2025 Toronto Blue Jays Season Thread

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by JTech780

Aaron Judge wsn't Aaron Judge till he was 25, the same age as Vladdy now, then he had 3 seasons of struggling to stay on the field, then had a massive season in '22 at age 30 and then got paid.

Would you rather pay a guy who is just about to enter his prime, and get all of his prime years, who has shown that he can be a great offensive player, or pay a guy who is in the 2nd half of his prime, and will still be paid like a star into his late 30's. I would rather pay the guy just heading into his prime.

I get there is risk, just like any other signing, but I will take the risk on a player just entering his prime. As far as I know he isn't asking for $760m, in fact it sounds like he is asking for $260-300m less than that. That's a whole Trea Turner contract of difference.

I think if the contract was $40M x 12 it would be done TBH, I have no issue paying Guerrero like Judge.

I think the problem is he wants $5-$10M more per season than that. And even then IMO the Jays should probably be willing to do $45 x 12 with opt outs for $540 total.

It's always tough to gauge in these things who is to blame, because if Vlad wants the $700M x 15 like Soto or even $600M x 12 then I wouldn't blame the Blue Jays for not wanting to do that.

[JTech780]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Ah, so we'll discount things like fWAR but if MLB arbitrarily ranks him that high then I guess we'll just chug that kool-aid?

If I have an overly negative bias, you certainly have an overly positive bias at the same time. Truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

Ok, since 2021 he is 25th in fWAR. The only player younger than him ahead of him is Bobby Witt Jr. We are talking about a player who is just entering his prime, and we are comparing him to players who are in their primes or on the back end of their primes.

Yeah, I wouldn't give him Soto money, but that's not what he is asking for.

[JTech780]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

What's the max you would pay him on term and $$?

The max I would go is 13 years, and I would go to $600m. That's the new norm, you can thank the Mets and Dodgers for that.

[Jason14h]

Going to be funny seeing Rogers try to sell TV packages and Seats on marketing campaigns built around Santandar and Giminez next year

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Going to be funny seeing Rogers try to sell TV packages and Seats on marketing campaigns built around Santandar and Giminez next year

Scherzer! Come see a hall of fame pitcher while he is still active!

[Andrew]

Originally Posted by calculoso

Scherzer! Come see a hall of fame pitcher while he is still active!

Bring back Bautista from retirement nad scherzer in a wheelchair.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by calculoso

Scherzer! Come see a hall of fame pitcher while he is still active!

Max wont be here next yeah either haha

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by JTech780

The max I would go is 13 years, and I would go to $600m. That's the new norm, you can thank the Mets and Dodgers for that.

As a franchise, if you're not going to pay Vladdy, then who are you going to pay big money and when? None of the external big fish want to play here, so where does it go from here exactly? Compensatory picks and a pretty blah pipeline that is nowhere near the high end of the league.

The Jays have turned into a farce over the last 3-4 seasons, and that is saying something. I have always backed them and tuned in, but last season I hardly mustered the interest to watch half a game last year let a lone a full one, and I am finding interest waning even more now given the offseason they've had yet again.

[Skaloper]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

As a franchise, if you're not going to pay Vladdy, then who are you going to pay big money and when? None of the external big fish want to play here, so where does it go from here exactly? Compensatory picks and a pretty blah pipeline that is nowhere near the high end of the league.

The Jays have turned into a farce over the last 3-4 seasons, and that is saying something. I have always backed them and tuned in, but last season I hardly mustered the interest to watch half a game last year let a lone a full one, and I am finding interest waning even more now given the offseason they've had yet again.

The Jays aren't alone in this insanity for what top players are getting on the open market in deferred salaries. We can all agree that they should have done anything possible to sign Vlad but seeing whats happening there is a point that Atkins was told it's too much. I do blame Atkins for waiting until the final hour as his value on the trade market has diminished and for that reason he needs to go. Rough time to be a Jays fan and many dark days ahead

[Finger Cookin]

I would go 10 years $550M. What do I care, it's not my money.

To clarify the tone of my earlier comments, I'm not panicked so much as disappointed. I don't care enough about the Jays to be panicked about player moves or the lack thereof.

[Jason14h]

The Jays also seem to be unwilling to pay their own players but are also big game hunting and (over)paying UFAs

They didn’t want to pay Teo or Romano or Guirrel . They now won’t or unable to pay Bo and Vlad

It’s got to leave some bitter feelings for players as well constantly seeing management try to bring in UFAs but not taking care of their own .

[Caged Great]

Frankly the team should just sell off everyone, fold and move to vegas or something similar.

Who cares. Not going to pay your own guys when it matters, not going to go all out to get the better free agents. Not going to draft anyone worth a damn.

It's irrelevant ball.

[bluejays]

This team should be selling off a lot. But you don't sign Scherzer and others and not go for it to some degree. So the likelihood is where we are at the deadline will determine what happens with them. As fans, I certainly hope they don't do well so that it becomes definitive we need to deal them and they get a good return for a retool. There are a lot of pieces they can deal to get back good value. That's the positive here.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by bluejays

This team should be selling off a lot. But you don't sign Scherzer and others and not go for it to some degree. So the likelihood is where we are at the deadline will determine what happens with them. As fans, I certainly hope they don't do well so that it becomes definitive we need to deal them and they get a good return for a retool. There are a lot of pieces they can deal to get back good value. That's the positive here.

I mean, my first choice is they win the WS. Maybe the NL folds part way through the year or something...it could happen.

But I agree if they arent a competitive playoff team (say 1st wild card in AL or better) I'd rather they be out of it enough to sell.

Vlad/Bo/Bassitt/Scherzer/Green/Swanson are all UFA after this year - if you traded them all at the deadline you'd get a huge haul of prospects.

[Jason14h]

The issue is if we aren’t competitive it’s because the UFAs are playing poorly and have less value . If they are playing well we don’t trade them cause we’re in the hunt

Go team go

[browna]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

As a franchise, if you're not going to pay Vladdy, then who are you going to pay big money and when? None of the external big fish want to play here, so where does it go from here exactly? Compensatory picks and a pretty blah pipeline that is nowhere near the high end of the league.

This is the problem. They (Atkins and Shapiro particularly, the Jays in general) aren't going to convince too players to come.here even with an overpay. Especially now since all MLB players see how they are dealing with Vlad.

The Jays missed the window to sign him for cheaper, hell even Judge probably has a tinge of regret because he would get more than Soto if timing was a year later.

I've said it twice but I don't think Atkins and Shapiro are enamoured or ever have been enamoured with Vlad, really ever. Feeling is probably mutual. Rogers as an owner has given complete autonomy to Shapiro and Atkins and that's biting then in this case.

Vlad isn't the answer, but he's a big part of the solution, and the Jays can't be picky with top/impact players who wish to be a Blue Jay. But here we are.

That all said, I can see this salvageable. Atkins and Shapiro or at least Atkins, has to be gone this season. If that happens my guess is Vladdy signs. I think Vlad was thinking that these guys would be gone and he could deal with someone he trusts, which isnt this regime.

Only way that happens fairly quick is if the pressure from fans and media around this and the team, and maybe some crappy early season results. Even if it's a mid season punting I can see Vlad coming around if the front office (and Schneider) are overhauled.

Question is, that move and change of course has to come from higher that Shapiro. These guys, certainly Atkins, has lasted probably a full calender longer than expected, so they seem to have the trust of Rogers as owners. Is that eroded with this past offseason? And is there anyone above Shapiro that can properly figure a way to transition to a new routine without being overruled by Shapiro?

[Andrew]

If your vlad. They are willing to pay soto and shohei.

Why would you take less? It's insulting.
If you were vlad do you feel like they were trying to add to you displace you?

[SuperMatt18]

Well he's not worth as much as Soto or Ohtani because he's not as good as them and playing a less valuable position.

In the end we really don't know what the actual issue is without knowing what the offers were.

If the Jays were offering like $375M x 10 or something then clearly they are out to lunch.

But if they offered around $500M for 10-12 years and Vladdy is asking for like $600M+ or something then clearly he's the one that's out to lunch.

In the end without knowing what the offers are it's tough to place blame here. The real blame comes from the Jays not getting this done earlier in the past two years...look at the Witt and Acuna Jr contracts and that's what the real issue is - he could have been locked up earlier for much cheaper on a deal that would be great value now.

[Jason14h]

He’s not out to lunch when the Red Sox , Yankees or Mets will pay that this offseason

This is the new reality for salaries

And yes - the Jays are moronic for not locking up their young stars like every other team in MLB

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

He’s not out to lunch when the Red Sox , Yankees or Mets will pay that this offseason

This is the new reality for salaries

And yes - the Jays are moronic for not locking up their young stars like every other team in MLB

don't know about that