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Old 06-26-2018, 09:39 AM   #81
Jason14h
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I find it funny we had a 4th line that scored 5? goals when they were together, and the minute we had injuries towards the end of the season we had no one who could step in/step up and lost almost every game.

But people are opposed to bringing in a player who can win faceoffs, pot the odd goal, etc.

I get saving spots for 'young guys', but we have an entire 4th line that is prime for young guys, plus injuries, etc.

We don't need to save spots, we need NHL capable players. We had what may have been the least productive 4th line in NHL history last season
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:41 AM   #82
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I just really hope that Mangiapane, Klimchuk, and Foo are given a chance to make the NHL roster.
me too and I'm sure they will. The thing with Mangiapane is that I'd rather see him play top line minutes in the AHL and be the first callup instead of playing 8 minutes a night on the fourth line.

Personally I think Foo makes the team. He looks quite ready and can physically handle bottom six minutes.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:41 AM   #83
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Flames had a serious issue scoring outside of the 1st line last year. Derek Ryan thrived under Peters and fills a couple needs for us (RH center, PKer). I'm all for it.

We also need another legit scoring F.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:42 AM   #84
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It boggles the mind how much people care about what other fans think.

You should all know by now that most people are idiots and not to expect fanboys to give a fair assessment of players that didn't want to sign with their team/were traded ect. It like asking a guy about the girl that just dumped him. "She was okay, nothing special...was gonna break up with her soon" yeah okay
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:42 AM   #85
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I would rather just sign Shore for 1 year 1 million TBH. He has more to give
More to give? Is this from the extensive time you spent watching Ryan.

I have never seen Ryan play, but Shore is a dime a dozen player in this league. I will trust the coach who played with Ryan that he does things to help the team win. Which is exactly what we have been missing out of the 4th line.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:44 AM   #86
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If all Treliving does is sign Hurricane players and go after middling players, then I may just join the fire Treliving talk because all we're going to get is middling results. The Hurricanes were a mediocre team last year and adding mediocre players from mediocre teams doesn't seem like a recipe for a team that wants to move from bubble team status to elite status.

Treliving better get it right this summer because this will be his last chance.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:45 AM   #87
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Can the Flames still buyout Brouwer?
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:46 AM   #88
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Can the Flames still buyout Brouwer?
yes. Deadline is June 30.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:47 AM   #89
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Gaudreau - Monahan - Shore
Tkachuk - Ryan - Lindholm
Frolik - Backlund - Brouwer
Bennett - Jankowski - Lazar
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:48 AM   #90
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I look at it a little differently.

If I was Carolina, I'd be extremely concerned that my former coach was plucking players from my roster to bring with him to his new team. He's not plucking the under performers. He's plucking the one's with untapped potential. I'm not saying Lindholm is this year's Karlsson, but remember that was something that Treliving was focused on at the end of the year. Finding those players that just haven't had quite the right opportunity yet.

What are the consistent themes of the one (two) forwards brought in?

1. Good on face offs
2. Responsible defensively
3. Reasonable offensive output given role
4. Right hand shot (a massive need for the flames)

And as far as Hanifin goes, we have a 5th overall defense draft pick that skates exceptionally well, leads rushes, is responsible defensively, and has more to give on the offensive side. And he's only 21.

The more I've looked at this trade the more and more I come around to it being a really shrewd move by Treliving.

We move out a player that didn't fit into the locker room. We move out a player in Ferland who is due a big raise, but is plagued by inconsistency. Treliving got burnt by the Bouma deal once. He then avoided the same mistake with Colborne, and I think he's making a similar decision here. We also move out a player who wasn't going to sign here instead of losing him for nothing; John Gilmour was given the same treatment. Treliving is acting consistently across the board here.

We get two young, high upside players with pedigree and NHL experience who are already familiar with the system our new coach is going to run. We get cost and contract control on Hanifin and Lindholm as well.

As far as Ryan goes, I'm not concerned with him being utilized too much. Look at our center depth. Monahan is going to get 18-20 mins a night. Backlund will get 15-20 as well. That leaves 20-25 minutes a night to be split between the third and fourth line centers.

And between those two centers (Jankowski and Ryan), we have guys who scored ~35 goals last year. Ryan is a big upgrade on Stajan, Hathaway, and Lazar.

Lots to like about the moves so far. If Treliving can land a legit top line winger via free agency, we are going to have an enjoyable season as fans next year.

We legitimately have one of those guys who was on the third line and got little to no opportunity to grow and thrive over extended periods of time under the previous coach. Sam Bennett...

Maybe we don't actually need to overspend on a top forward to actually do alright offensively.

I wouldn't be opposed to bringing in another top forward but not at the expense of seeing our young players grow. Remember how excited we were for brouwer to come in and become our top line RW? I would hate to watch that happen with a Neal or Perron.

Trading stone and a pick for grabner would be my ideal situation but I doubt that is even slightly possible
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:48 AM   #91
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^ Grabner is UFA.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:50 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by Jason14h View Post
I find it funny we had a 4th line that scored 5? goals when they were together, and the minute we had injuries towards the end of the season we had no one who could step in/step up and lost almost every game.

But people are opposed to bringing in a player who can win faceoffs, pot the odd goal, etc.

I get saving spots for 'young guys', but we have an entire 4th line that is prime for young guys, plus injuries, etc.

We don't need to save spots, we need NHL capable players. We had what may have been the least productive 4th line in NHL history last season
I think the idea is that you expect Bennett and Jankowski to be better and Frolik gets dropped to the bottom 6 which instantly improves things. If they want to spend the money they save on Stajan for Ryan I'm fine with that as long as they aren't overly committing on term. From some accounts it sounds like Ryan is kind of a pet player for Peters so I expect he's probably going to spend most of his time on the 3rd line and maybe 2nd line at times so I hope he's legit and not taking ice time away from guys like Jankowski.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:51 AM   #93
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We legitimately have one of those guys who was on the third line and got little to no opportunity to grow and thrive over extended periods of time under the previous coach. Sam Bennett...

Maybe we don't actually need to overspend on a top forward to actually do alright offensively.

I wouldn't be opposed to bringing in another top forward but not at the expense of seeing our young players grow. Remember how excited we were for brouwer to come in and become our top line RW? I would hate to watch that happen with a Neal or Perron.

Trading stone and a pick for grabner would be my ideal situation but I doubt that is even slightly possible
See, the difference is that if Brouwer was a complete prick on the ice (like Perron), at least he would be offering something. Instead, Brouwer just floats around on the ice and doesn't do anything. If he picked up the agitating game, I would have less of a problem with him playing on the bottom six. We need more ahole players.

Last edited by keenan87; 06-26-2018 at 09:53 AM.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:52 AM   #94
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I looked at some highlights of Ryan on youtube and I was surprised how often he would go to in front of the net to score goals. I'm not saying we should sign him, but what he brings (good at faceoffs, drives the net, good on the pk) is exactly what we need.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:53 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by Jason14h View Post
I find it funny we had a 4th line that scored 5? goals when they were together, and the minute we had injuries towards the end of the season we had no one who could step in/step up and lost almost every game.

But people are opposed to bringing in a player who can win faceoffs, pot the odd goal, etc.

I get saving spots for 'young guys', but we have an entire 4th line that is prime for young guys, plus injuries, etc.

We don't need to save spots, we need NHL capable players. We had what may have been the least productive 4th line in NHL history last season
The Flames have Mark Jankowski, former first round draft pick and 17G scorer to fill the third line center role this season. It makes no sense at all to pay this guy big FA money and term to come in and end up being a marginally better Matt Stajan for 1-2 years of what will likely be a 3-4 year deal....the Flames just got out from under that brutal deal.

If you want a faceoff guy it makes much more sense to look at someone like Jay Beagle in a faceoff/get-off role the capitals used him in. The Calgary kid is absolutely elite in the faceoff dot and makes next to nothing. At least this route you'd likely not need to pony up more than $1M on a 1-2 year deal and can spend the money saved on addressing the top six wing.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:57 AM   #96
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The Flames have Mark Jankowski, former first round draft pick and 17G scorer to fill the third line center role this season. It makes no sense at all to pay this guy big FA money and term to come in and end up being a marginally better Matt Stajan for 1-2 years of what will likely be a 3-4 year deal....the Flames just got out from under that brutal deal.

If you want a faceoff guy it makes much more sense to look at someone like Jay Beagle in a faceoff/get-off role the capitals used him in. The Calgary kid is absolutely elite in the faceoff dot and makes next to nothing. At least this route you'd likely not need to pony up more than $1M on a 1-2 year deal and can spend the money saved on addressing the top six wing.
Watch Beagle sign for the same money as Ryan.

His underlying numbers are also considerably worse.
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Old 06-26-2018, 10:03 AM   #97
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More to give? Is this from the extensive time you spent watching Ryan.

I have never seen Ryan play, but Shore is a dime a dozen player in this league. I will trust the coach who played with Ryan that he does things to help the team win. Which is exactly what we have been missing out of the 4th line.
I do not have a problem with Ryan as an upgrade on the 4th line. I do not think he should be anywhere near a powerplay, but he would be a good addition to the 4th line.

I think Peters will have a better grasp on what helps his team win when he finally has a winning team, which will hopefully be this year after having losing teams in Carolina for his first 4 years. Taking the 2017/2018 Flames and adding 3 Hurricanes is what BT sees as the solution to change Peters losing ways.

Last edited by Aarongavey; 06-26-2018 at 10:06 AM.
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Old 06-26-2018, 10:04 AM   #98
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It boggles the mind how much people care about what other fans think.

You should all know by now that most people are idiots and not to expect fanboys to give a fair assessment of players that didn't want to sign with their team/were traded ect. It like asking a guy about the girl that just dumped him. "She was okay, nothing special...was gonna break up with her soon" yeah okay
Totally. Most of the people that post things online have an axe to grind as well. Not alot of people going to fan boards and Twitter after your cap floor, losing team loses to pat backs.
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Old 06-26-2018, 10:07 AM   #99
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Would be nice to get players/staff from teams that were actually good at one point.
Bollig, Brouwer, Frolik, and Versteeg all have Stanley Cup rings. Raymond played in the Stanley Cup Final. Hamilton and Bartkowski both played 60+ games with a team that won the President's Trophy.
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Old 06-26-2018, 10:08 AM   #100
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Isn't this considered tampering?
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