Making the playoffs or keeping our top-10 first round pick 2025?

[traptor]

Yeah I hate to be so pessimistic, but as flames fan it just feels like we all know exactly how this is going to go.

Currently sitting 16th in pt%. 2 pts out of a wildcard spot. 4 pts out of the top 10.

[Bingo]

Losing 5 of 7 with a bit of a surge from the tenth worst team has the Flames only needed to be 4 games under .500 the rest of the way to tie for 10th.

I thought that path was over.

Maybe not.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Groot

Wow you're finally becoming self aware?!!?

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by littlereddevil

Those Blackhawk teams would never have been successful without them finding Keith and Seabrook, both of them drafted outside the lottery positions. Also Crawford was a key contributor to their success outside Kane, Toews and Hossa. To be a successful contender, you need not only forward talent, but defensive strength, secondary scoring and great goaltending.

Bedard may be the next generational talent but they still have to build solid pieces around him which takes time and patience, and by then, will Bedard have the patience to stay on a losing team or will he follow the likes of Eichel, Reinhart, etc. in wanting out as soon as he gets his first chance?

I have been looking a lot at the make up of the Stanley cup winning teams and there is that one decade that was really dominated by 3 teams. The thing that is interesting about the Pittsburgh and Chicago teams, is both won early in the ELC period of their stars. I think that can be attributed to them having a lot of the right pieces beyond the players they picked at the top of the draft. LA I think is the same.

The Capitals were a team that was built in a similar fashion and probably would have had more cups if they didn't have to for through the Penguins.

I think the rest of the teams are built on developed talent through the draft and bringing in some of those players that were drafted high. I think that decade from 2009 to 2019 really pushes that narrative of having to tank, but their are some things that aren't the same as they are now. The different contract parameters that skews things a bit. Both Chicago were very fortunate to win the lotteries to get their key players. Which if you think about it, if they were scorched earth they probably would not have walked out of the draft with those players. Crosby being a true generational talent doesn't hurt their cause and only shows how bad the Oilers have mismanaged McDavid.

[kehatch]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

So what's your solution? Get rid of Wolf? Because this is not a bottom-5 team with Wolf in goal.

No. I want them to prioritize futures when making moves instead of trying to balance it with a win now approach. I would also like then to be more aggressive with trading veterans rather then waiting until we have no choice.

[YyjFlames]

Minnesota is likely going to be another “model” of good mushy middle drafting and patient team building to put together a cup contender. Guerin has done a pretty great job in the last few years and has put together a strong team with a very deep prospect base (2nd in the nhl according to Scott wheeler).

It shows that patiently building around vets and drafting well is an effective model.

I do wonder, as I think strong GMing has a good amount of luck involved, if Ryan Sutter and Zach Parise’s crazy contracts and seemingly crazier buyouts forced a more patient rebuild as that team couldn’t simply buy their way out of the build but had to be more savvy.

There’s no single model, but importantly, the best teams either get lucky and draft a generational talents or are patiently built around a mix of veterans and young players.

Calgary and Conroy need to continue to be patient. They’ve got a good thing going.

[traptor]

Originally Posted by YyjFlames

Minnesota is likely going to be another “model” of good mushy middle drafting and patient team building to put together a cup contender. Guerin has done a pretty great job in the last few years and has put together a strong team with a very deep prospect base (2nd in the nhl according to Scott wheeler).

It shows that patiently building around vets and drafting well is an effective model.

I do wonder, as I think strong GMing has a good amount of luck involved, if Ryan Sutter and Zach Parise’s crazy contracts and seemingly crazier buyouts forced a more patient rebuild as that team couldn’t simply buy their way out of the build but had to be more savvy.

There’s no single model, but importantly, the best teams either get lucky and draft a generational talents or are patiently built around a mix of veterans and young players.

Calgary and Conroy need to continue to be patient. They’ve got a good thing going.

The big difference with the flames and wild are that they have a superstar winger in Kaprizof to build around. We have no one even close to that level.

I think if we had the player, alot more flames that would be happy with where things were going.

Personally, it makes me antsy because I don't see that player in the system anywhere. And it feels like you need atleast one of those types of guys to do real damage.

[Robbob]

Yeah I agree that Conroy is building a good foundation. Building from the net out they have a decent foundation of prospects. Over the next couple years they will have 4 1st rounders to try to boost that forward group.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Losing 5 of 7 with a bit of a surge from the tenth worst team has the Flames only needed to be 4 games under .500 the rest of the way to tie for 10th.

I thought that path was over.

Maybe not.

Which is a little frustrating since Conroy just made a nice deal to add some talent.

[Vinny01]

2pts out of a playoff spot and 4pts out of a top 10 pick. I just hope we get one of those. Admittedly I got on the playoff train once the Flyers trade happened but losing 3 of 4 since has hurt those hopes.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Which is a little frustrating since Conroy just made a nice deal to add some talent.

Why?

First, the are still 28 games left - a 5 game stretch isn't derailing the season.

Second - and far more importantly - the talent that they just added will still be here for many years. They didn't buy rentals, they bought guys that are going to be in their primes a few years from now (just like Zary)

[SuperMatt18]

The 13 game stretch after the break will be the most telling:

vs Sharks
@ Capitals
@ Lightning
@ Panthers
@ Hurricanes (Back to Back)
@ Flyers
@ Stars
vs Canadiens
vs Canucks
vs Avalanche
@ Maple Leafs
@ Rangers (Back to Back)
@ Devils

That schedule is a murderers row and really they could easily drop 4 points

[YyjFlames]

Originally Posted by traptor

The big difference with the flames and wild are that they have a superstar winger in Kaprizof to build around. We have no one even close to that level.

I think if we had the player, alot more flames that would be happy with where things were going.

Personally, it makes me antsy because I don't see that player in the system anywhere. And it feels like you need atleast one of those types of guys to do real damage.

The wild don’t have a Wolf in net. Parekh could be that superstar on the backend. Coronato has the potential (although Kaprizof is a stretch for his ceiling).

Important thing is that no team is built the same but patiently and smartly building, taking advantage of opportunities as they come up, and drafting well are almost always keys to success.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Why?

First, the are still 28 games left - a 5 game stretch isn't derailing the season.

Second - and far more importantly - the talent that they just added will still be here for many years. They didn't buy rentals, they bought guys that are going to be in their primes a few years from now (just like Zary)

Where did I say the season was derailed?

These are young players and their prime starts now. Conroy himself said the trade was made at this time to help this season, not just the future.

It would be a shame if the team didn't play as well and they dropped in the standings after the trade and the second rounder becomes more valuable.

But I'm not writing anything off, just commenting on what is happening.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Wow you're finally becoming self aware?!!?

A hint of self awareness would do you wonders, but keep being the user equivalent of a hemorrhoid.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

The 13 game stretch after the break will be the most telling:

vs Sharks
@ Capitals
@ Lightning
@ Panthers
@ Hurricanes (Back to Back)
@ Flyers
@ Stars
vs Canadiens
vs Canucks
vs Avalanche
@ Maple Leafs
@ Rangers (Back to Back)
@ Devils

That schedule is a murderers row and really they could easily drop 4 points

Yup. Still a very real possibility that they are in the lottery race by the trade deadline. Hard to imagine they trade Andersson now (I still think they should), but unless they find a way to stay in the race through that stretch of games (no chance), they will not be adding. And will probably be looking to move guys like Hanley, Barrie, and maybe Pospisil.

[SuperMatt18]

In terms of Kaprizov he's a UFA after next season and I wonder how much he wants to stay in Minnesota...

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Where did I say the season was derailed?

These are young players and their prime starts now. Conroy himself said the trade was made at this time to help this season, not just the future.

It would be a shame if the team didn't play as well and they dropped in the standings after the trade and the second rounder becomes more valuable.

But I'm not writing anything off, just commenting on what is happening.

I didn't suggest that you did - I am simply saying the season isn't over, and more importantly, those were long term adds.

So I don't see the adds as 'frustrating'

[CSharp]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

The 13 game stretch after the break will be the most telling:

vs Sharks
@ Capitals
@ Lightning
@ Panthers
@ Hurricanes (Back to Back)
@ Flyers
@ Stars
vs Canadiens
vs Canucks
vs Avalanche
@ Maple Leafs
@ Rangers (Back to Back)
@ Devils

That schedule is a murderers row and really they could easily drop 4 points

It'll be a win-win situation for the Flames if they win or lose most of their games after the break. I just hope it's not something in between.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Which is a little frustrating since Conroy just made a nice deal to add some talent.

How much talent is still tbd during the rest of the year.

The reason they were traded is that Philly did not believe the money they were being paid, or in the case of Frost, were likely to be paid ($9M total).

Their start, while not particularly relevant, has not been great. Calgary has lost 3 of their 4 games, they have 2 points in total , and they are a combined -7.