Johnny and the 2011 NHL Draft revisited

[bubbsy]

what makes it awesome is Chiarelli now being an oiler guy is even closer to that monumental mistake.

[CgyFlamesftw]

I love how the whole nhl/media is talking about gaudreau just in time for long holidays. Takes away the limelight from collar mcbroken for a change.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by T@T

I was told Chiarelli wanted to take Gaudreau with their 3rd rounder but Neely and Fitzgerald wanted this Camara kid because he played with grit and determination. Fitzgerald supposedly said at the table "We might even be able to get him(Gaudreau) with our 5th pick,no need to use our 3rd, I like Camara if he's still there" Neely nodded and that was it.

But Chiarelli was nervous and thought Jersey or Nashville might take him and offered his 4th and 6th to move up but couldn't find a partner.

Flames really hid the fact they knew much about him or even knew of him at all. The rest as they say is h.......

I recall Feaster saying after that a few teams came up to him after the draft and told him that was a good pick as they were interested in Johnny. Makes me wonder why teams like go gamble with their later round picks so much. This isn't the NFL where 3rd and 4th round players are typically projected to be backups or starters immediately. In the NHL after the 1st round the odds of players becoming NHL players drops sharply to below 50% in the 2nd round and below 30% in the 3rd round, etc. If a guy after the first round stands out to your scouts I simply don't see any reason not to take him even if the pundits consider it a reach because is less than 30% of that round are going to make the NHL you can argue pretty well the majority of players picked are reaches regardless of the consensus player rankings. Chiarelli was right they should have picked Johnny in the 3rd round but the Bruins has the common mentality of teams where they play the gambling game where they assume teams will be picking mostly off consensus draft orders.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by ScorchyScorch

Redrafting the top 10:

Gaudreau
Nuge
Landeskog
Kucherov
Zibanejad
Larsson
Hamilton
Saad
Brodin
Huberdeau

Pretty sure that if Hamilton was still in a Boston uniform he would not be picked ahead of Brodin, Saad or Huberdeau.... all top players on their teams.

Brodin has been on the #1 pairing for a significant time.

I don't think Zibanejad goes as high as you have him....

Guy that would be in top-10 (especially if he was not playing for the Oilers), Kelfboom. He is playing against the players that Gio-Brodie play against and is a -4,

[Jason14h]

Makes me wonder why teams like go gamble with their later round picks so much.

I imagine every draft there are 5 guys per team that are being gambled on/have these types of discussions.

You only hear about the 1/1000 that turns into a star (Johnny, Benn's). That is when the stories about teams trying to get them come from.

[Enoch Root]

yes, we should trade Brodie for Kelfboom

lol

[Samonadreau]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Pretty sure that if Hamilton was still in a Boston uniform he would not be picked ahead of Brodin, Saad or Huberdeau.... all top players on their teams.

Brodin has been on the #1 pairing for a significant time.

I don't think Zibanejad goes as high as you have him....

Guy that would be in top-10 (especially if he was not playing for the Oilers), Kelfboom. He is playing against the players that Gio-Brodie play against and is a -4,

One could make arguments Hamilton is just as high or higher on Calgary's Depth chart and as good or better of a player with his play of late than any of these players.

[moncton golden flames]

Great draft year for Tampa

[JiriHrdina]

When Brodin is not with Suter he has struggled mightily. Solid player but hasn't progressed like many thought he would.

[Bingo]

I know I would have had Hamilton way up that list even if he was still in Boston. I follow the Bruins as a team that I'm interested in (wouldn't say 2nd favourite team) and watched a lot of Bruins games.

When the topic started on acquiring Hamilton I was with those that felt it would cost you one of the big three up front so I was shocked when they landed him.

Was also pretty sure he'd turn it around, as you don't fake three years of good hockey in a market like Boston, no where to hide.

[Erick Estrada]

I feel like Hamilton is the real deal and will eventually become the Flames number one defender. He's got the size and tools that no other Flames defender has and it's only a matter of getting more experience as defensemen don't hit their stride until about 25. No coincidence Brodie at 25 is just now showing he's the Flames best defender.

[Enoch Root]

It's anti-homerism (the grass is always greener..) to suggest Hamilton isn't the top defenseman from that draft at this point.

Larsson is coming along, but hasn't had anywhere near the career that Hamilton has. Brodin started out fantastically but has plateaued. No one else is in the conversation.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Samonadreau

One could make arguments Hamilton is just as high or higher on Calgary's Depth chart and as good or better of a player with his play of late than any of these players.

It would be a very weak argument.

He gets at best the #4 of ice time in any game. Over the season he is #5 in TOI 3 minutes behind #4. He is religiously sheltered from playing any time at all against the other teams best players.

Is is not trusted to get any time on the PK.... on a PK that is not that good.

He has a huge upside but he has not taken on as a significant role As Kelfboom and Brodin.

The only time that he was asked to play a top role (first 7 games of the season) was a disaster. Since then he has been treated like a talented young D-man not quite ready for prime time.

Because Edmonton does not have a Giordano, Brodie, Russell or Wideman, Kelfboom has been pushed up the depth chart in Edmonton, but he has not been a disaster in the role that he has been put in.

[MoneyGuy]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

what makes it awesome is Chiarelli now being an oiler guy is even closer to that monumental mistake.

Calgary took him before Boston was up. How is that a monumental mistake? If you're saying they should have taken him in an earlier round, everyone passed over him.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I feel like Hamilton is the real deal and will eventually become the Flames number one defender. He's got the size and tools that no other Flames defender has and it's only a matter of getting more experience as defensemen don't hit their stride until about 25. No coincidence Brodie at 25 is just now showing he's the Flames best defender.

or all of last year including the playoffs and with Gio the last 20 games where he played every 2nd shift with Engelland and Schlemko as his partners

True Hamilton is about equal to where Brodie was as a 22 year old..... Strike shortened season.... Brodie played more minutes (20:13/game) but was an absolutely horrendous team . Brodie was specatular the last month of 2013-13 playing over 23 minutes a game after Bouwmeester was traded and he took over on the #1 pairing with Gio.

Brodie played 24 minutes a game for 81 games in 2013-14 as a 23 year old.

Hamilton has to show a drastic improvement to play as well as Brodie did as a 23 year old..... (both born in June)


Hamilton does have the tools but he has a tendency to shut down mentally and stop skating 2 or 3 times a game. He needs to be able to keep his focus up for the full game. Boston obviously didn't think he would do it to be able to play as good as his tools would indicate.

It is not that he overplays a play going for the big hit or pinch that misses... He just seem to stop for a moment, like he is thinking where he should be or what he should do.

[AC]

nm

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Sutter drafted the following players outside the 1st round who ever became NHLers

Pardy
Boyd
Prust
Brodie
Bouma
Cracknell

6 picks out of 46 after the 1st round, about a 13 percent success rate

Feaster snagged

Ferland
Gaudreau
Granlund

3 out of 21 our around 14 percent with time left for at least 2 more legitimate prospects (Gillies and Broissant) along with a couple outsiders. It is pretty clear that Feaster's existing list is better than Sutter right now.

Ferland was a Sutter pick. The 2010 draft - which included Arnold - was Sutter's last draft.

[Hackey]

Which would bump Sutters success rate over Feasters success rate meaning Sutter > Feaster

Edit: Ortio isn't on the list either. Also Keith Aulie.

[Jaydee]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Which would bump Sutters success rate over Feasters success rate meaning Sutter > Feaster

Edit: Ortio isn't on the list either. Also Keith Aulie.

Except Feaster drafted Gaudreau so it will forever be Feaster > Sutter

[Jiggy]

Originally Posted by Jaydee

Except Feaster drafted Gaudreau so it will forever be Feaster > Sutter

Sutter drafted Brodie who is our best defensemen.