Fix what's obviously broken, NHL needs more goals

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

You laugh, but the NHL is actually looking into this. People who own NHL teams aren't keen about an aspect of the game that increases injuries to their players and decreases scoring.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/3...ng-techniques/

You can't actually believe this will get any traction though right?

NHL owners will complain about anything that will hurt their dollar. It doesn't matter their opinion is valid or will help the game in any way. NHL Owners have also been complaining about their players risking injuries by going to the olympics. I can see that happening before something as silly as this.


If they're so worried about shot blocking in the NHL, maybe they should tell their GMs/Coaches not to run a shot blocking system. Simple as that. I'm sure most coaches would tell them to shove off and let them do their job anyways.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

The easiest change is just to limit the size of the goalie leg pads themselves and move them up to the pants so they don't cover so much area when the goalies are down. Brodeur was playing with the smaller pads up until this year and he wasn't hurt all the time so I fail to see how those giant thigh pads are saving injuries.

This image from the article someone posted earlier in this thread is an eye opener:

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Buuuuullll. Cheaters on the gloves don't protect. Shoulder pads that size don't protect. Pads that go 11" above knew aren't for protection. There's lots and lots to trim even while improving protection

Increasing injuries, even if it doesn't amount to a lot, is still only a part of it though. As I mentioned, the abilities and improved equipment of other players gives them a performance advantage over goalies that didn't exist back when guys like Liut were patrolling the net. And not every goalie is going to be a generational talent like Brodeur.

Honestly, is scoring really that far off of historical averages? I haven't crunched numbers, but it doesn't seem like the newer era is all the skewed. Not enough to suggest that goalie equipment is out pacing the equipment and abilities of skaters.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Bodychecking not only generates chances, it's fun to watch. Shot blocking (which has only been widespread in the NHL for less than 10 years) is a nul play.

How many times this season did Lance Bouma get a standing O from the crowd after blocking shots?

Removing bodychecking may or may not generate chances (depends on the situation) but removing it is just as ridiculous as penalizing shot blocking.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

As for the 'issue' with scoring, I don't find it an issue. You don't see as many 'star' players racking up over a ppg anymore, but that's because the talent is spread through 4 lines of depth now. With the elimination of goons, the team can have 3-4 scoring lines in today's NHL. Scoring is barely down from past years, just more evenly dispersed. That's a good thing.

If we're going to do anything to increase scoring, I'm intrigued by increasing the height of the nets. A 6'4 goalie shouldn't be able to cover the top of the net while in the butterfly position. We should be pushing for athletic agile goalies in the NHL, not tall positionally sound goalies that take a minute to get off their ass (See Bishop).

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Increasing injuries, even if it doesn't amount to a lot, is still only a part of it though. As I mentioned, the abilities and improved equipment of other players gives them a performance advantage over goalies that didn't exist back when guys like Liut were patrolling the net. And not every goalie is going to be a generational talent like Brodeur.

Honestly, is scoring really that far off of historical averages? I haven't crunched numbers, but it doesn't seem like the newer era is all the skewed. Not enough to suggest that goalie equipment is out pacing the equipment and abilities of skaters.

It's down by almost 2 goals per game from a couple decades ago. Worse yet is the troubling trend in that it's still decreasing.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

The thing that bothers me with goalies equipment is that it is rare that you see a guy score with a shot as he blazes down the wing.

I think back to Iggy's 2002 season and he score a ton by beating the goalie clean with a slapshot. Now unless it is a rebound, or a redirect, or a nice cross seam pass you can't score.

That is what bothers me.

Absolutely. A goal off the rush is the most exciting play in hockey. It would be sad to see it disappear.

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

You can't actually believe this will get any traction though right?

Did you read the article? The issue was actually brought forward by the NHLPA's Mathieu Schneider. Penalizing shot blocking has also been recommended by multiple Stanley Cup and Selke winner, former coach and GM Bob Gainey.

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Honestly, is scoring really that far off of historical averages? I haven't crunched numbers, but it doesn't seem like the newer era is all the skewed.

This past season saw the third-lowest GAA average (2.52) in 59 years.

[btimbit]

Reduce the size of goalie equipment a bit. Pads and gloves especially. And/or make the net a little bigger too
I wouldn't mind seeing some like moving the blue lines closer to center ice

Don't touch shot blocking, I love it
Size of the ice is fine.

[VladtheImpaler]

The NBA raised the hoop a couple feet, right? I hate basketball and don't know much about it, but I seem to recall something to that effect. They adjusted for the fact that their athletes "grew". When the NHL net size was determined, what was the size of the average NHL player? If I were to guess, 5'5'', 150 lbs. Now it's... 6'1" 200 lbs? Dryden and Liut were freaks in their day. Now, goalies pretty much HAVE to be 6'2"+.
Thanks for the photos earlier. I think that pic of Billy Smith is perfect of what the goalie should look like relative to the net...

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

How many times this season did Lance Bouma get a standing O from the crowd after blocking shots?

Removing bodychecking may or may not generate chances (depends on the situation) but removing it is just as ridiculous as penalizing shot blocking.

It's amazing that people paid good money to watch a hockey game back before shot blocking became a common play.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

As for the 'issue' with scoring, I don't find it an issue. You don't see as many 'star' players racking up over a ppg anymore, but that's because the talent is spread through 4 lines of depth now. With the elimination of goons, the team can have 3-4 scoring lines in today's NHL. Scoring is barely down from past years, just more evenly dispersed. That's a good thing.

If we're going to do anything to increase scoring, I'm intrigued by increasing the height of the nets. A 6'4 goalie shouldn't be able to cover the top of the net while in the butterfly position. We should be pushing for athletic agile goalies in the NHL, not tall positionally sound goalies that take a minute to get off their ass (See Bishop).

I hate what he represents, but to be fair, that was because of a torn groin.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

It's down by almost 2 goals per game from a couple decades ago. Worse yet is the troubling trend in that it's still decreasing.

If you're going back 2 decades why don't we also talk about how popular the NHL was 2 decades ago compared to now? Hockey has been the fastest growing sport in the US for the past 5+ years. They must be doing something right. I find today's NHL more enjoyable than when I started watching in 2001.

Just look at how close the playoff race is EVERY year now. It's playoff level hockey for the last 2 months of the regular season for 1/3 of the teams.

[rotten42]

People who think hockey is only about scoring don't understand the game.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

It's amazing that people paid good money to watch a hockey game back before shot blocking became a common play.

If you don't have an answer why a player like Lance Bouma is getting the fans off their feet if shot blocking is boring that's fine. You don't need the sarcastic response and the rolly eyed thing, it's not adding anything.

Starting with reducing goalie equipment size that won't result in injuries seems like the most logical place for the NHL to start. See what happens and go from there.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by rotten42

People who think hockey is only about scoring don't understand the game.

People who think people who want more scoring think hockey is only about scoring don't understand rational arguments.

Also, there's a reason why the top scorers in the NHL are also the top paid players. People pay to watch goals scored. It isn't the only reason they pay, but if scoring goes down much further we may see the same malaise creep into the game that was saw back in the clutch and grab era.

[2macinnis2]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

It's down by almost 2 goals per game from a couple decades ago. Worse yet is the troubling trend in that it's still decreasing.

Thanks for this. As I showed in a link on page 2 of this thread 97-04 and 2010-current represent the worst offensive stretches in the NHL since the 1950s. In the late 90s it was the trap and clutch and grab. Now I think it's much more a function of the increasing save pctgs. The actual hockey is phenomenal right now, just not enough shots are hitting the back of the net.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Absolutely. A goal off the rush is the most exciting play in hockey. It would be sad to see it disappear.



Did you read the article? The issue was actually brought forward by the NHLPA's Mathieu Schneider. Penalizing shot blocking has also been recommended by multiple Stanley Cup and Selke winner, former coach and GM Bob Gainey.



This past season saw the third-lowest GAA average (2.52) in 59 years.

I hadn't read the article due to how ridiculous it was. Now that I have, I see that it's not as ridiculous as you made it sound.

They are talking about banning 'certain shot-blocking techniques', not 'penalizing shot blocking' as you put it. Do you write for buzzfeed by chance? They are talking about this being 'less radical than bigger nets.' but banning shot blocking all together would be WAY more radical than larger nets.

I expect nothing to come from this. You can wish away, but shot blocking is highly respected and provides more entertainment. Shot blocking is the ultimate way to show that you're putting everything on the line to win.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

The NBA raised the hoop a couple feet, right? I hate basketball and don't know much about it, but I seem to recall something to that effect. They adjusted for the fact that their athletes "grew". When the NHL net size was determined, what was the size of the average NHL player? If I were to guess, 5'5'', 150 lbs. Now it's... 6'1" 200 lbs? Dryden and Liut were freaks in their day. Now, goalies pretty much HAVE to be 6'2"+.
Thanks for the photos earlier. I think that pic of Billy Smith is perfect of what the goalie should look like relative to the net...

I don't believe the basketball hoop was ever raised in response to growing atheletes. Started at 10 ft. in the Naismith days from what I can tell.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by 2macinnis2

Thanks for this. As I showed in a link on page 2 of this thread 97-04 and 2010-current represent the worst offensive stretches in the NHL since the 1950s. In the late 90s it was the trap and clutch and grab. Now I think it's much more a function of the increasing save pctgs. The actual hockey is phenomenal right now, just not enough shots are hitting the back of the net.

You didn't just say that.. Ever hear the saying 'if it's not broke, don't fix it'?

The hockey is phenomenal right now I agree. This is hockey and there's more to the game then goals. The fewer the goals, the more they mean, the crazier fans (and players) get when they do score.

This has been discussed to no end on HF Boards all year. I didn't think we'd have to suffer the same fate on CP.

[polak]

Please don't turn this into Lacrosse.

It's perfect the way it is. I don't remember a game going into OT at 0-0?

If that's not happening on a regular basis then there is no issue. Sure a 6-5 game might be exciting here and there but I'll take 2-1 on a regular basis over 6-5 on a regular basis any day.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

I don't believe the basketball hoop was ever raised in response to growing atheletes. Started at 10 ft. in the Naismith days from what I can tell.

Like I said, I don't follow it - could be wrong. Thought I heard/read something, but maybe I imagined it.