2012-2013 Toronto Blue Jays Off Season Thread

[jschick88]

Can confirm rpt earlier from colleague @NYPost_Mets current construct of Dickey trade is 4-for-3 (Dickey, Thole, minor leaguer) #Mets

Could change because #Bluejays will likely send some $$ to #Mets to cover some cost of Buck, so could be another prospect rather than $$

But right now it's Dickey/Thole/prospect (told not elite) for d/Arnaud/Syndegaard/Buck/prospect (told not elite) #Mets #Bluejays

We r seeing that cost to get aces in $$ in fr agcy or on trade market is very steep. #Mets #Bluejays

Keep in mind deal not final Physicals must be passed, #Bluejays will only complete with a Dickey 2-yr extension. But most legwork done #Mets

#Bluejays have built system last 3 yrs under Anthopoulos to try to make timely strike and see AL East vulnerability now #Yankees

https://twitter.com/Joelsherman1

[d_phaneuf]

Joel Sherman ‏@Joelsherman1

Keep in mind deal not final Physicals must be passed, #Bluejays will only complete with a Dickey 2-yr extension. But most legwork done #Mets

[VERVE]

Originally Posted by kipperfan

Hate that deal unless that "other player" on the Mets side is Wright. Probably the two best prospects we have left in the system for Dickey....no bloody thanks. AA could not possibly do a deal like that, I refuse to believe it.

Edit: If the Mets "other player" is Davis and our "other player" is Lind the deal is slightly less terrible...but still terrible IMO.

I agree. I do not like the deal (I actually hate it) if we have to give up a top prospect-blue chipper like D'Arnaud. Catchers are difficult to come by let alone a highly touted and skilled one. I realize knuckleballers have longevity but Dickey really had one solid year-one and now at 38. We are given up a potential franchise-game changer player as TDA, which may come back to haunt us. We already have given up a few good prospects but now maybe the farm. If we can't get an extension from Dickey 'cause he will be UFA next year, then that is a huge gamble for a one chance kick at the can...

There must be a few scenarios available to AA besides Dickey. Why not wait and see how the rest of the rotation will shape up before selling our best and no.1 prospect for a 38 year old that might not stay after next year.

I hope the trade for Dickey peters out...

[jschick88]

Sense got is that all parties do not sign off on this tonite, maybe not even tomorrow. My best GUESS is Monday. #Mets #Bluejays

https://twitter.com/Joelsherman1

[Jiggy_12]

The deal as reported...I'm okay either way. It's enough risk and high end prospects that if this falls through I will breathe a sigh of relief.

On the other hand, if this happens...this increases the Jays chances
Of a championship in the next 2-3 years and that is really, very exciting.

I'm 50/50...but if this brings Toronto a championship then it's obviously a 100% win.

[VERVE]

I guess this potential deal is contingent on whether Dickey will sign an extension with the Jays or not. If not, TDA stays but AA must ve confident that Dickey will...

[browna]

If this was a desperate move to add to the rotation from last year, then its a massive fail, and would've been a non starter.

However, with the Florida trade and other roster and coaching moves transforming this roster to attack the weakend AL east, this "overpayment" (on paper at least...I can admit I've never seen D'Arnaud play in the minors or Sydnegaard, so lets not crown them HOF'ers yet) makes more sense.

[Jiggy_12]

I guess the best way I can reason this out..

Every extra win we add right now is more valuable based on the timing. If we did this last year or before the Marlins trade this would look assinine, but given the timing...AA is going for the jugular. Cashing in on years of prospect development success..got to give him credit for the bold move.

[VERVE]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

I guess the best way I can reason this out..

Every extra win we add right now is more valuable based on the timing. If we did this last year or before the Marlins trade this would look assinine, but given the timing...AA is going for the jugular. Cashing in on years of prospect development success..got to give him credit for the bold move.

The Jays current rotation has improved so much that some experts say they are contenders, then do they really need Dickey at the expense of giving up the best catching prospect in all of AAA baseball. Some might say TDA is just a prospect and is a gamble, true enough but so is a 38 year old soon to be pensioner. TDA'S credentials are repeatable blue chip material.


Minor League accomplishments

• 2011 Team USA - Baseball World Cup
• 2011 Baseball America Classification All-Star
• 2011 Baseball America #2 Prospect - Eastern League
• 2011 Baseball America Best Defensive Catcher - Eastern League
• 2011 R. Howard Webster Award
• 2011 Eastern League Champion
• 2011 Eastern League MVP
• 2011 Eastern League All-Star
• 2011 Eastern League Mid-Season All-Star
• 2010 Florida State League All-Star
• 2010 Florida State League Mid-Season All-Star
• 2010 Florida State League Home Run Derby Participant
• 2010 Florida State League Player of the Week (4/19)
• 2009 South Atlantic League Champion
• 2009 South Atlantic League Mid-Season All-Star
• 2008 New York–Penn League Mid-Season All-Star

Rated Best Defensive Catcher in the Philadelphia Phillies system after the 2007 season
Rated Best Defensive Catcher in the Philadelphia Phillies system after the 2009 season
Rated Best Defensive Catcher in the Toronto Blue Jays system after the 2010 season
Rated Best Hitter for Average in the Toronto Blue Jays system after the 2011 season
Rated Best Power Hitter in the Toronto Blue Jays system after the 2011 season
Rated Best Hitter for Average in the Toronto Blue Jays system after the 2012 season
Rated Best Power Hitter in the Toronto Blue Jays system after the 2012 season


Ranked #2 Eastern League prospect 2011
Ranked #2 Pacific Coast League prospect 2012
Ranked #17 by Baseball America 2012-Top 100 prospects

[kipperfan]

As I've stated above, I really dislike the makeup of a TDA + Syndergaard + Buck + prospect for Dickey + Thole + prospect trade. With that said, I don't really see signing Dickey to an extension as being a major concern. Is Dickey really going to take the chance, at 38 going on 39 years old, that he won't regress (in the ALE of all places) and/or get a (somewhat) serious injury this season and ride this $5 million/year contract all the way to free agency in 2013 (at 39)? He would be a fairly stupid man if he did, in fact I can almost guarantee if the Jays do acquire him and offer the 25/2 he wants, he will sign within a month or two. His agent would likely be calling him daily advising of the massive, unneeded risk he would be taking by going into this season (on any team frankly) without a sealed deal and guaranteed money for the next couple years.

[Matty81]

It just keeps getting worse every time theres a new trade leaked. Hopefully sherman is full of crap. First it was d'arnaud, then d'arnaud and gose now d'arnaud and syndergaard. For a while they were supposed to be getting Ike Davis, then a prospect, now a not elite minor leaguer.

I'm afraid I'm going to wake up tomorrow and sanchez will be involved too.

[The Big Chill]

This feels a lot like when the Flames were after Brad Richards. I'm super excited about the short term gain, but worried about long-term ramifications.

[ben voyonsdonc]

I'm not entirely sure how I feel about the possible trade but Dickey is clearly a pretty brave guy. Here is a video of him opening up about being molested. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6k57yPfh1c4

[TitovFTW]

Coles Notes type reaction to today:

I'm all for listening to why the Jays shouldn't give up these quality prospects, but your argument is completley ruined when you suggest Dickey is a 1 year wonder and categorize him as just some "38 year old pitcher". People have spent the week making fun of Jays fans for how poorly they talk about Dickey compared to the rest of the baseball world. And it's insane to say he's a 3 WAR pitcher after 3 seasons fine tuning the knuckleball, that somehow he's going to just regress and now throw it as effectively this season. R.A Dickry is a really freaking good pitcher and statistics show that.

Yes, the Jays have given up a lot of prospects this summer but they've also improved their team greatly. At a time when the Yankees are doing nothing and the Red Sox look like a below average team.

I like Travis D'Arnaud but people Travis D'Arnaud is not a franchise changing prospect. And that's not even counting his knee surgery.

You give up a strong arm in the trade, but you're still full of pitching in your system and still have a high draft pick this season.

The Blue Jays are a 90 win team right now. They've got a ton of all star players in the prime of their careers. Signing Edwin Jackson or going after a big catch at the trade deadline will not change this. It takes elite level talent to make that jump, and if you've got the core and you think now is your time in the AL East, then you go for it. Don't you think your plan has to change when you're able to bring in elite level talent and you look at having the best 3-4 hitters in all of MLB?

Dickey will face tougher lineups in the AL East, but he'll also get to pitch in a dome stadium which is just as big a determining factor.

People need to realize what the asking price for quality starting pitching is. Look at last year with Latos and Gonzalez, who are both not #1 pitchers either.

The Blue Jays are doing this smart. Some people need to read those tweets again. The Jays are not going through with this trade until the extension is signed.

A lot of people against this seem to be wishing the Jays would just continue to cycle incredibly strong young talent through the system. Something hardly any MLB teams can actually do. But it shows a level of ignorance as the Jays are not a team of 20 something all stars trying to speed up the process. The Jays have 3 years left of a lot of all star players in their prime. Travis D'Arnaud is the only Jays prospect that could step in next season and make a difference. And even that's a stretch as he's coming off knee surgery.


I'm okay with people saying perhaps the Jays gave up to much. Just don't take that anger or dislike for it and put it on Dickey and sell his talent short. It's simply not fair

[TitovFTW]

Originally Posted by moon

I am pretty sure they got rid of that.

Nope. The Jays get a first round pick if they lose Dickey to free agency next season.

[Where ru Chris O'Sullivan]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

I guess the best way I can reason this out..

Every extra win we add right now is more valuable based on the timing. If we did this last year or before the Marlins trade this would look assinine, but given the timing...AA is going for the jugular. Cashing in on years of prospect development success..got to give him credit for the bold move.

I expected so much more from the Jay's 2011 Season and truly (give all credit to AA) when we really seen nothing positive come from it, the Miami move turned everything into "lets win now".

TDA is a few years away from being both a productive bat and a competent catcher in the MLB. The curve would be a lot harder on him in Toronto this year if somehow JPA disappeared and he made the team out of spring as this team is loaded with expectations and pressure.

Buerhle is a year older, Romero had a terrible year, Morrow was so good that he may not be that good again and Josh Johnson is still going to grow. Dickey is going to take a lot of pressure off this put together staff. I'd throw him out there on opening day.

With all due respect to Bal and Oak, the American League has never been weaker. It makes absolute sense with an old Yankees team and a terrible Bosox ensemble to go for it and go for it full out for the next 3-4 years.

Is it April yet?

[moon]

Originally Posted by TitovFTW

Nope. The Jays get a first round pick if they lose Dickey to free agency next season.

What did they change then?

Because I remember guys talking about not getting picks for guys going to FA and that it would affect the trade value of certain guys since you didn't get the pick anymore if they left as a FA.

[TitovFTW]

Originally Posted by moon

What did they change then?

Because I remember guys talking about not getting picks for guys going to FA and that it would affect the trade value of certain guys since you didn't get the pick anymore if they left as a FA.

The pitcher/player needs to have been on your team the entire season to get the compensation. You could not trade for someone at any part of the year or even before free agency ( I remember AA fleeced that system a few years ago)

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Buster OlneyVerified
‏@Buster_ESPN

Evaluators around MLB are beyond shocked TOR is talking about trading Travis d'Arnaud for a player with one year on his contract, Dickey.

Well, that's why the deal won't happen as reported unless Dickey signs an extension. C'mon Buster.

[GirlySports]

What are the Blue Jays plans for Gose? He doesn't really have a spot, and there were rumors he'd go to Shea with D'Arnaud for Dickey, but those seem to have gone away.