[News] Flames Cut 19

[TurnedTheCorner]

Originally Posted by bigpete

Hey sorry I'm late to the party, and this has probably been asked a bunch of times, but did none of the college guys attend camp? Eg. Jankowski, Gaudreau, Gillies, Arnold, etc.

Is that because of the new CBA or something?

They can't come to camp without a pro contract, and they can't play NCAA if they sign a pro contract. Coming to camp would mean ending their NCAA careers.

I'm probably off on some details, but that's the gist of it.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by bigpete

Hey sorry I'm late to the party, and this has probably been asked a bunch of times, but did none of the college guys attend camp? Eg. Jankowski, Gaudreau, Gillies, Arnold, etc.

Is that because of the new CBA or something?

They've never been at camp in the past (only prospect development camp, and I believe they have to pay for their own travel costs). The semester started 2.5 weeks ago for them.

[bigpete]

I see, thanks guys!

I guess I just didn't notice it in past years because we've never had many NCAA prospects before a couple of years ago.

[doctajones428]

Kanzig still up?

Good. Good.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

They can't come to camp without a pro contract, and they can't play NCAA if they sign a pro contract. Coming to camp would mean ending their NCAA careers.

I'm probably off on some details, but that's the gist of it.

They don't need a pro contract to come to camp. They have to get permission from their school, teachers and pay their own way. School's and teachers would never sign off on missing 2 weeks of classes. Especially when it does not help the school in anyway.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by mikeecho

IMHO, the most reasonable explanation is that NHL teams don't necessarily cut players in order of talent or potential.

There are many other factors and I strongly suspect that there are players still in camp that weren't better than players cut today. I'm guessing that some guys were kept to get a closer look at the player in different situations to assess what kind of asset they have.

The Flames have a pretty good read on Cundari from his time with the club last season, but already know he's lower on the depth chart for now and belongs in Abbotsford.

I was responding to posters that were saying waivers and money might have had a big part in Cundari not making first cuts.

There is zero chance that if they thought he could make the 6/7th spot that they would send him down. The main reason he got sent down was that he did not have a good camp. He only played 4 games for the flames last year, so i have a hard time believing that was ample enough that if they thought he was close they would send him down.

Shame for him, because opportunities like this year do not come around often.

[Enoch Root]

This year is far from over

[TurnedTheCorner]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

They don't need a pro contract to come to camp. They have to get permission from their school, teachers and pay their own way. School's and teachers would never sign off on missing 2 weeks of classes. Especially when it does not help the school in anyway.

So there you go - thought the contract was necessary, guess not.

[SuperMatt18]

Thought Poirier and Hanowski did enough to at lease stick around camp for another couple days as a reward for their hard work.

Especially Hanowski who showed a lot of hard work and dedication to get himself into shape over the offseason.

[macrov]

Originally Posted by cannon7

He played well. I think this boils down to the NHL roster already having a few guys of his ilk and him just being the odd man out. Sieloff and Ramage are more stay-at-home types, Wotherspoon and Kanzig have more size. Then you also have guys like Smith and Butler clgoging up the depth chart.

Sure...but do you see any of the firstr 4 you mentioned making the opening night roster? Cundari is probably the closer than any of them are.

[foshizzle11]

Originally Posted by macrov

Sure...but do you see any of the firstr 4 you mentioned making the opening night roster? Cundari is probably the closer than any of them are.

if this was the case, why was he sent down before them?

I think Cundari could be a decent 5th/6th guy eventually but if he isn't stealing the 4th position, no need to keep him up and fill up a spot when you have russell/smith, et al filling that role.

[jd456]

I think a factor in Poirier being sent down early was maybe because the QMJHL season has already started. Sounds like he had a really good showing but maybe the team wanted him to go back, start making a strong case for the World Juniors and see where he is next year. I don't believe the OHL or WHL has started yet, though I could be wrong, which could be why Kanzig is still in camp. The coaches can keep working with him and he's not missing any game action.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

So there you go - thought the contract was necessary, guess not.

More than just getting permission from the school, they would have to pay out of their own pocket for the travel here, food and accommodation while here, and would have to pay for any team issued sticks or other equipment.

Otherwise, they would lose NCAA eligibility.

[Erick Estrada]

The day the Flames traded for Russell probably meant that Cundari would have to be very impressive to make the squad as the Flames are pretty soft on the back end already and carrying two short defenseman was not likely a real possibility. I think that fans got a little overly excited by his first game in a Flames uniform but at his size he has to be better than just good and he wasn't good enough in camp obviously.

[Cole436]

As mentioned before, Feaster alluded to the idea that the non-regulars at camp are the ones who need to show their value to the organization.

A Monahan and Knight have a very good chance to actually make this team, so it makes sense to keep them on the roster. Poirier and Street are not going to make this team, but Street has had a year of investment put in him and an NHL contract, so it makes sense from the Flames perspective to keep him up and judge where his developmental path is at, compared to an 18 year old first round pick who isn't ready for the show.

Cundari is a similar situation. The Flames brass knows what he can bring and where he's at. He's not going to crack the top 6 right now, and his development would be useless as a 7th defender. It makes sense to test a guy like Billen's to see how he would fare in an NHL call up. It can also explain why Kanzig is still there, as the Flames don't know him in this sense, and want to continue to see how he fares with NHL competition.

As a fan it sucks, we want to see our best prospects play as much as they can. However from an organizational standpoint, the Flames have to evaluate the team which is actually being iced this season, and the callups who will be playing intermediately.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I listened to the Feaster interview on the Fan960.

Poirier impressed, but his conditioning was NOT at the NHL level. Feaster said he came to camp fit, but it was a step below the level they expect for the NHL. Not to say that Poirier has any conditioning issues, but there is no point in keeping him up. He also stated that he wants Poirier to have a strong start to his season as they want him to have the best chance to make the WJC team.

Kanzig - didn't go into detail really. My thoughts is that he is physically NHL-ready. He will most likely not make the WJC team of course. Because he is physically ready, I would think the Flames feel it will be a good kick-start to his development playing with and against NHL talent before being reassigned to Victoria. Also gives the Flames a bit more time to gauge where Kanzig is right now, and to figure out where he needs developing the most. Just my own rationalization.

As for Cundari being cut now - well, you can make a case for and against this. I believe he is waiver-eligible. Safer sending him down now rather than later - less risk as teams are trying to send down their own players, right? I expect him to get some time on the Flames. Feaster basically said that every year the Flames burn through 10-12 defencemen (if I remember correctly - listened to it hours ago) and he will more than likely be a recall at some point.

I don't really see any surprises one way or another that can't be rationalized in some way. Begin is the biggest surprise to me really, but I would think that his role on the Heat would be one of leadership. Keeping him around and making him one of the last cuts in camp isn't a terrible idea anyways, and though he isn't exactly NHL-caliber any longer, his conditioning and preparation is top-notch and just further helps the rookies. I expect him to be sent down in the next cut though.

I expect every waiver-eligible player that is on the fence as to making the team or not will be sent down in the next cut as a safety precaution. I THINK in the new CBA that players just need to clear waivers once being sent down and will not need to clear waivers in the future (or there is at least a 'x' number of games they play in the NHL upon recall before needing to clear again if they get demoted a second time.. something like that anyways - anyone know the exact rules?).

Monahan is the most interesting case. He looks NHL ready, and Hartley has definitely praised his maturity level and his 200ft game. However, do you burn an ELC now? The 67's would be ######ed not to trade him to a contender at some point in his season as well. Playing top-line minutes game in and game out will also allow him to further develop his offensive game, and would guarantee (as much as there can be) that he would make the WJC squad (though the Flames would of course have the option to allow him that opportunity if he makes the NHL this year). You can make solid arguments both for and against his assignment this season. I have a SLIGHT preference for him to be sent down as I don't think his development would in any way be hindered, and it saves a year of his ELC, but I would in no way be disappointed that they keep him up either. Will be interesting what they decide to do with him.

[Freeway]

Originally Posted by macrov

Sure...but do you see any of the firstr 4 you mentioned making the opening night roster? Cundari is probably the closer than any of them are.

Ramage, Wotherspoon and Sieloff have all been better than Cundari from what I've seen.

[dying4acup]

Sieloff is the real interesting case. NHL, AHL, or OHL? Eligible for any and all. Where is he? Personally, I'd like to see him work on his offensive/puck possession game in th O for the year, but he definitely makes a case for one of the better leagues. Physically and mentally, he can play in the NHL now.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Interesting article on Coda Gordon. I had no idea he was having a heart condition at the start of camp. I actually think he is very underrated here (remember reading how some scouts felt he was a huge steal by the Flames picking him up where they did last year).

The Calgary Flames prospect (drafted in the sixth round in 2012) was on the shelf through the first week of the main training camp because a test of his heart showed some irregularities the doctors wanted checked out.

http://blogs.canoe.ca/slam/hockey/fl...hes-got-heart/

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

I listened to the Feaster interview on the Fan960.

Poirier impressed, but his conditioning was NOT at the NHL level. Feaster said he came to camp fit, but it was a step below the level they expect for the NHL. Not to say that Poirier has any conditioning issues, but there is no point in keeping him up. He also stated that he wants Poirier to have a strong start to his season as they want him to have the best chance to make the WJC team.

And it shouldn't be a shock to anyone as 95% of 18 year olds do not have NHL conditioning. Having the skill is one thing, but the last thing we would want to do is have him come in and get derailed due to injuries.