I never saw her as a villain, she was fighting a war in her own country, sure we can talk the influx of communism and the invasion of the south by the north. But she was killing foreigners, and we couldn't really class the protagonists as wholesome all american boys in this one.
I agree with the simple assertion that the war and the grinder that turned boys into semi psycho killers was the true and unseen villian.
Both very good points. The point I was trying to make was in response to the claim that there was no real villain, which I agree there really wasn't.
I was basically putting it in the simplest context of what a villain is, the closest thing to a 'protagonist' in that movie was private joker, so the fact that the sniper was his enemy made her a villain by default. If the movie were written from the snipers point of view joker would be the villain, neither is a 'bad guy' given the situation, but from the point of view the story is told from the sniper in my opinion doesn't get viewed as a protagonist or neutral character because you hope the sniper doesn't 'win'.
was just going through my pile of dvds and remembered this one (kicking myself for not thinking of it before): Humphrey Bogart in The Treasure of the Sierra Madre. Can't really call him a true villain, but the way he gave in to greed and paranoia was nothing short of frightening:
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Bogart in Sierra Madre is a great choice. Love him in that movie, and always find myself on his side for the first 2/3 of the movie, but as it commences it's really hard to remain on his side as his lust for gold ends up turning him into the malicious character he becomes.
Also on the subject of who is/is not a villain, someone posted a picture of Gollum, and I for one would definitely not consider him to be one. He's more of a tragic character who started off as a good person, but the ring was the reason for his downfall. He even began to become more of a heroic character in the 2nd movie, but Frodo's "betrayal" turned him again to the badside. Still he's not the villain of the movie, Sauron and Sauramon are.
Oh and I'll add a couple more from two of my top ten movies of all time.
Both are pure evil.
Last edited by trackercowe; 03-23-2014 at 12:09 AM.
For me, the best villain in recent memory is the sociopath bureaucrat in Harry Potter, one Ms. Delores Umbridge
This quote was such a brilliant bit of writing, because it is something that is not that far fetched.
" I am sorry, dear, but to question my practices is to question the Ministry, and by extension, the Minister himself. I am a tolerant woman, but the one thing I will not stand for is disloyalty. "
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Forest Whitaker as det. Kavanaugh in the shield. I've never had a character generate the kind of emotion and hatred I had towards that man. I wanted to jump thru the screen and choke him!
Going small screen, no villain was greater than Al Swearengen. It's tough to single out a single moment that makes this character so simultaneously identifiable and repulsive. Really, it's an experience gained over the all too short 3 seasons of Deadwood.
In the same breath, George Hearst (Gerald McRaney) absolutely makes the case for greatest (if not favorite) screen villain. He comes into the Deadwood camp wielding his capital and influence around as if he owns the entire territory. This face-off between two of the greater villains in TV history is like porn to a media buff:
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Swearengen is one of the best characters ever put on TV but he isn't really a villain, imo.
He lives right on the line of good and evil. The way he treats the prostitutes, how he bullies some of the men in his employ (especially Farnum and Johnny), his willingness to murder Sophia, ordering the killing of Bromm, slitting the throat of that prostitute in the final episodes, and so on.
Yet, he's a deeply complex character that you can sympathize with to some degree. That and his pragmatism muddies the interpretation of the true evil he is capable of...much in the same way it was done with Walter White.
Swearengen is easily my favorite screen character of all time.
__________________ "It's a great day for hockey."
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"I see as much misery out of them moving to justify theirselves as them that set out to do harm." -Dr. Amos "Doc" Cochran
