Israel declares war on Hamas

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

TIL Jews built the pyramids.

I’m convinced he’s doing a bit. Has to be.

Nobody is dumb enough to believe that.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

Are you calling my religion a joke? That's pretty disrespectful, Pickle Rick.

I agree that you don't necessarily need to follow the bible as a straight gospel, but there are important lessons in there that can be applied today (i.e. respect your mother and father, and Shabbat is a great way to disconnect from the broader world and spend time with your family undistracted by your devices).

Not to mention, you're ignoring the historical aspect of the Bible, which can be coupled with archeological findings, to prove Jewish presence in Israel for thousands of years. Who do you think built the pyramids? Prolly fricken aliens with space lasers according to whatever psycho media you consume. Couldn't have been Jews like the Bible says.

But at least we're getting down to the source of where your disdain for Israel originates from!

We'll just ignore the rest of that for now and focus on the meat. Are you suggesting that stuff isn't ridiculous? Would you stone your daughter if she had premarital sex? Do you believe gays should be killed? I guess I'm wondering if you embrace it all, or just pick and choose the stuff you agree with.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

Are you calling my religion a joke? That's pretty disrespectful, Pickle Rick.

I agree that you don't necessarily need to follow the bible as a straight gospel, but there are important lessons in there that can be applied today (i.e. respect your mother and father, and Shabbat is a great way to disconnect from the broader world and spend time with your family undistracted by your devices).

Not to mention, you're ignoring the historical aspect of the Bible, which can be coupled with archeological findings, to prove Jewish presence in Israel for thousands of years. Who do you think built the pyramids? Prolly fricken aliens with space lasers according to whatever psycho media you consume. Couldn't have been Jews like the Bible says.

But at least we're getting down to the source of where your disdain for Israel originates from!

By the Logic of your Archeological argument, should the Blackfoot be allowed to take your home and force your family onto the streets? Or to bomb the city that you live in?

[CalgaryKid12]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

We'll just ignore the rest of that for now and focus on the meat. Are you suggesting that stuff isn't ridiculous? Would you stone your daughter if she had premarital sex? Do you believe gays should be killed? I guess I'm wondering if you embrace it all, or just pick and choose the stuff you agree with.

You missed the following paragraph in my post:

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

I agree that you don't necessarily need to follow the bible as a straight gospel, but there are important lessons in there that can be applied today (i.e. respect your mother and father, and Shabbat is a great way to disconnect from the broader world and spend time with your family undistracted by your devices).

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

You missed the following paragraph in my post:

Sure, and My Little Pony and The Care Bears had some good takeaway lessons, too. But I don't use them to justify murdering children for land.

[CalgaryKid12]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

By the Logic of your Archeological argument, should the Blackfoot be allowed to take your home and force your family onto the streets? Or to bomb the city that you live in?

No not at all. What I'm saying (and have been saying from the start) is that the land belongs to both Israel and Palestine. I disagree with the far right Israeli parties who say that the entire land should be Israel equally as much as the PA/Hamas that think that Israel has no claim to the land.

I take issue with the statement that Israel colonized the land. It was disputed territory that was abandoned by the Brits. Minor skirmishes occurred, then the UN stepped in and proposed a two state solution (agreed to by Israel, declined by Palestinians), more skirmishes, Israel founded in 1948, War of Independence (started by surrounding Arab nations), Israel wins war and takes more land as a result (most of which they have given back).

[CalgaryKid12]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I’m convinced he’s doing a bit. Has to be.

Nobody is dumb enough to believe that.

I think if you were to look at a mirror you would find someone pretty dumb

[CalgaryKid12]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Sure, and My Little Pony and The Care Bears had some good takeaway lessons, too. But I don't use them to justify murdering children for land.

You might not, but Hamas does.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

No not at all. What I'm saying (and have been saying from the start) is that the land belongs to both Israel and Palestine. I disagree with the far right Israeli parties who say that the entire land should be Israel equally as much as the PA/Hamas that think that Israel has no claim to the land.

I take issue with the statement that Israel colonized the land. It was disputed territory that was abandoned by the Brits. Minor skirmishes occurred, then the UN stepped in and proposed a two state solution (agreed to by Israel, declined by Palestinians), more skirmishes, Israel founded in 1948, War of Independence (started by surrounding Arab nations), Israel wins war and takes more land as a result (most of which they have given back).

Also TIL that the Nakba was nothing more than a minor skirmish.

2/2 very educational thread!

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

You might not, but Hamas does.

Just Hamas, eh?



https://www.npr.org/2023/11/07/12111...-among-critics

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

Are you calling my religion a joke?

Nothing funny about the biggest con in human history

[TherapyforGlencross]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

You might not, but Hamas does.

Considering that there are many many children and people under the age of 18 in Palestine, coupled with the fact that the majority of Gazans hate Israel, and if we’re assuming the children learnt why they hate Israel from their parents, it seems that Hamas has done quite a good job of ‘respecting their mother and father’, no?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

I think if you were to look at a mirror you would find someone pretty dumb

Says the guy who thinks myths from the old testament are historically accurate.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Says the guy who thinks myths from the old testament are historically accurate.

Maybe Bibi thinks he's the modern day Moses and instead of visiting death and destruction on Egypt's first born children, he's doing it to Palestinian children instead.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by TherapyforGlencross

Considering that there are many many children and people under the age of 18 in Palestine, coupled with the fact that the majority of Gazans hate Israel, and if we’re assuming the children learnt why they hate Israel from their parents, it seems that Hamas has done quite a good job of ‘respecting their mother and father’, no?

Not just their parents . Hamas sets the curriculum, so you have a whole generation of kids educated by what any reasonable person would consider an Islamist terrorist organization. They literally believe it is their religious duty to kill Jews and preach Islamic supremacy over all people. And this isn't something that started in 1948. It was something that started centuries ago.

The Christian equivalent of what Hamas has done to Gaza and the people there would be like if the Ku Klux Klan was elected to lead statelet of 3 million for 20+ years and their neighbours were black.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

By the Logic of your Archeological argument, should the Blackfoot be allowed to take your home and force your family onto the streets? Or to bomb the city that you live in?

I think it is worth describing Israeli independence here:

The breakup of the Ottoman empire resulted in multiple nations created, including Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Israel (and many others - several dozen in fact). Of the Middle East, Israel got the smallest slice which was even made smaller upon Israel's independence.

Jews were always in Palestine, which was a region but not an independent country, at least since Judea. As the Jewish population increased in the 1900s, so too did Muslims, as the Jewish people were bringing industry and commerce to the area. There was certainly violence, generally from both sides, but most typically against Jews, across the middle east. Note that there are only a few million Jews on the entire planet, with just half in Israel (maybe 8 million).

Israel did not have a goal to kick out any Muslims, in fact they wanted them to be part of this new country (where none existed previously, at least since Judea). Israel brought human rights, freedoms and the ability for all world religions to practice as they saw fit. Clearly Israel was hoping that the positive treatment of Muslims would be looked positively by the neighbors. Israel didn't just unilaterally 'own' everything, they were just the government for a region that was British and before that Ottoman. It never had a president or something of that sort.

Upon independence, Israel was attacked by multiple nations, their goal was to destroy Israel - the region also ethnically cleansed basically 100% of the Jews from their countries, in numbers greater than Palestinians who fled the war of independence. The Nakba was born from those attacks, some label it as Israel 'ethnically cleansing' Muslims, Israel vehemently does not agree - there was no policy to kick anyone out. Villages got destroyed, but there was a massive war, a life or death struggle for Israel that at that time did not have the USA helping, at all. Some villages were targeted by Israel others by invading armies, who clearly laid out their goal, destroy the jews while proudly telling Muslims to leave so they can do their job. Muslims that stayed in Israel are full citizens of Israel with equal rights, those that left are not citizens of Israel.

Jews with WW2 experience repelled the attackers, a true miracle from the Israeli perspective considering how outnumbered they were. Destruction from both sides forced people deeper into Israel or outside Israel, to places like Egypt, Jordan and Lebanon, where those same people exist today (in many cases, such as Lebanon, they don't get citizenship and are deprived of human rights, including not able to own land or homes, can't have certain jobs, etc.).

Israel is a sliver of land, about the size of four PEIs, and as part of October 7th, was the target of multiple countries, including Iran, Gaza, Lebanon and Yemen. Had Israel not demonstrated overwhelming force, who knows what other nations would have joined in on the attacks.

Israel has been involved in numerous wars in the region, Israel can demonstrate in each case, they were defensive wars. For all the land Israel gained in those wars, they have returned it for peace. Without peace being accepted, Israel holds those locations. In the case of the Palestinians, they have made peace offerings which were rejected by Palestinians multiple times. Post WW2, many nations lost land in wars, and Israel giving the land back for peace demonstrates their ability to move forward.

Now we can debate what I wrote and I am sure the TikTok generation will be inflamed with what I wrote, but that generally captures the history of Israel. They get attacked, the defend themselves, they make peace, and if they don't make peace, they hold onto whatever gains they made with the offer of land for peace. Meanwhile, Israel has been used as a scapegoat for each dictator in the region, blaming Israel for the woes of their nations, indoctrinating generation after generation to hate the jews. Israel certainly is hardened from all of this, a reasonable outcome of being in the crosshairs of multiple nations and Islamic terror groups. Meanwhile, Israel respects human rights for all, treats women as equals, treats the LGBT community positively, defends the ancient history of the land and provides for peaceful coexistence between religions.

The amount of ridiculous offensive remarks in this thread are evidence of the bias against .02 percent of the planet. Many of the posters having completely gone mad, others I feel like they can learn, as I do. Much of the Middle East has already joined Israel or are in the process of doing so, they see the futility of poisoning their populations with hate, time to move on.

Until October 7, I personally did not know another Jew that did not want a two state solution, it just needed to guarantee the safety of both sides. Now I don't think I know a single person that believes Palestinians should or will ever have a state. To Israel, to family that lives there, Gaza is no different than ISIS, Al Qaeda or whatever other terror group. Twenty years of rocket attacks while the UN laughed at them, then October 7. No more, that is their bottom line.

[PepsiFree]

Just in case anyone wasn’t aware of Nage’s stance on the history of Israel, here it is for the 200th time.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Just in case anyone wasn’t aware of Nage’s stance on the history of Israel, here it is for the 200th time.

Another post from one of the more vile users here, adding nothing positive or useful as usual.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Nage Waza

Another post from one of the more vile users here, adding nothing positive or useful as usual.

Sorry, please explain how your post was positive and useful so I know what the bar is.

[chubeyr1]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Sorry, please explain how your post was positive and useful so I know what the bar is.

More useful than your post. Attack the poster not the post per usual!