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Old 08-15-2012, 11:08 PM   #101
jayswin
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Originally Posted by MRCboicgy View Post
I'm so allergic to weed that I start sneezing uncontrollably with the slightest waft - hell, I can usually tell if someone has smoked it even if I can't smell it. It's really the only thing that causes me allergies.

I would hope, if legalized, they would be like the Dutch and make it available in certain places, so those of us who really don't care about the crap don't have to inhale it. I've had to bust two different units in my building just because they light up so often that I will literally spend hours sneezing the rest of the night.
And hey, since it's illegal/against condo board rules, it's within my rights to bust them.
Dude, I thought you were so cool, one of my favorite posters, and now I found out you narc people out?
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Old 08-15-2012, 11:09 PM   #102
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Old 08-15-2012, 11:51 PM   #103
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I once talked to a pot user that claimed that there is no way the government would make anywhere near the taxes from pot that it does from booze and smokes, since it is really easy to grow enough for your own personal use.

Anyone able to comment on if this is likely correct?
It's not that easy to grow smoke-able weed. It requires a fair bit of dedication, supplies, and knowledge. Sure, anyone could do it if they set enough time aside to figure it out, but at this point, why not just head down to 7-11 and buy a baggy?
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Old 08-16-2012, 12:37 AM   #104
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I once talked to a pot user that claimed that there is no way the government would make anywhere near the taxes from pot that it does from booze and smokes, since it is really easy to grow enough for your own personal use.

Anyone able to comment on if this is likely correct?
Today you can buy tobacco and papers and even a little device that lets you roll your own cigarettes. Only the most dedicated smokers (and people who drive Sunbirds) bother with that kind of mess.

Weed would be the same way because people are lazy (or not cheapskates) (or not Sunbird drivers) (or lazy because they smoke too much weed as it is) (or because they saw Scarface and they know you never get high on your own supply) so they probably wouldn't bother growing the reefer themselves.
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Old 08-16-2012, 06:57 AM   #105
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For guys like me who can get weed anytime I want but have a tough time saying no to it when it is in my possesion. I would like the idea of stopping by the liquor store and grabbing a couple of joints for the firepit on a Friday night.

I would rather have it that way than having to buy a larger illegal quantity and have it sit in my garage calling to me to come out and play on a weeknight or worse weekday.

As a personal view, the question of would pot use cut into booze sales? For me absolutely, I would rather smoke a joint and sip water around a fire than be on my 6th beer anytime.

Perhaps my thinking is flawed but if I go over to another persons house for a get together I can smoke a joint, fit in nicely with the drinkers in the room and drive home in a few hours sober and safe and not feel like I donated my night as the designated driver.
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Old 08-16-2012, 08:44 AM   #106
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If your objecting to the its a plant argument crowd the shouldnt you also be objecting to the whole concept that their needs to be a justification to make illegal.

The argument is entirely backwards. Anytime a freedom is being removed The burdan of proof should lie on the people taking away a freedom to prove it is harmful and not on the users to prove it is okay. The worst arguments by far are one the anti legalization side which are

Drugs are bad
And
Marijauna is a gateway drug

I would rather here plants are good as a generic argument than drugs are bad mmmkay
Dude, have you actually read anything I've written?

I've said about a dozen times, I don't care if pot is legal or not.
I don't care if the reasoning behind whether or not it's legal makes sense or not.
What bugs me is when people trot out the "It's a plant argument" like it makes any sense.
There are a ton of arguments you could make that don't rely on an obviously flawed premise like "plants are safe for consumption", that's what bugs me, and what I've been saying is stupid.
Argue the validity of the reasons behind pot being illegal all you want, just leave the fact that it's a plant out of it.
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Old 08-16-2012, 09:27 AM   #107
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Dude, I thought you were so cool, one of my favorite posters, and now I found out you narc people out?
Hey, if all they did was eat brownies, then I'd be cool - I have no problem with it and am not against legalization.

Having said that, people who do smoke up should at least have the consideration that the smoke isn't contained to just them - just like secondhand cigarettes, not everyone wants the smell - or in my case has an actual reaction to it. It's not like I can just take Benadryl and be fine.

In this case, we asked them to stop, they were (huge) jerks about it and so I was a (mega) jerk back.
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Old 08-16-2012, 09:28 AM   #108
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There is no gateway aspect to marijuana! Most people who smoke marijuana stop there. The people that move on to harder drugs from there would have done so even if they never smoked pot. Calling marijuana a gateway drug is like calling water a gateway liquid.
Disagree. I think there is a gateway aspect. But strictly because it is illegal. I know in my experience I tried it after high school and thought, wow why is this illegal while alcohol is legal? It made no sense to me since alcohol can clearly be much more destructive in terms of drunk driving, bar fights, dying from ODing on it, etc. Which makes one think, what other drugs are illegal that are actually interesting and worth trying once?

I think if you legalize it the gateway aspect goes away because it is publicly considered one of the safer drugs like nicotine and alcohol (even though both those seem to be less safe from my experience.) So it is on the one side of the line while cocaine, heroin, E, M, mushrooms, etc sit on the other.
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Old 08-16-2012, 10:34 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by Rathji View Post
I once talked to a pot user that claimed that there is no way the government would make anywhere near the taxes from pot that it does from booze and smokes, since it is really easy to grow enough for your own personal use.

Anyone able to comment on if this is likely correct?
As mentioned people can roll their own cigarettes, brew their own beer and wine at home but they don't, or at least most don't. Just like most people don't grow their own vegetables, most people won't grow their own marijuana because of the dedication to doing it.

If someone has a small grow(4ft x 4ft grow room), which I assume would be the case if they were growing for legal personal use, they would be looking at 5-6 months from seed and 3-4 months from clone by the time they got smokeable weed. Now you have to ask yourself you are probably spending some time daily taking care of the plants and by the time that room is ready to smoke you are getting 1-1.5lbs depending on strain, equipment, growing environment and experience.

So say you get a pound yield every 4 months average you are looking at about an ounce of a weed ($160-220 street value) per week which may seem worth it but at the same time being legal the value would go down and you would have set up, electric bill, nutrients, soil and most importantly your time. You would probably spend 15-20 minutes daily checking, feeding, etc. (~30hrs per grow)

So that quickly turns into, I can run down to 711 and pay X amount for a pack of joints or I can spend all that time growing my own to find out I don't have the experience to do it, your time isn't worth it or even worse your crop fails.

I think the reason most people think the way your friend does because the way "professionals" grow with automated systems, huge plants, huge yields, etc. but I doubt anyone growing for themselves would want to spend the investment to get that going. I know I have looked into more out of curiously (I'm too pretty for jail ) and it isn't a cheap hobby, you have to be doing it for profit to make it worth your time IMHO. And the government could still make the huge grows illegal, while leaving those who want to throw a couple in a closet or in the backyard alone. The government just needs to make their product so reasonably priced no one would bother buying from an illegal source. The only reason for the inflation of prices for marijuana is because it is illegal, with a warehouse set up the government could undercut any illegal grower while still supplying a top end product and bringing in huge revenues.

Since there is a ton of misinformation about marijuana in general if anyone is interested there is a documentary about the BC marijuana industry call The Union: The Business Of Getting High. You can watch it for free online http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/the-u...-getting-high/

I don't think it's any secret that I'm on the side of legalization and taxation but in the long run I don't care because access to it will be the same regardless. The War On Drugs was lost before it even started and it's a shame that a few interest groups and uneducated people continue to fight for it to remain illegal while they complain about gang violence. Between 60-70% of all cartels money comes from the sale of marijuana, without that money they can't afford to kidnap, transport other drugs, and kill dozens of people a day to keep profits high. Just like you don't see the cartel bringing up cigarettes or booze, because it's legal there is no profit. You would see the grow-ops in national parks stop, you would see more tax money going to government so they can either fight real drugs or help those that truly are addicts.

I could go on and on about why it should be legal and taxed but I got to get to the golf course. Where the other side has "it's a drug it's bad", "will someone please think of the children?" or the usual case is an uneducated person just repeating what they have been told by another uneducated person. The government and special interest groups have done a good job in the last 70 years lying and getting people to believe its a dangerous and harmful drug (YouTube "Reefer Madness") but it seems more and more people are thinking for themselves and even if they don't smoke it realize it's not the drug they were lead to believe for many years.
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Old 08-16-2012, 10:36 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by GGG View Post

The argument is entirely backwards. Anytime a freedom is being removed The burdan of proof should lie on the people taking away a freedom to prove it is harmful and not on the users to prove it is okay. The worst arguments by far are one the anti legalization side which are
You are looking at this completely backwards. If there was a movement to make weed illegal today then you would be right. The burden of proof would lie with those trying to ban it. (not that they need that much proof as the government bans a ton of stuff without much in the way of sound logic or reasoning)

However, at this point weed is illegal. There is no movement to ban weed, the movement is the opposite and therefore the burden should lie with those who want it legal to provide a valid reason. You may think differently but the reality is that if your side can't prove it is safe then nothing will ever change.
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Old 08-16-2012, 10:42 AM   #111
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To counter the point about people growing their own, I would ask how many people grow their own tobacco. That is legal now and I have never heard of anyone setting up their own grow for personal consumption.

I know they do it on a larger scale in the east but the government is always trying to crack down on illegal cigarettes.
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