[Trade] Elias Lindholm to VAN for Kuzmenko, Brzustewicz, Jurmo, 2024 1st, cond 2024 4th

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Geeoff

I'm really excited for the return for Tanev, if the Flames turned down another 1st for him

I read it as the Flames wanted another 1st and the Canucks said no. Which is understandable - giving up your 24 and 25 firsts for two rentals doesn't make sense.

But yeah, return should be good. Ideally another 1st, but I'd take a 2nd ++ as well.

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by devo22

I read it as the Flames wanted another 1st and the Canucks said no. Which is understandable - giving up your 24 and 25 firsts for two rentals doesn't make sense.

But yeah, return should be good. Ideally another 1st, but I'd take a 2nd ++ as well.

Another 1st or equal type prospect would be amazing. Then Hanifin!

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Geeoff

I'm really excited for the return for Tanev, if the Flames turned down another 1st for him

They didn’t turn down a first. They tried to get a first. I get why Vancouver would not want to give up firsts in back to back drafts. Gives me hope another team will give up a 1st though. At worst probably looking at a 2nd +.

[Cycling76er]

I really hope we sign Hanifin to a reasonable deal and get a good return from Tanev. Hanifin is the kind've player that we would be hoping to get out of prospects or a pick but he's young enough that signing him would make sense.

We don't want to be such a terrible team that the team doesn't feel like they can actually win. Not great for morale or culture. IMHO.

[devo22]

In any case, this deal (plus asking for another 1st to include Tanev) should dispel any doubts about Conroy and the organization when it comes to the direction going forward. They can call it whatever they want, but this is a rebuild move. Really happy with it, even if it's within the division ... but I get why Conroy pulled the trigger. It's a really nice package, given Lindholms season so far.

Not a big fan of Kuzmenko, but this could be another sneaky good "buy low" addition, just like Sharky was. Pimp his numbers with PP time, then move him at the deadline 2025 for futures ... those are the kind of moves that can speed up a rebuild.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Do you have a link to the ranking? Would like to see it. Would like to see their ranking prior to the start of the season for comparison if you have it. Just found The Hockey Writer's mid-season prospect rankings and Vancouver jumped to 16 just ahead of the Flames and Brzustewicz was added to their top five. If a player isn't ranked before the season and then jumps to #5, that would speak volumes about the dearth of quality prospects in the system more than anything. I also wouldn't say Wallinder or Lekkerimaki are A+ prospects. Not many teams have an A+ prospect, let alone two, especially a system ranked in the middle of the league. The Flames have zero A+ prospects and are at #17. I think that because Brzustewicz is a Flame now his stock has skyrocketed for the board. If he was a name tossed around as the principle before the trade was announced the mood on the possible deal would have been much different and people would not have been happy. They would have (and did) demanded Wallinder or Lekkerimaki along with Hoglander and the 1st for compensation of taking on Kuzmenko. As I've said, it's a good trade for the depth it provides to our paper thin prospect depth on the blueline, but it is a futures trade and now we have to watch and hope these kids turn into players.

Or you can just admit that he isn’t a B prospect. And you’re selling Lekkerimaki and Willander short.

In a quick redraft of the most recent draft, I’m willing to bet Brzu has skyrocketed his draft spot 50 spots.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Moneyhands23

Zadarov doesn't live back home in Russia. Easy for you to judge from your safe space. Maybe go to Russia for a month and put a pride shirt on daily. See how it goes for you.

Oh give me a break. The only reason for not wearing a rainbow jersey before an NHL game is because they hate LGBTQ people. Quit making excuses for them. Plenty of Russian NHL players have worn them and nothing bad has happened because of it.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

The Canucks are a legit contender this year so if I was a Canucks fan, I'd be happy with the deal. I think Lindholm, despite his under production so far this season, moves the needle on any team. If the Flames were in the same position, I'd want to go for it this season and wouldn't mind giving up futures.

Players of Lindholm's quality aren't usually available at the deadline. He moves the needle significantly, for any team. And Vancouver's biggest need was a top 6 forward. It's difficult to imagine a deadline pickup that's much better than this. Great trade for them.

And as a result, they were willing to pay, and Conroy managed to get from them, a good price.

It's a great hockey trade. For both teams.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Flames1217

Been proposing Kuz + 1st for Lindy for a long time and really surprised with the return.

Was that with the thought of Kuzmenko being a 40 goal guy, or a guy the Canucks were trying to ship out as a salary dump? There's a marked difference between the two. I don't mind absorbing the contract if the player returns close to form, but that seems a reach considering the shooting percentage required.

Originally Posted by devo22

Scott Wheeler on Joni Jurmo last January ... had him at #3 at Canucks prospects back then:

Brzustewicz is easily the centre piece for me, but if Jurmo can somewhat pan out as a bottom-pairing defenseman, that's gravy.

I agree here. Jurmo could be the guy that turns the deal heavily in the Flames favor. As it is I think the deal is already in Calgary's favor as they got a mitt full of assets for one that was not going to resign. Great work by Conry and smart asset management. The success factor will now be turning those assets into quality NHL players. Jurmo has the potential to fill a much needed role with the club. I would put him on the same level as Kuznetsov, which is a good thing. I see Kuznetsov turning into a solid bottom pair guy, so hope the same for Jurmo. We get that AND a top four defenseman out of Brzustewicz and this is a homerun.

Originally Posted by EVERLAST

Jurmo can become an excellent defenceman when in a room with Tanev and Weegar .

Tanev will most likely be elsewhere. Unless he gets injured he's going to be dealt and will have plenty of options come summer. It would be nice if he came back, but there will be lots of interest in him by the sound of it and the Flames shouldn't get caught in a developing bidding war for Tanev's services.

I'll.take a.big bruising mobile smart defenceman any day. As long as his personal opinions on coaching and team mates stays out of his mouth and isn't spewed to the world during soapbox moments were likely good.

Well, he's big and he can skate. Bruising doesn't appear to be part of his repartee yet. Maybe it comes, but physicality appears to be something he is not yet using to his advantage. It would be great if he could turn into a Zadorov type player but he may be a little more Dougie Hamilton than Nikita Zadorov when it comes to physical play.

What's this about his mouth? Does Jurmo have a history here we need to be aware of?

[kipperiggy]

Originally Posted by codynw

Oh give me a break. The only reason for not wearing a rainbow jersey before an NHL game is because they hate LGBTQ people. Quit making excuses for them. Plenty of Russian NHL players have worn them and nothing bad has happened because of it.

Careful you're not allowed to talk about it in this thread. Funny the number of people in here that don't realize support when it's convenient for you is in fact not support at all.

People are allowed to be disappointed this is the main player the Flames got back, for any and all reasons. The dogpiling on butterfly and Yamer for expressing their disappointment is against the whole point of a discussion board.

[Enoch Root]

[QUOTE=devo22;8970950]Scott Wheeler on Joni Jurmo last January ... had him at #3 at Canucks prospects back then:

3. Joni Jurmo, LHD, 20 (Jukurit)

Jurmo is a fascinating project as a massive human who can really move. His north-south skating is really quite impressive for a 6-foot-4, 200-pound defenceman, and he uses it a lot (sometimes too much). As a result, he’s very noticeable out there (for good and bad reasons at times). The raw tools have always been appealing. He has shown, against his peers, that he can drive the game at both ends and hold the puck a lot, especially again for a player his size. Some of that has been coached out of him along the way with different teams/at different levels, but I think it’s important that the Canucks develop him for who he is: a very active, involved player who can be a transition monster when he’s playing with confidence with the puck, showing eagerness to join the rush, and using his feet to pull away from pressure. It’s going to come with some warts and some mistakes (he’s prone to bobble in control) but he’s slowly learning to think the game more consistently and force less, and that will continue with reps. There’s still work to do on his pivots and his attention to detail but he’s only 20; there’s no rush, there’s a lot to work with. As long as he’s taking steps forward instead of back, he’ll remain relevant. He may never play an NHL game (the Canucks still haven’t signed him) but I’d want to work with him and see if he can be lightly moulded into an NHL defenceman.[/quote}

Brzustewicz is easily the centre piece for me, but if Jurmo can somewhat pan out as a bottom-pairing defenseman, that's gravy.

It's already been mentioned that Zadorov is a good comparable, but you could read that description and actually think it was written for Zadorov.

[kipperiggy]

Originally Posted by Fischy13

If I’m not mistaken, and I don’t think I am, the best the Vancouver 1st could be is 24th overall if they remain in 1st place in the league. How I understand it, each round the teams knocked out are ranked in order of their overall ranking:

Pick #17 goes to the team with the lowest overall record of the first round losers
Pick #18 goes to the team with the second lowest overall record of the first round losers
Pick #24 goes to the team with the best record of the first round losers.

So if Vancouver is first in the league come playoff time, they will be the 24th overall in a first round exit scenario.

Same applies to second round and the last two rounds are combined.

On the Markstrom topic. They absolutely need to move him to NJ this year. This is the highest his value we will see considering a sell off now. Listening to many like Boomer and Pinder, some other well known insiders, he will fetch a haul. Getting anyone like a Holts or Mercer would be much needed. Conroy needs to fill a top line center position with the trading of Lindholm. A #1 center has to be in their plans. Even if the have to package a pick to get one. It’s a glaring hole and a 6th overall pick won’t fill that for a bit.

Any scouting experts have names they could throw out around the 24th spot at this point?

[Geeoff]

Originally Posted by devo22

In any case, this deal (plus asking for another 1st to include Tanev) should dispel any doubts about Conroy and the organization when it comes to the direction going forward. They can call it whatever they want, but this is a rebuild move. Really happy with it, even if it's within the division ... but I get why Conroy pulled the trigger. It's a really nice package, given Lindholms season so far.

Not a big fan of Kuzmenko, but this could be another sneaky good "buy low" addition, just like Sharky was. Pimp his numbers with PP time, then move him at the deadline 2025 for futures ... those are the kind of moves that can speed up a rebuild.

I think adding a struggling offense-first type of player like Kuzmenko is good for a rebuild because it's always gonna be exciting one way or another when he's on the ice LOL

[kipperiggy]

Originally Posted by SaskUke

Pretty sure Zary is Ukrainian-Canadian.

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Username checks out.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Lindholm hasn’t moved the needle his whole career in the playoffs as the Flames. It’s his contract year so he may be motivated but again he hasn’t done #### all year.

That was exactly the same read everyone had on Pavel Datsyuk—he sucked in the playoffs. Then, one day in his late-20s ... BOOM.

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[kipperiggy]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

That was exactly the same read everyone had on Pavel Datsyuk—he sucked in the playoffs. Then, one day in his late-20s ... BOOM.

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I wish we had blown our $10.5 million load on Lindholm instead of Huberdeau.

Or at least it would have given us the ability to offer a center $9.5 million instead of a winger that never played a day for the team.

If Lindholm actually turned down $9.5 million well I'm not sure there's anything we could have done. Huberdeau has shown us unless you're the elite of the elite, you shouldn't be going higher than this.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm reasonably happy with the trade but both of these players being unsigned kind of throws a bit of an extra layer on the trade as history hasn't been kind when it comes to unsigned Flames defense prospects. Hopefully Conroy and Co. can make good sales pitches to these guys and pivot quickly if the players don't commit.

There was Tom Erixson, Adam Fox ...

Am I missing someone? Two players in 15 years does not constitute a "history."

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[devo22]

Brandon Hickey too, IIRC. But that wasn't a huge loss.

[Cheese]

Ive watched Hunter here in KW 10 times at least, Hunter is a very good Dman. a 1.47 Pts/G dman in his D+1 season.
3rd Overall in the OHL for points and 1st overall for Assists by 17 points, and 9th overall for Powerplay assists!
Hunter always has his head up, knows where his team mates are and is sound defensively. Maybe not an A+ prospect, but certainly chasing it. He will be a player.

[Hackey]

The Score rated the trade an A for the Canucks and a B- for the Flames.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.the...ws/2835022/amp