[PGT] Wild 5, Flames 3 - But a goal went in off someone's face!

[Dion]

Originally Posted by tfi racing

Yeah,you're right.Calling out an amateur level performance in a professional sport is just going to cause some hurt feelings,let's just pass out "great effort" ribbons and lollipops and ice cream to everyone instead and tell everyone winning doesn't matter,its really about nurturing and caring and feeling good about themselves ...

Someone told me that's what they do in schools now. Guess it's early prep for becoming an athlete.

[Barnet Flame]

Originally Posted by Redliner

Well, with Hiller in net we will need to score a minimum of 6 goals per game to win.

That's the problem right there.

Our forwards are killing us.

[shadowlord]

How many consecutive games does Hiller have to give up 4+ goals until Hartley gives someone else a chance? I'm not saying Ortio is guaranteed to do better, but at this point, Hiller is stone-cold.

[Dajazz]

I hate losing, but Hiller is doing us a favour. It's tanking, but with a good conscience - the season is shot anyway.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

What a terrible thread.

FYP

More talk about how rude people are in supporting their team than talk about the game or the team itself. Way too much PC bull#### going on these days.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by jayswin

I wish sports fans could just stop at "I don't like how this guy's performing anymore, we need to make changes". One of the ugly sides of sports fandom for me is how far fans will take it online against their own damn players, when they turn on them after performance slides.

So distasteful and rude. Yeah, yeah, they get paid lots and should be able to handle it and all that. To me, they're still human beings at the end of the day. Ugly stuff.

Yeah this place is starting to mirror Oiler forums with one or two players being singled out for every loss when the fact is the problem is that the team stinks. The players can be replaced in the offseason but if this team plays as bad next season as they have this season it won't matter as we will be talking about the team selling at the deadline again. Hiller has been hot garbage but Oilers fans said every year they were only a goaltending change away from being a good team and how has that worked out? This team is simply one of the worst teams in the league.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Yeah this place is starting to mirror Oiler forums with one or two players being singled out for every loss when the fact is the problem is that the team stinks. The players can be replaced in the offseason but if this team plays as bad next season as they have this season it won't matter as we will be talking about the team selling at the deadline again. Hiller has been hot garbage but Oilers fans said every year they were only a goaltending change away from being a good team and how has that worked out? This team is simply one of the worst teams in the league.

I agree (except that they are one of the worst teams - I think there's been a perfect storm of things happen this year that's the opposite of last year). I do think that there's posters who have their whipping boys and that it blinds them to good play by those players and bad play by others.

That was a bad overall effort by the Flames last night (and a pretty good one by a Wild team in the post-coaching change glow). Hiller could have made two more saves and it would have been close. But the Flames could also have not just gotten within a goal and then completely get out worked in their own end.

I still like the team's future though.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by Dion

How is it any different from being called into the office and having the boss chew a piece out of your rear end for not doing your job or worse getting let go because you can no longer meet the standards being asked of your employer?

You really don't see the difference?

It's not about coddling players, it's about having a little decency for another human being. Yes, he's played terrible and much of the on-ice criticism is warranted, but its pretty embarrassing to see grown adults having much pure hate directed at anyone playing a sport. He's a bad hockey player, not Pol Pot.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by Table 5

You really don't see the difference?

It's not about coddling players, it's about having a little decency for another human being. Yes, he's played terrible and much of the on-ice criticism is warranted, but its pretty embarrassing to see grown adults having much pure hate directed at anyone playing a sport. He's a bad hockey player, not Pol Pot.

Extra points for the out of the box reference. One would normally expect to see Hitler or Stalin there. And, yes, no reason to hate him - he is actually helping the franchise long term.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I agree (except that they are one of the worst teams - I think there's been a perfect storm of things happen this year that's the opposite of last year). I do think that there's posters who have their whipping boys and that it blinds them to good play by those players and bad play by others.

That was a bad overall effort by the Flames last night (and a pretty good one by a Wild team in the post-coaching change glow). Hiller could have made two more saves and it would have been close. But the Flames could also have not just gotten within a goal and then completely get out worked in their own end.

I still like the team's future though.

They are what their record says they are. I agree that the team is heading in the right direction and that all the bounces that went their way last year have gone against them this season but the truth is in the middle which means last season's team probably wasn't quite a playoff team and this season's team isn't quite a last place team. The common denominator is that the team isn't good enough right now and they still don't play a sound overall game as the defensive lapses have been a hallmark of this coaching staff and last year the sheer amount of blocked shots and puck luck went in their favor but this season when they have the breakdowns they are ending up in the net more than not and the late chances that were going in to tie up games last season are hitting the post or missing the net this season.

I have no doubt that better goaltending will stabilize things somewhat but the middling/poor special teams that we have seen under Hartley have to improve as does overall team play. The league knows the Flames game plan and it's on the coaching staff to add some wrinkles outside of always looking for the long pass coming out of their own end and having defensemen pinch. Teams have turned those pinches into turnovers and goals and nothing has changed other than the goaltenders no longer bailing out the team.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

It's funny because not too long ago I remember goaltending being the strongest area of organizational depth. Immediately after we acquired Ramo it looked like this:

- Ramo, one of the best goalies in the KHL at the time
- Ortio, one of the best goalies in the SM-liiga at the time
- Broissoit - one of the best in the WHL at the time
- Gillies - one of the best in the NCAA at the time

Good thing we added McDonald and Poulin since then, because the "Promise" in that original list has thinned out very quickly.

I too once thought goaltending depth was our biggest strength. A team can have the ''best'' prospects on everybody's list. But it means sweet #### all when it comes to actual NHL performance. And really that's the only place that matters. The NHL.

By looking at your list, a couple seasons ago that looked quite promising, including Ortio who looked fairly legit. Now on that list, Ramo is the only legit NHL goaltender and even he is a question mark. Now our hopes rest on Gillies. A guy who is a couple years away at the earliest.

But it just goes to show how much fans overrate their own prospects, us included. Now suddenly, after much fanfare about how good our goaltending depth was, it's a big black void that might take years to fill.

[Weitz]

Is Hamilton usually pretty slow?

I don't watch him much but last night at the game I noticed a few times where the forwards just blew right past him.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Is Hamilton usually pretty slow?

I don't watch him much but last night at the game I noticed a few times where the forwards just blew right past him.

He's tall so not the world's quickest guy. Straight line skating I'd imagine he's average or better.

[bzoo02]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Is Hamilton usually pretty slow?

I don't watch him much but last night at the game I noticed a few times where the forwards just blew right past him.

It's not that he's slow, it's that he's still adjusting to the flames defensive system where they have the D being aggressive with pinching on the play.
He's getting better at it but last night he made a couple hesitations and was caught flat footed because of it.

[polak]

I haven't said a single thing about Hiller or the goaltending really (It's been beaten to death and I like Ramo) but these are grown men. I hope that on the very off chance that they read this board that they can handle some plebs on the internet making fun of them.

[AcGold]

If you're on the Flames and you are reading this go practice and stop wasting your time here, what the hell does anyone here know, Sureloss excluded.I

[Stormchaser]

Originally Posted by darthma

Turek took a pay cut to stay with the team. He had a great string of about 10 games to start a season once. How can people even compare Hiller to Turek.

The one interview I've seen of Hiller this year was him saying something along the lines of "I don't know what it takes to start. I won the last two games I played. It's my contract year." That sort of response tells you he's a 'me me me' sort of player. Bye Bye Hiller.

I'll always respect Turek for renegotiating his contract and just seeming like a good team guy for they Flames and its not that I think they are they same goaltender at all. Turek was downright terrible near his conclusion with Calgary and my heart would sink overtime the play came into our end. Its the same feeling with Hiller...I don't have any confidence in him to make even the small saves and that must be how the team feels as well.

[ScorchyScorch]

Dat goaltending tho.

[ScorchyScorch]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

Probably for the best. Takes Minny out of the seller's market (and possibly into the buyers market), while Flames get that much closer to Laine.

If Hartley plays Hiller one more game, you know he's tanking

I'd prefer Pooljewscurvy.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by bzoo02

It's not that he's slow, it's that he's still adjusting to the flames defensive system where they have the D being aggressive with pinching on the play.
He's getting better at it but last night he made a couple hesitations and was caught flat footed because of it.

Yah - but he stick-checks WAY too much. Actually most of the D-corps doe, too. Don't know if they've been told to do so because taking the body puts them out of position for the ensuing play. It also stops the attacker. Butter soft in that regard, with rare exceptions.