UFA dman, and a 15 point UFA grinder.

Orlov is a good player and removing him from your roster, UFA or not, surely hurts your playoff chances, especially with Carlsson out. So clearly management is making this move with the long term game in mind and not clouded by some belief that a fluke run could be had. The Capitals chances of beating some of the power houses in a best of 7 series is slim and even though the disparity in the west might be less overall, the Flames chances of doing the same is slim IMO as well.

Beyond all of that, when was the last time the Flames traded a pending UFA that had any positive impact on the current team because its sometimes the best decision to make long term? I honestly can't think of one in recent memory. They hold on to them with the playoffs in mind and are then eventually out in round 1.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by CGY12

Orlov is a good player and removing him from your roster, UFA or not, surely hurts your playoff chances, especially with Carlsson out. So clearly management is making this move with the long term game in mind and not clouded by some belief that a fluke run could be had. The Capitals chances of beating some of the power houses in a best of 7 series is slim and even though the disparity in the west might be less overall, the Flames chances of doing the same is slim IMO as well.

Beyond all of that, when was the last time the Flames traded a pending UFA that had any positive impact on the current team because its sometimes the best decision to make long term? I honestly can't think of one in recent memory. They hold on to them with the playoffs in mind and are then eventually out in round 1.

David Rittich, the last time the Flames were not in a playoff spot at the deadline

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by dino7c

David Rittich, the last time the Flames were not in a playoff spot at the deadline

The backup, interesting. Be curious to know that list under BT.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by CGY12

The backup, interesting. Be curious to know that list under BT.

He moved Glencross when we were in a playoff position. Hudler when we were out.

Really issue is the Flames tend to time the poor years in seasons where we dont have many UFAs.

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

He moved Glencross when we were in a playoff position. Hudler when we were out.

Really issue is the Flames tend to time the poor years in seasons where we dont have many UFAs.

You're mistaken I believe. Although right in the thick of things for the playoffs, at the time of the trade the Flames were 9th in the conference. They were tied in points with the 8th place Kings but Kings had game in hand and the defending Stanley Cup champions.

They went on a late season tear going 12-5-3 and ultimately made it on the back of the Kings vs Flames game where Gaudreau scored to seal it. They ended up finishing up 2 points on the Kings for that last playoff spot and beat Vancouver.

But Glencross gets moved with the Flames likely expecting that they had less than even chance of making the playoff. Something sparks with the comeback kids, and the assets in the Glencross trade would be used as part of the Hamilton and (draft rights for) Kylington trades. Probably one of the best moves by Treliving getting back more than expected for Glencross, using those assets to turn into valuable players, making the playoffs and beating a divisional rival. All because he wasn't handcuffed by the owners to make the playoffs at all costs.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

You're mistaken I believe. Although right in the thick of things for the playoffs, at the time of the trade the Flames were 9th in the conference. They were tied in points with the 8th place Kings but Kings had game in hand and the defending Stanley Cup champions.

They went on a late season tear going 12-5-3 and ultimately made it on the back of the Kings vs Flames game where Gaudreau scored to seal it. They ended up finishing up 2 points on the Kings for that last playoff spot and beat Vancouver.

But Glencross gets moved with the Flames likely expecting that they had less than even chance of making the playoff. Something sparks with the comeback kids, and the assets in the Glencross trade would be used as part of the Hamilton and (draft rights for) Kylington trades. Probably one of the best moves by Treliving getting back more than expected for Glencross, using those assets to turn into valuable players, making the playoffs and beating a divisional rival. All because he wasn't handcuffed by the owners to make the playoffs at all costs.

This is exactly it.

Treliving would have had the green light to make these moves and he did. Right now, I doubt very much Treliving would have the green light to trade Toffoli for picks, as an example.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by CGY12

The backup, interesting. Be curious to know that list under BT.

Russell too.

[dustygoon]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Tre could have made the same offer and simply not been picked. Sweeney and Guerin overlapped a few years on the Bruins; sometimes these are just relationship/favour deals.

Tell me more. Like the part where Dubas overlapped with Guerin somewhere then? Nah. You think the flames are actively shopping their cap space like Guerin?

Wild got picked to do this TWICE. They are actively shopping their cap space.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Russell too.

Glencross is one as well, going back a bit further. He got a handsome return for him and then oddly Glencross was out of the league a short time later.

[GordonBlue]

Great trade for Boston and Washington.
Boston is loaded up for the playoffs and Washington has a good number of draft picks in the next few years.
I can't find the article I read last night that had their draft picks accumulated, but the Caps are nicely setting themselves up for the future.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

He moved Glencross when we were in a playoff position. Hudler when we were out.

Really issue is the Flames tend to time the poor years in seasons where we dont have many UFAs.

Flames were able to move Glencross because they had Ferland who they wanted to get on the roster full time and there was a market that made sense to do the deal. I could see this flames team looking to make a move if they had a sure fire plug and play player on the farm

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Orlov isn't a depth guy

Over 22 minutes a night and making over $5 million on a deal signed 5 years ago. Flames comparable is Tanev.

So yeah, not a depth guy. I think people see Hathaway and because he’s familiar, lump Orlov in with him.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Flames were able to move Glencross because they had Ferland who they wanted to get on the roster full time and there was a market that made sense to do the deal. I could see this flames team looking to make a move if they had a sure fire plug and play player on the farm

Glencross was UFA, that’s the biggest difference. He fetched two second round picks, none of our UFA’s get anything close to that.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by dustygoon

Tell me more. Like the part where Dubas overlapped with Guerin somewhere then? Nah. You think the flames are actively shopping their cap space like Guerin?

Wild got picked to do this TWICE. They are actively shopping their cap space.

Guerin spent the 3 years after BOS in DAL, where Doug Armstrong was the GM.

The point is that the only way to guarantee this deal is to underbid (5ths or 6ths).

[CroFlames]

Hathaway was one of those bottom six guys you just fell in love with. I was sad to see him go and thought Caps overpaid, but actually he earned that contract and was a contributor on that team.

[Saqe]

Have to like it for Boston a lot. When Orlov is on his game he is a beast, great skater and physical. This could be the move that puts over the top. Key for them is their main guys, Bergeron, Krejci and Marchand can stay healthy.