University of Winnipeg approves mandatory Indigenous course for all students

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Weitz

I think this is poorly implemented due to essentially how most people tackle university.

I took engineering in University and I know if this was a course I had to take, my friends and I would take turns going to class, share notes, I would write whatever paper or what ever would be required, get my grade, and forget everything from the class.

Not because of the course material, but because it has nothing to do with my degree and is only a grade I need to graduate. Much like the English class, and a couple electives I had to take these were simply means to an end.

Which only shows that universities have evolved into something fundamentally different from they were intended to be, and were even as recently as the 60s. University used to be as much about educating a citizen as training a worker (that's what trade schools were for). If students no longer care about anything except their narrow job training, maybe we should simply do away with the distinction between university, colleges, and trade schools altogether. Though I do wonder what we're losing by devaluing the very notion of broad liberal education and informed citizenship. It isn't just our technology and our material affluence that have made Canada a good place to live. And all that other stuff - all the stuff we've been talking about in the Western canon - can evaporate quickly if people don't understand or care about it.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Which only shows that universities have evolved into something fundamentally different from they were intended to be, and were even as recently as the 60s. University used to be as much about educating a citizen as training a worker (that's what trade schools were for). If students no longer care about anything except their narrow job training, maybe we should simply do away with the distinction between university, colleges, and trade schools altogether. Though I do wonder what we're losing by devaluing the very notion of broad liberal education and informed citizenship. It isn't just our technology and our material affluence that have made Canada a good place to live. And all that other stuff - all the stuff we've been talking about in the Western canon - can evaporate quickly if people don't understand or care about it.

When you have piles and piles of homework to do, projects to complete, and exams to study for time gets divided into what you would deem as important. And i am sorry to say, if I am going to University to become and Engineer, an indigenous history class would be low on the totem pole.

Your idealized version of University ceased to exist when I am paying $6,500+ to attend 4 months of school.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Which only shows that universities have evolved into something fundamentally different from they were intended to be, and were even as recently as the 60s. University used to be as much about educating a citizen as training a worker (that's what trade schools were for). If students no longer care about anything except their narrow job training, maybe we should simply do away with the distinction between university, colleges, and trade schools altogether. Though I do wonder what we're losing by devaluing the very notion of broad liberal education and informed citizenship. It isn't just our technology and our material affluence that have made Canada a good place to live. And all that other stuff - all the stuff we've been talking about in the Western canon - can evaporate quickly if people don't understand or care about it.

Really that's largely a result of neoliberalism. If university is seen as a necessary for acquiring wealth, then it's pretty easy to understand how it becomes a means to an end rather than an end in and of itself.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Weitz

When you have piles and piles of homework to do, projects to complete, and exams to study for time gets divided into what you would deem as important. And i am sorry to say, if I am going to University to become and Engineer, an indigenous history class would be low on the totem pole.

Your idealized version of University ceased to exist when I am paying $6,500+ to attend 4 months of school.

I'm not really gainsaying that, and you're probably pretty typical in that regard. I guess I'm just lamenting the passing of an ideal of education. And questioning why we keep pretending university is anything but a job training and accreditation institution. Because if that's true, we're going about in an incredibly inefficient and outmoded manner.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

I'm not really gainsaying that, and you're probably pretty typical in that regard. I guess I'm just lamenting the passing of an ideal of education. And questioning why we keep pretending university is anything but a job training and accreditation institution. Because if that's true, we're going about in an incredibly inefficient and outmoded manner.

I guess this is the issue I take with people who are against "free" post-secondary education on the grounds that students need to be financially-invested in their education. I mean it's fine if you believe that, but if you intend to have students treat university as a financial investment, then it shouldn't be a surprise when they attempt to maximize the financial return on that investment.

Take a look around this board and see just how much liberal arts degrees are widely disparaged. If we continue to make education a skills-based commodity, then knowledge and truth become hobbies.

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by Weitz

When you have piles and piles of homework to do, projects to complete, and exams to study for time gets divided into what you would deem as important. And i am sorry to say, if I am going to University to become and Engineer, an indigenous history class would be low on the totem pole.

Your idealized version of University ceased to exist when I am paying $6,500+ to attend 4 months of school.

[GGG]

I enjoyed my electives. Lots of people treat them as free marks and do as little as possible but that is your own fault for not taking advantage. The logic Phil class I took was very valuable and stuck with me. Straw men, ad hominem, etc and understanding the basic logical fallacies and the all dogs are pets, all pets are brown therefore all dogs are brown type reasoning. A pretty good class. Also to a real crappy Phil class on pretty much corsis list. Would have been much more useful to take an indiginious studies class.

[rubecube]

I think one of the things that would be valuable about an indigenous studies course is if the course focused on the responsibilities-based discourse that many indigenous peoples believe in vs. the rights-based discourse of Western liberal tradition.

[polak]

I absolutely loved the Geography courses I took as electives. Human and Economic. I think the prof had a lot to do with it though. He was a great teacher and made the classes really interesting and involved.

I don't see why they can't just add this to say a group of humanities electives or sociology. I did Sociology of Health and it was mostly about native people. Forcing someone to take this specific course is what erks me.