The Future Outlook of our Forward Group?

[Classic_Sniper]

Bottom 6 needs a vast overhaul. Needs to be quicker and more skilled. Sadly, the UFA market doesn't look great in regards to forwards and we don't have a whole lot of future draft picks to trade.

So it's looking more likely that we'll have to trade one of our defensive prospects to get a deal done. I wonder if St Louis would be interested in trading Jordan Kyrou. I've heard his name on the block and I believe he's the pick we sent to St Louis for Brian Elliott. Kyrou or someone else in his age bracket is the type of young potential star C/RW we could use to rejuvenate that 3rd or 2nd line.

[TheIronMaiden]

LW
Gaudreau
Tkachuk
Bennett
Lazar

C
Monahan
Jankowski
Backlund
Shore

RW
Frolik
Ferland
Brouwer

I don't expect that we will see Hathaway or Versteeg back. My guess is that Brouwer will watch more games than he plays.

So the Flames need two players to come in, and IMO they will have to be top six players if this team wants to elevate from mediocrity. This is almost guaranteed not to come from within. The bottom line is that the Flames will have to make some moves to trade for more scoring otherwise we will be watching virtually the same team again.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Bottom 6 needs a vast overhaul. Needs to be quicker and more skilled. Sadly, the UFA market doesn't look great in regards to forwards and we don't have a whole lot of future draft picks to trade.

So it's looking more likely that we'll have to trade one of our defensive prospects to get a deal done. I wonder if St Louis would be interested in trading Jordan Kyrou. I've heard his name on the block and I believe he's the pick we sent to St Louis for Brian Elliott. Kyrou or someone else in his age bracket is the type of young potential star C/RW we could use to rejuvenate that 3rd or 2nd line.

I didn't realize this until now, but I looked it up and you are correct. That one really stings- 2nds don't often turn out looking like Kyrou so it was hard to say at the time but Brian Elliott was a huge dud here. It looks extremely lopsided in retrospect.

Man oh man, thanks elliott. The gift that keeps on giving!

No way the blues are trading Kyrou.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I didn't realize this until now, but I looked it up and you are correct. That one really stings- 2nds don't often turn out looking like Kyrou so it was hard to say at the time but Brian Elliott was a huge dud here. It looks extremely lopsided in retrospect.

Man oh man, thanks elliott. The gift that keeps on giving!

No way the blues are trading Kyrou.

When you consistently trade picks, this is the risk. It's not fair to assume that's the player Flames would have drafted, but you lose out on the opportunity to hit a homerun. Or even a solid double.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

When you consistently tarde picks, this is the risk. It's not fair to assume that's the player Flames would have drafted, but you lose out on the opportunity to hit a homerun. Or even a solid double.

Maybe they wouldn't have picked Kyrou, but that 2016 draft was real deep. We could've had a shot at 20 goal rookie Alex Debrincat, Boris Katchouk who I think was in the WJHC, Chad Krys, Clague, Hronek, Dahlen. Some really good prospects in that mid 2nd round.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Or Brodie and Sam?
Edit what I really want is for them to be able to get two forwards in.
So Brodie+Sam for 2 of Patches/Gallagher/Galch

Or Brodie+Ferland for Dylan Strome and Max Domi

Stuff like that.

Brodie has a 10 team no trade clause.

[Strange Brew]

Who knows what deals are out there, but if we are going to trade a D and a forward my preference would be to get the single best forward in return possible vs. two lesser, but still impactful players.

I get the logic of adding two good forwards but may have to wait another year for that.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Nope. A team that has a star forward isn't trading him. Unless he's a pending UFA and they either can't re-sign him or are starting a rebuild. In the former case, if they can't afford the one player, two whose salaries approach his are not attractive. In the latter case, they want picks/prospects.

How many elite players have been traded (when they were elite)?

Saad (twice), Johanssen, Turris, Carter (twice) Spezza, Seguin, Panarin, Kessel, Hall, Eberle, Henrique, Duchene just off the top of my head.

These were all pretty much hockey trades for expected equivalent players a lot for defensemen,

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Saad (twice), Johanssen, Turris, Carter (twice) Spezza, Seguin, Panarin, Kessel, Hall, Eberle, Henrique, Duchene just off the top of my head.

These were all pretty much hockey trades for expected equivalent players a lot for defensemen,

Your definition of elite is different than mine, to say the least - Saad, Henrique, Turris - all decent but hardly elite. And I don't count the Hall, Kessel or Seguin trades because we can't count on anyone being as dumb as Chia.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Your definition of elite is different than mine, to say the least - Saad, Henrique, Turris - all decent but hardly elite. And I don't count the Hall, Kessel or Seguin trades because we can't count on anyone being as dumb as Chia.

Well then that's probably my fault (as it's my post you were original responded to), perhaps I overstated how big of a star I was hoping for. Spezza, Carter, Turris, those are all guys (when they were traded for) I'd be really happy getting.

[Classic_Sniper]

Team will have approximately $10M in cap space next season and not a lot of roster spaces to fill. For 1 year, we can sign any player(s) willing to take on a 1 year deal to big $$$.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Well then that's probably my fault (as it's my post you were original responded to), perhaps I overstated how big of a star I was hoping for. Spezza, Carter, Turris, those are all guys (when they were traded for) I'd be really happy getting.

Star is a step below elite and those guys qualify. The second part of my answer was that the stars have to really align to make one of those trades. The selling team is usually out of contention, trying to rebuild and dump medium-high salary. Taking on Ferland and Brodie doesn't really fit with what such teams are trying to do. Teams that have a need for Brodie and Ferland because they are on the cusp of a deep run and need a #3-4 defenceman with offence and depth grit/scoring probably are not wanting to part with their stars.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Star is a step below elite

Sure, but I didn't say elite. I guess by saying "true" star I maybe implied more than I meant, I just meant a star forward.

Originally Posted by jayswin

I wonder if we could get a true star forward fro Ferland and Brodie together?

[FanIn80]

I don’t know how the rest of the team will shake out, but I want to see Johnny moved to the right side and Tkachuk moved up.

Tkachuk Monahan Gaudreau

...and then whatever else in the rest of the spots.

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by redforever

I love Gio, but as you said, he isn't getting any younger. What would Gio bring?

He is not gettimg younger but his play has definitely not dropped one bit. Gio covers up alot of Hamilton's defensive mistakes.

He is most likely going to be one of those defenseman who can still play at near elite levels as he ages.

I don't think we ever see Gio traded. I'm pretty confident he'll retire as a Flame.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Sure, but I didn't say elite. I guess by saying "true" star I maybe implied more than I meant, I just meant a star forward.

Ricardo said elite and listed those guys. I agree those guys are stars or at least really useful.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Ricardo said elite and listed those guys. I agree those guys are stars or at least really useful.

There would be a might short list of elite forwards on the Flames .using your standards.... maybe only one and at absolute most 2. All the guys listed have had a couple of seasons as good or better than Tkachuk

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

There would be a might short list of elite forwards on the Flames .using your standards.... maybe only one and at absolute most 2. All the guys listed have had a couple of seasons as good or better than Tkachuk

Unless Tkachuk goes totally cold, he will have more points than Saad or Henrique have ever posted.

[Classic_Sniper]

I wonder if Dillon Dube makes the team next season. He's bound to play some games with injuries, but I could see him developing chemistry on a scoring line. He's got deceptive speed, vision, hockey sense, one shot scoring ability and a heavy one timer. I could see him finishing next season with the big club if he puts in some solid work in the off-season.

[colbym72]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

I wonder if Dillon Dube makes the team next season. He's bound to play some games with injuries, but I could see him developing chemistry on a scoring line. He's got deceptive speed, vision, hockey sense, one shot scoring ability and a heavy one timer. I could see him finishing next season with the big club if he puts in some solid work in the off-season.

I think Dube could be a potential replacement for Frolik or even Tkachuk on 3M so Tkachuk could have a higher scoring role