Electric vehicle war, is gas soon to be toast?

[chedder]

Originally Posted by peter12

Gas will be dead in ten years. Maybe even sooner. EV tech and adoption is starting to scale exponentially.

No chance. They may not sell ice commuter vehicles but there will be ice semi trucks, trains, farm machinery, airplanes, work trucks, boats, etc. Not to mention all of the existing vehicles on the road.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

No it's not like that at all. Diamonds aren't abundant.

Diamonds are extremely abundant.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by chedder

No chance. They may not sell ice commuter vehicles but there will be ice semi trucks, trains, farm machinery, airplanes, work trucks, boats, etc. Not to mention all of the existing vehicles on the road.

This, not everyone buys a new vehicle every few years. In fact most people don't

I have a 2010 fully loaded paid off truck...its already 12 years old and still runs perfectly and looks decent. Brand new model of the same truck is around 100k. That truck is not going to be in the scrap yard within the next 10 years.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Is that from Jan 1st on? or November to now?

seems low, didn't we have like 24 in a row like that around christmas

From November 1st till now. Our brains love to exaggerate the cold. I'm just as guilty as anyone with that, but a quick glance at the records show that they usually were shorter bursts. December 24 to January 9 was the longest stretch this winter but even that had a couple warmer days in between.

https://www.wunderground.com/history...YC/date/2022-1

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Mazrim

From November 1st till now. Our brains love to exaggerate the cold. I'm just as guilty as anyone with that, but a quick glance at the records show that they usually were shorter bursts. December 24 to January 9 was the longest stretch this winter but even that had a couple warmer days in between.

https://www.wunderground.com/history...YC/date/2022-1

okay but its not like anything above -20 has zero effect...its not just 24 nights a year that could cause issues.

really what is the difference between a reported -18 and -20 (don't say 2 degrees)

Heck my weather app said "feels like 19" last night, mid april

Its certainly a factor when considering an EV in this part of the world

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by dino7c

okay but its not like anything above -20 has zero effect...its not just 24 nights a year that could cause issues.

really what is the difference between a reported -18 and -20 (don't say 2 degrees)

Heck my weather app said "feels like 19" last night, mid april

Its certainly a factor when considering an EV in this part of the world

For clarity here, that's an un-applicable number that has no bearing on the actual temperature a battery would encounter. It would only be the real temp, not the windchill.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

For clarity here, that's an un-applicable number that has no bearing on the actual temperature a battery would encounter. It would only be the real temp, not the windchill.

I know, it was double digits below zero and that would certainly have an effect...again mid April. Its certainly a factor more than 24 nights a year.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by dino7c

okay but its not like anything above -20 has zero effect...its not just 24 nights a year that could cause issues.

really what is the difference between a reported -18 and -20 (don't say 2 degrees)

Of course it still has an effect, I wasn't implying otherwise. It's more the discussion about how much performance loss is tolerable in Canada for EVs. If -20 is where you really start to have severe battery performance issues, then that is a good line to use. I say -20 because Photon mentioned the website only going to -23. You're welcome to research whatever value you want, but I'm willing to bet that most people will still be able to do 95% of their trips they would normally do in the winter at say, -10.

[greyshep]

Originally Posted by Mazrim

Of course it still has an effect, I wasn't implying otherwise. It's more the discussion about how much performance loss is tolerable in Canada for EVs. If -20 is where you really start to have severe battery performance issues, then that is a good line to use. I say -20 because Photon mentioned the website only going to -23. You're welcome to research whatever value you want, but I'm willing to bet that most people will still be able to do 95% of their trips they would normally do in the winter at say, -10.

Probably right. This is why I feel its so important to have as much headroom as possible to start with. In our case I am fairly confident the Bolt EUV should give my wife close to 200 km of range in cold weather. Fortunately she has a charging station at her work so she would only really need 75km of range when she leaves in the morning. Of course this also assumes that the charger doesnt have a failure which can always occur I am sure.

[Azure]

To me it also depends on the ability to put solar on your roof, setup a battery to store energy, use that to charge your EV + your home.

Get the price of all those technologies down and people will adopt quicker.

[Calgary14]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

With all the pent up demand for electric vehicles, really only Tesla and maybe Ford are able to deliver. Even then the wait lists are crazy. Hyundai Ioniq 5 wait times are a year out. If sales in 2021 are over 9% (was 4.1% in 2020 and 2.1% in 2019)? What does 2022 look like?

We still have low uptake in North America, but China and Europe are really increasing. With Ford and GM publicly embracing electric vehicles (less convinced about actual plans), when does this change?


Tesla specifically has seen crazy growth. In Q4 of 2021 they delivered 308.6k vehicles for a new record. In Q4 of 2020 they got a new record of 180.6k. With Austin and Berlin factories now producing cars and Shanghai being expanded, what does 2022 look like? It's really crazy to see the growth

Toyota recently announced more details on their latest EV the BZ4X. It has a range of about 400km (I think) and will be priced at $42K USD for the base model. I am curious to see how this sells when it gets released

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Calgary14

Toyota recently announced more details on their latest EV the BZ4X. It has a range of about 400km (I think) and will be priced at $42K USD for the base model. I am curious to see how this sells when it gets released

I'm skeptical. Toyota is still out there claiming no one wants EVs and the plans shared with shareholders are still pretty free of ev investment. This smacks to me of a halo vehicle they sell but no one can find

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

I'm skeptical. Toyota is still out there claiming no one wants EVs and the plans shared with shareholders are still pretty free of ev investment. This smacks to me of a halo vehicle they sell but no one can find

It's actually a joint venture between Subaru and Toyota. Subaru calls theirs the slightly better named Solterra. I'm not sure which company has the most claim to development on it. Both versions are a bit ugly.


https://www.hotcars.com/these-are-th...baru-solterra/

[zamler]

Toyota plans to sell 7,000 in the U.S. this year that barely registers on the Toyota production scale.

[Street Pharmacist]

Part of the ICE vs EV argument specific to Canada is that for the vast majority of the world, the range below -20 isn't relevant. It's really relevant for good portions of Canada

[Calgary14]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

I'm skeptical. Toyota is still out there claiming no one wants EVs and the plans shared with shareholders are still pretty free of ev investment. This smacks to me of a halo vehicle they sell but no one can find

Like the Rav4 Prime. I've only ever seen one in person

[Fuzz]

Looks like Toyota is behind it, and Subaru is mostly a re-badge, with different interior and exterior styling.

[zamler]

Colder climate means less energy used in the summer to keep the cabin cool. Average temperature for most Canadian cities is zero or above that.

How that impacts range vs. a hot climate don't know.

[Hemi-Cuda]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

It's actually a joint venture between Subaru and Toyota. Subaru calls theirs the slightly better named Solterra. I'm not sure which company has the most claim to development on it. Both versions are a bit ugly.


https://www.hotcars.com/these-are-th...baru-solterra/

Why do all of these companies insist on creating butt ugly interiors for their EVs? If I wanted something that looks like a Tesla that's what I would buy, otherwise just give me your standard interior

[Fuzz]

For me personally the biggest range issue is being able to go to Lake Louise and back in the winter, without needing to worry about charging at the hill or on the way home.

If I'm going to Edmonton or something, finding a quick charger isn't the end of the world unless I was in a real rush. A road trip to the coast could be slightly more annoying, because I don't tend to like to stop much. Also visiting people might get awkward while traveling...(can I, uh, bum a charge?)

But I think most people would see a big benefit of electrifying some portion of their commute and city driving, while having an ICE for bigger trips. We don't commute by personal vehicle, so their is very little incentive to electrify right now, but I know we are not typical.