Incident at Vancouver festival

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by trackercowe

So he'll be back on the streets in a few years. Lovely.

Not sure why people feel the need to post garbage like this before we know the full story. It's not helpful for the families, and it makes you look like an ####### who is jumping on a tragedy to bolster your own political grievances.

Anyways, really hoping the victims and their families are able to get the help they need.

EDIT: #### like this also isn't helpful...

Originally Posted by blankall

My guess is this is a spousal dispute turned extremely ugly.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

Lets say trump really does annex canada, should his government have the ability to throttle your car at will?

My friend, if things get to that you have much, much bigger problems than the government throttling your car.

Originally Posted by rubecube

Not sure why people feel the need to post garbage like this before we know the full story. It's not helpful for the families, and it makes you look like an ####### who is jumping on a tragedy to bolster your own political grievances.

Anyways, really hoping the victims and their families are able to get the help they need.

EDIT: #### like this also isn't helpful...

Didn’t like people posting unverified crap from twitter either, and it was made even worse when you realized the narrative being woven by those accounts, which is like the above you’ve mentioned but to the extreme.

People have no shame.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Didn’t like people posting unverified crap from twitter either, and it was made even worse when you realized the narrative being woven by those accounts, which is like the above you’ve mentioned but to the extreme.

People have no shame.

Yep. The usual suspects were out there blaming immigrants, Trudeau, etc., before the bodies had even been removed from the scene.

This isn't the trade deadline. You don't get points and clout from your predictions and your "bold" takes.

[FlamesAddiction]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1916528434291114342

[chemgear]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...pino-1.7520496

Richard Le, 47, his wife Linh Hoang, 30, and their daughter Katie Le, 5, were among those who died at the Lapu-Lapu Day festival, according to Richard's brother Toan Le.

Katie, the youngest of those who died in this attack, had just finished pre-school, according to Toan.

Toan said Richard had a 16-year-old son, Andy, who had stayed at home that day. Hoang was Andy's stepmom, Toan said, and had raised him like he was her own.



A Monday statement from the New Westminster School Board said Kira Salim was killed at the street party.

It said Salim was a counsellor at both Fraser River Middle School and New Westminster Secondary.

[Lewis_D]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Not sure what you mean by lack of emphasis on them in the media. Whenever one of these vehicle attacks happens it’s global news.

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Yeah not sure where the perception comes from that this and events like it aren’t covered by “mainstream media,” it’s literally everywhere.

Sorry, I didn't word that very well and conveyed the wrong message there. By lack of discussion & emphasis I didn't mean to say coverage, but more a broader discussion around how scary and complex this issue is and the many factors contributing, and how we can possibly prevent them (mental health, radicalization of individuals in online circles, preventive measures involving security & infrastructure etc.)

I could be wrong there too. Maybe this has been discussed in a broader picture on major networks at great length and I just missed it or ignored it. We all perceive info differently and my perception of MSM around this issue is rather negative, I find when it comes to terror attacks, mass shootings and stuff like this they're all very reactive and are quick to jump on the typical narrative they follow based on what side of the political spectrum they adhere to, then they forget about it and repeat the next time it happens.

Anyways, with that being said I picked the wrong thread to share that view and should've just expressed my condolences and left it at that. Wasn't trying to make a political point or anything, more just showing frustration at the state of things.

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The reason authorities address the terrorism angle is because it will 100 per cent be the first question raised by the media. And the reason it will be raised by the media is the public wants to know if there’s a political agenda or wider movement behind an attack. Which is perfectly understandable. Several high-profile mass-murder-by-vehicle attacks have been carried out by political extremists and terrorists (ie ISIS claimed responsibility for the 2016 attack in Nice that left 84 dead).

Yeah and that's totally fair, but based on more recent tragedy's though I'd still think most of the general public is currently more concerned about car ramming incidents involving mentally-ill individuals as mental health issues and cars exist in every community around the world, and given the upward trend.

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

As for safety measures, in Germany and France, that have suffered a half-dozen attacks on Christmas markets and other public spaces, they’ve erected bollards to prevent vehicles from having access to pedestrian areas, and police vans and concrete barriers are set up around all road access to street festivals. I expect those measures will now be adopted in Canadian cities, where they haven’t been already.

Yes, I agree these safety measures are effective, but what's scary to me is that we're talking about a world where all the urban infrastructure is based around the car, to me that's a pretty daunting challenge. Even if they had bollards or security barriers at this event for example, I imagine there'd still be many areas around the perimeter where you have hundreds of people flowing through at any given time in an area where traffic is still open.

[Winsor_Pilates]

I just went by the site to pay my respects.
Very emotional being there; a mix of sadness, anger, disbelief.
I imagine many of you experienced the mix of feelings when visiting the Gaudreau memorials.
Left me feeling a little numb, even after getting home.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Vancouver desperately needs a large (500 to 1000 beds) Mental Health facility up in the Valley, essentially a modern large replacement for Riverview for both long term and short term residents

The issue is when do you forcefully confine people who don't want to be confined? How do you predict who's going to be dangerous before they actually are dangerous?

It's always a balancing of civil liberties vs. public safety. I think we are likely to see a push towards the public safety side of things soon. This wasn't the only recent high profile incident in Vancouver either, although the one with the most horrendous outcome.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

I feel awful for those who were struck unsuspectingly by this tragedy. RIP.

Although it's about the individuals, having filipino friends and knowing they're generally great people saddens me.

They love their street festivals and food, and they're so peaceful and kind.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by blankall

The issue is when do you forcefully confine people who don't want to be confined? How do you predict who's going to be dangerous before they actually are dangerous?

It's always a balancing of civil liberties vs. public safety. I think we are likely to see a push towards the public safety side of things soon. This wasn't the only recent high profile incident in Vancouver either, although the one with the most horrendous outcome.

Personally I would like to see a situation where we are able to confine people often for short periods of time, a very low bar to place someone in care for a couple of weeks, a large facility where they could easily self admit after their few weeks are up for further care or go back into the community and get picked up again a few weeks later

Mental health, like foster care, is bed dependent, if you dont have enough beds then the kind of behavior that gets ignored, the risk you present gets higher and higher, we need enough beds that anyone acting a bit weird and erratic gets taken in and assessed not just the ones that are waving a carving knife about in the nude wearing a tinfoil hat

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

I just went by the site to pay my respects.
Very emotional being there; a mix of sadness, anger, disbelief.
I imagine many of you experienced the mix of feelings when visiting the Gaudreau memorials.
Left me feeling a little numb, even after getting home.

I haven't had the strength to yet

[chemgear]

[DownInFlames]

You just ruined my night, chemgear.

[FlamesAddiction]

It rips your heart out.

I hope the son that was left behind gets the help and support he is going to need.

[Acey]

I don't see how any GPS system could be accurate enough to precisely stop a vehicle from driving onto a sidewalk without creating a massive amount of false positives that will have vehicles randomly braking to a halt and creating chaos while they legally remain within the confines of a road.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Acey

I don't see how any GPS system could be accurate enough to precisely stop a vehicle from driving onto a sidewalk without creating a massive amount of false positives that will have vehicles randomly braking to a halt and creating chaos while they legally remain within the confines of a road.

Ones self driving tech is mature enough it's easily possible. Waymo could do it now.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

This is exactly it when contemplating surrendering control of things to the government. Don't picture the current government, think of a future where the party or person who is the polar opposite of your beliefs takes power, would you want a government under their control having this ability?

When the government has the polar opposite of my beliefs I'll want access to tanks, rocket launchers, etc. Doesn't mean I should have access to them now.


With reasonable people electing reasonable governments, it's better to restrict thing that can kill a large number of people in a short amount of time.


There will come a point when self-driving cars are safe enough that the manual overrides present more risk than they mitigate, society will move to make them mandatory, and the same people who resist gun control and vaccinations, the same type of people who opposed seat belts will have to be dragged forward kicking and screaming like they always do.

[pseudoreality]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

I don't believe the government should have that kind of power over free movement. I'm not for having the government having the ability to throttle where you can drive, when you can drive, how far you can drive etc. which is the natural extension of applying this kind of technology broadly to private vehicle use.

Really, you don't believe there should be any speed limits or restrictions on where cars/trucks can drive? I'm sorry, but that is a horrible take. You don't have a god-given right to rip your giant pick up truck at 140 km/hr through a crowed park. Laws are not to restrict your motion, they are to restrict the giant metal machines that kill 1000s a year in Canada.

I'm definitely on team f-cars on this one. These giant metal death traps are getting bigger, taking up more space, and are more hazardous to pedestrians every year. It is crazy that we have willingly surrendered so much of our cities to these machines. It has a negative effect on mental health and puts people on edge all the time that they are going to get run over.

I was at the Christmas Markets in Strasbourg, France a year and half ago, and they had the entire downtown blocked off to vehicle traffic. It was awesome. You were just so much more relaxed away from the noise of vehicle traffic and fear of getting run over.

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by pseudoreality

Really, you don't believe there should be any speed limits or restrictions on where cars/trucks can drive? I'm sorry, but that is a horrible take. You don't have a god-given right to rip your giant pick up truck at 140 km/hr through a crowed park. Laws are not to restrict your motion, they are to restrict the giant metal machines that kill 1000s a year in Canada.

I'm definitely on team f-cars on this one. These giant metal death traps are getting bigger, taking up more space, and are more hazardous to pedestrians every year. It is crazy that we have willingly surrendered so much of our cities to these machines. It has a negative effect on mental health and puts people on edge all the time that they are going to get run over.

I was at the Christmas Markets in Strasbourg, France a year and half ago, and they had the entire downtown blocked off to vehicle traffic. It was awesome. You were just so much more relaxed away from the noise of vehicle traffic and fear of getting run over.

I can't believe Cowboy is 100% advocating to have the right to mow people down in his vehicle. Why do you want to mow people down Cowboy. Mower.

[blankall]

Sounds like the driver wasn't dealing with long-term mental health or addiction issues. Instead, it was someone who had suffered a recent tragedy themselves and went off the deep end. His brother had been murdered the year before.

https://www.cbc.ca/lite/story/1.7520703

Edit: Just want to clarify this comment. The conversation seemed to be heading towards how to deal with the many people suffering from life-long mental health issues and living on the streets. The perpetrator in this incident began to suffer from his issues just over a year ago, following a personal tragedy.

An institution like Riverview likely wouldn't have been appropriate. However, there definitely needs to be investigation into the actions of the police and health care providers that observed him within the days and weeks prior to his attack.