Prentice Blames Albertans

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by polak

No man. I've had it with whining from teachers about being unfairly compensated.

I am open to be swayed by your argument.


Can you please provide source material to substantiate your claim that teachers are fairly compensated.

[shermanator]

I'm curious as to what you do for a living, and how much you are compensated, polak? Based on the number of posts in this thread, which has largely been posted in this morning, you must either be unemployed, a student, or not have a lot of work to do.

Or perhaps you are the one who is overpaid?

[polak]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

I am open to be swayed by your argument.


Can you please provide source material to substantiate your claim that teachers are fairly compensated.

Please provide me with source material that says they are not?

[polak]

Originally Posted by shermanator

I'm curious as to what you do for a living, and how much you are compensated, polak? Based on the number of posts in this thread, which has largely been posted in this morning, you must either be unemployed, a student, or not have a lot of work to do.

Or perhaps you are the one who is overpaid?

The nature of my job means some mornings I have almost nothing to do as some of the reporting I do takes hours to run during which my computer is pretty useless.

I have no complaints with my compensation by the way. So lets move on from what I do.

[Frequitude]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

Please elaborate.

If your boss came to you with the following:

1. You are taking a massive pay cut.
2. Your work load is doubling.
3. You will have no additional resources.
4. Anything beyond a mediocre budget of a few hundred dollars will have to be funded by you personally (out of your after tax dollars, which by the way, you will have less of after your pay cut).
5. The board of directors has decided that for the fourth time in four years, to change the way in which you report performance.
6. To keep up, you will have to work even more overtime than you already do, which you don't get paid for.

What would your response be? I know what mine would be.

Mine would depend upon the basis from which these changes were being made.

i.e. if I was previously making a billion dollars for one hour of work per week with lock tight job security and a gold plated pension I'd be just fine with it. If I was previously making $40K for 80 hours of work per week with no job security or pension I'd be upset.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by polak

Please provide me with source material that says they are not?

Listen you started this highjack, so I can only assume you would have done that because you have researched the topic and were well informed.


So I don't have to provide you the information. If you wish to have people change their opinions, you are the one that needs to provide the evidence to support what you are saying.

[polak]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Listen you started this highjack, so I can only assume you would have done that because you have researched the topic and were well informed.


So I don't have to provide you the information. If you wish to have people change their opinions, you are the one that needs to provide the evidence to support what you are saying.

I didn't bring up teachers?

I don't have to do anything. The people defending the original stance (teachers are unfairly compensated) should be the ones explaining why I'm wrong.

Why do I take such a hard stance on my position? Cause I made less money, had less vacation time, had longer days, was on call and had so much stress that it was creating health issues for me at my last job. Guess what? I quit that job. There are plenty of teachers looking for work. Anyone who doesn't like their position, their compensation can easily find something better. Oh wait, they won't be able too? Well congrats. You just figured out why teachers are paid what they are.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by polak

I didn't bring up teachers?

I don't have to do anything. The people defending the original stance (teachers are unfairly compensated) should be the ones explaining why I'm wrong.

polak I often agree with things you say (well sometimes) but I think you really need to push back from the keyboard for a little.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by polak

I didn't bring up teachers?

I don't have to do anything. The people defending the original stance (teachers are unfairly compensated) should be the ones explaining why I'm wrong.

No but you responded that you thought they were fairly paid, and then you went on to say they are whining.


I can only assume your comment on them being fairly paid was based on prior knowledge of their compansation structure...................oops never mind I forgot who I was dealing with.

[nieuwy-89]

Prentice is absolutely right and deserves credit for being honest with the public.

There is a sense of entitlement in Alberta, not unlike the rest of Canada, that we deserve Cadillac public services at no cost. A few examples:

• Young families that move to new suburban neighbourhoods to save money on house prices, and then demand the government build new schools in their suburbs - when there are perfectly good underutilized schools in established areas.
• Many folks want better roads and transit but balk at any form of subsidy or user pay system (toll roads, higher fares, etc.).
• The mentality that our justice system and health system should bend over backwards to help every citizen in every case.

I remember the outcry when the PC government was actually running surpluses and trying the save the money - the media and the left were all over them for "over-taxing" Albertans. This directly lead to some of the enormous wage settlements with nurses and teachers that are now crippling our bottom line.

The bottom line is the system needs a re-alignment at all levels (federal, provincial, municipal) and we need visionary leaders to institute.

[shermanator]

Originally Posted by polak

The nature of my job means some mornings I have almost nothing to do as some of the reporting I do takes hours to run during which my computer is pretty useless.

I have no complaints with my compensation by the way. So lets move on from what I do.

So if you are fine with your compensation, why take such a harsh stance towards teachers? Why should teachers have to be the ones making the sacrifice, and have their salaries cut, just so that you can keep 100% of your paycheque? A paycheque which may or may not be considered very large for what you do?

Before you lambaste these people, who IMO work in a profession that is very important to our society, maybe work towards gaining an actual understanding of what they do day in and day not. Perhaps the teachers you and I know would love to spend all morning surfing Calgarypuck complaining about what other people make while having no work to do?

[polak]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

No but you responded that you thought they were fairly paid, and then you went on to say they are whining.


I can only assume your comment on them being fairly paid was based on prior knowledge of their compansation structure...................oops never mind I forgot who I was dealing with.

I do.

My friend started at 63 K a year. She gets all the usual teacher vacation time and of course, the incredible pension and job security. She does some work from home but it's light, no stress work (I'm sure some teachers do have stressful work like personalized lesson plans to take home too, but so do many other professions). Grading papers and setting up next day lesson plans. No complaints from her though, she loves it and she deals with the poorest kids in Edmonton. Often goes out and buys them lunch out of her own pocket.

I don't have a problem with how much they make. Like I said, I wouldn't be against a small pay bump as their job is important. Individually replacable, but an important profession.

I have a problem with the CONSTANT whining and strike threats every few years like they're exempt from all economic turmoil and like they're the only ones that have to deal with pay cuts and tough jobs. That's unions for you though. They can't justify their existence without complaining.

[calgarygeologist]

Damnit, I thought it was the Government's job to protect us from ourselves.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by nieuwy-89

Prentice is absolutely right and deserves credit for being honest with the public.

There is a sense of entitlement in Alberta, not unlike the rest of Canada, that we deserve Cadillac public services at no cost. A few examples:

• ĵ
• Young families that move to new suburban neighbourhoods to save money on house prices, and then demand the government build new schools in their suburbs - when there are perfectly good underutilized schools in established areas.
• Many folks want better roads and transit but balk at any form of subsidy or user pay system (toll roads, higher fares, etc.).
• The mentality that our justice system and health system should bend over backwards to help every citizen in every case.

I remember the outcry when the PC government was actually running surpluses and trying the save the money - the media and the left were all over them for "over-taxing" Albertans. This directly lead to some of the enormous wage settlements with nurses and teachers that are now crippling our bottom line.

The bottom line is the system needs a re-alignment at all levels (federal, provincial, municipal) and we need visionary leaders to institute.

So the reigning ruling party, sorry, elected party for the last, what, 4 decades? They're off the hook? It's the people?

That's like saying its an abused womans fault for going back to her wife beating Husband. "welp, she kept going back to him so its their fault".

I realize that may sound hypocritical because I say albertans get what they deserve by re-electing these clowns, but the fault lays with the Conservative governments. The people are still wrong to go back to the same idiots.

[Jacks]

Prior to the last election the PC's had almost no opposition combined with massive majorites. Under Stelmach and Redford we burned through all of our savings and ran deficits while oil prices and overall revenues were at all time highs. To say that the public is to blame is a load of crap. Incompetent government is to blame and the only thing that has changed is that the most visible pig has new lipstick.

[AcGold]

What's the average teacher salary? What's their pay per hour of work on average?

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

This isn't directed at you in particular, but all CBAs are publicly available on the Human Services website.

http://humanservices.alberta.ca/apps/cba/search.asp

Pay scales are on Pages 4 / 5 of the CBA for CBE Teachers. Link

Originally Posted by AcGold

What's the average teacher salary? What's their pay per hour of work on average?

I asked earlier and this was provided.

[V]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

...there is an expectation by school administration that there would be 3 hours of additional work 5 days a week...

Edit - misread. But also call BS. I don't know one teacher that puts in 55 hr weeks, outside of first year teachers.


Give me a break. Teachers have it tough like every single other profession has it tough. And they have their perks, just like pretty much any job. But I'm not sure there's another group of employees that whines and moans more than this one.

>90k within 10 years? Boatloads of worry free vacation? I'm not saying it's cushy, but it sure isn't half as bad as so many make it out to be.

FWIW, my father and my brother are both teachers. I almost went into it myself. And they are constantly embarrassed by the whiners in this profession.

[IliketoPuck]

Originally Posted by V

Edit - misread. But also call BS. I don't know one teacher that puts in 55 hr weeks, outside of first year teachers.


Give me a break. Teachers have it tough like every single other profession has it tough. And they have their perks, just like pretty much any job. But I'm not sure there's another group of employees that whines and moans more than this one.

>90k within 10 years? Boatloads of worry free vacation? I'm not saying it's cushy, but it sure isn't half as bad as so many make it out to be.

FWIW, my father and my brother are both teachers. I almost went into it myself. And they are constantly embarrassed by the whiners in this profession.

What grade do they teach if you don't mind me asking?

$90k within ten years is not some spectacular feat. A ten year professional in the private sector can (and should) be able to make far more than that.

[northcrunk]

Some teachers should not be teaching. Unfortunatly thats the downside of Unions. even the incompitent keep their jobs.