Cammalleri - going forward

[Fan in Exile]

I hear you - Cammaleri's no Brendan Gallagher. I think he is more than likely gone by the deadline. It didn't hurt Montreal to move him and it wouldn't hurt us either.

[Tinordi]

Montreal picked Gallagher with our 2nd rounder?

Man that hurts. And further evidence that whatever it was we were doing during that period, it wasn't rebuilding.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Montreal picked Gallagher with our 2nd rounder?

Man that hurts. And further evidence that whatever it was we were doing during that period, it wasn't rebuilding.

No, they took Fucale.

[Fan in Exile]

Sorry Tinordi, that's not what I meant. I was referring to Hartley telling Sven that he should look at Gallagher as a model for a three-zone player and the comment that Cammaleri is not a 3-zone player.

Montreal used the second we gave them to pick Zach Fucale in the 2nd round of the 2013 draft.

I don't think the trade hurt us all too much since we can still get a good return on Cammaleri. But that assumes we do deal him and get good value for him.

[Tinordi]

Gallagher was a 5th round pick. Nice steal by Montreal. The Habs actually have an excellent drafting and development system. Top five in the league.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

That was the start of the Feaster Rebuild version 2.0. His first rebuild was signing Tanguay long term, Butler and Byron for Regehr, bringing in Cervenka, signing Babchuk as a UFA, Signing Stempniak as a UFA, bringing back Cammalleri, Bringing in Smith, signing Hudler and Wideman.

The direction of the the rebuild was all soft and skilled.

It wasn't driven home that this concept of building a small skilled team (could be labelled the Kevin Lowe plan) was never going to succeed until we saw Kipper being run at random and the team as a whole following the Bouwmeester's lead and skating off to an unoccupied corner.


McGrattan signing was a signal that Feaster rebuild 1.0 was over and a failure. There was no semblance of a McGrattan player in the flames organization.
When McGrattan joined the team and told Baertschi that he would seriously hurt anyone that messed with the young fellow it was seriously different than having Jackman willing to get beat up along with you.


I like the 2.0 rebuild. I like the fact that Horak who has gotten bigger and stronger is now too small and soft to be on this roster even with 3 injuries after playing 81 games on rebuild 1.0 as a 19-20 year old.

To me it seems that you're basicly just calling everything a rebuild.

Suit yourself. But I think it kind of makes the term meaningless.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by Fan in Exile

Saying that Feaster recognized that "the team as it was built at the time, was on the decline, and an organizatinal shift of focus on the draft and getting younger was needed" does not equate to alleging a "clandestine rebuild"(although saying it began behind the curtains does).

The point is that Feaster strengthened our prospect pool considerably in the two drafts that preceded the decision to give up on trying to win and blowing the core up, which gives us a leg up on starting from scratch.

Recognition that a team's core is on the decline and there is a need to focus on the draft and get younger is something any sound management team does. The Sharks are a great example. Rather than trade the whole core who wasn't getting it done, they replaced an aging Nabakov with the much younger Niemi, developed Couture, drafted Hertl, and moved out pieces like Douglas Murray for picks.

Thanks thats pretty much what I meant yes.

re:Tinordi

I do think Sutters later moves set us back a few years. In regards to Feaster: trading for Byron and Butler was to clear cap space, Cammalleri for Bourque was to remove that anchor contract and if we got O'Reily it's unlikely we would have drafted 6th, thus no Monahan anyways....

I get it, I shouldn't have called it a rebuild behind the curtains. It was more like restructuring a malfunctioning roster while still 'going for it'. However I think they planned for the eventual rebuild (as plan b) and kept future pieces in place and traded older vets for younger vets.

All I really meant to do was answer the ppl who claim since we are in yr one of the rebuild we are destined to suck for 'X' number of yrs.

I stand by my original post's final paragraph and think most here agree:

The rebuild may not have officially started until the end of last year but given the amount of work that Feaster and co. have put into redeveloping a younger roster and deeper prospect pool the last few years I think we are further along than most think.

[Flash Walken]

The rebuild started after the team couldn't get Iginla to sign on the dotted line for an extension.

[sa226]

I would be very curious to know if the organization now feels it has the assets in the system to return to contention, or how many assets away they feel they are.

Or if they think they need a couple more drafts to get where they want to be.

Sent from my SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by sa226

I would be very curious to know if the organization now feels it has the assets in the system to return to contention, or how many assets away they feel they are.

Or if they think they need a couple more drafts to get where they want to be.

Sent from my SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

Can you ever have enough?

Also, even though a lot of prospects look good, you never know what kind of player anyone will ultimately become.

Far too early to start thinking about the next phase IMO. Keep acquiring assets.

I think in 2 years, some answers will start to surface and they'll have a much better idea of what they have and what they don't yet have.

[Anduril]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Can you ever have enough?

Also, even though a lot of prospects look good, you never know what kind of player anyone will ultimately become.

Far too early to start thinking about the next phase IMO. Keep acquiring assets.

I think in 2 years, some answers will start to surface and they'll have a much better idea of what they have and what they don't yet have.

This is definitely the way to go. Need to keep in mind that as talented as somebody like Gaudreau is, we need to make sure that we're not just opening a spot for him to waltz in. Ideally we want him to gnaw for every bone that gets tossed his way rather than giving him any potential sense of entitlement.

[stemit14]

Originally Posted by Anduril

This is definitely the way to go. Need to keep in mind that as talented as somebody like Gaudreau is, we need to make sure that we're not just opening a spot for him to waltz in. Ideally we want him to gnaw for every bone that gets tossed his way rather than giving him any potential sense of entitlement.

That's the good thing about the way the flames are going about this rebuild... Plenty of players competing for spots. Gaudreau will be fighting for a left wing spot against baertschi, glencross, granlund, galiardi, Horak, and Reinhart (they've been trying them at wing). It's the same at every position. Everyone has to earn their spot.

[Miniac]

Our Gallagher could be Michael Ferland. Who was also a 5th round pick in the same draft year (2010).

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

Thanks thats pretty much what I meant yes.

re:Tinordi

I do think Sutters later moves set us back a few years. In regards to Feaster: trading for Byron and Butler was to clear cap space, Cammalleri for Bourque was to remove that anchor contract and if we got O'Reily it's unlikely we would have drafted 6th, thus no Monahan anyways....

To offer a boat anchor of a contract to a 31 year old Tanguay. Flames were a cap team until mid way through last year.

ROR also managed to make such an amazing impact on the Avs that they finished 2nd last overall. I don't think it is fair to speculate that given the way the Flames were going last year, that ROR would have magically improved their play.

Like others have said, the rebuild began when Iginla was ready to be moved. They tried some shortcuts to adjust their roster during the previous 2 years and some rhetoric about getting younger, such as a Regehr trade, which turned out very poorly for the Flames.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

To offer a boat anchor of a contract to a 31 year old Tanguay. Flames were a cap team until mid way through last year.

ROR also managed to make such an amazing impact on the Avs that they finished 2nd last overall. I don't think it is fair to speculate that given the way the Flames were going last year, that ROR would have magically improved their play.

Like others have said, the rebuild began when Iginla was ready to be moved. They tried some shortcuts to adjust their roster during the previous 2 years and some rhetoric about getting younger, such as a Regehr trade, which turned out very poorly for the Flames.

ROR could have easily gained the Flames one or two extra wins

[HartAttack]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

...
With that in mind, and getting back on topic, there's little role for a UFA Cammalleri on a rebuilding team. The Flames shouldn't be in the business of rewarding old veterans with offers to re-sign them. We need a cold-eyed and ruthless commitment to acquire highly skilled youth on this squad. When that happens we can support them with some veteran scoring down the road. But until then there are still major pieces missing to get this team back to a contender. That's the priority and that's accomplished by having more "bullets in the chamber" as one poster put it at the draft.

I agree with everything you're saying except for this...

You can't have a team full of 18 - 26 year olds. You need that veteran savvy, the drive and work ethic, what it means to be a pro day in and day out. As previous posters have said, Cammy is that guy out of our Forwards. And you need that guy while the skilled kids are developing! Not just to support them once they have developed.

[Savvy27]

Have to move Cammalleri. He's a good influence and a good player, but I don't think the Flames have a shortage of veterans on the team whatsoever. In fact, Stajan and Cammalleri could hardly be better options as both of them have younger players who are set to step into their roles as the team moves forward (Stajan = Colborne, Horak, Knight, Reinhart ... Cammalleri = Hudler, Baertschi, Gaudreau).

It seems like very poor asset management to hold onto guys that are not elite in their position, while younger guys are primed to do the same role. The Flames have to put their faith in their own prospects eventually and, as others have pointed out, there remain quite a few veterans on the team.

I would keep Stemniak because RW is a position of weakness in the development system and by moving Cammalleri and Stajan, as well as letting Jackman move on, some spots have already opened up.

[Fire]

Trade Stempniak and Cammalleri at the deadline for picks. The Flames can re-sign them in the off-season as UFAs if they truly want to be Flames. I'm sure they would appreciate the chance to win the Stanley Cup.

[FlameZilla]

http://www.ottawasun.com/2013/11/03/...-the-offensive

Nice article by Gilbertson here, but didn't know where to post it. The media is so positive about the rebuild that it's almost laughable!

I like what Cammy has brought to the team & I think he's an awesome influence on the young players. I wouldn't mind him staying around at the right price. However, if he's scoring at a point-per-game clip all season we should be able to get a nice return for him at the deadline.