[Signing] Kessel to sign contract extension with Leafs ($8Mil AAV, 8 years)

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Yoho

How about in 7 yrs when the Leaf's are paying Kessel 8 mill per?

The cap will probably be over $80 million in 7 years and Kessel would only be 32 in 7 years.

What most don't get is good players that reach UFA get long contracts. It will be no different for Sven, Monahan, Johnny Hockey , ect if they pan out.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Voodooman

Nope. I actually take the time to think about what I'm going to say, and how it's relevant to the current situation. If you had done so, you would note that 15 of those 22 playoff games you are hanging your hat on were over 5 years ago, when he was still with the Bruins.

Kessel just doesn't have the reputation as a game changer and a leader. When it's crunch time, he's not the guy you can count on. Look at all those trips to Boston, the heat was turned up, and he was invisible. And the 2010 Olympics, 2 points in 6 games.

I'm not saying that he's awful, but $8 million for 8 years suggests an elite level player. Kessel seems more along the lines of a Tavares, Marleau or Towes. A great player, salary in the lines of $6-6.5 million/year. But he's just not in the same league as a Stamkos, Perry or Getzlaf.

I will say that the talk that the Bruins absolutely "won" the Kessel trade is now dead. The Raycroft/Rask trade has far eclipsed that in terms of Toronto ineptitude.

You can't count players that signed before the new CBA. As for elite talent, Malkin will make $9.5 million and Perry is making $8.6 million. I would say elite level is now closer to $9 million.

[jessnuts]

Perry and getzlaf a level above Tavares and toews? I think your putting too much stock in current salary numbers and not actual level of play. You just listed two of the top...5-8ish players in the league as being a level below two players that probably fit in the 15-30 best players in the league. Trust me when I tell you the next contract Tavares or toews sign might be a LITTLE higher then 6.5 mil.

[Yoho]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

The cap will probably be over $80 million in 7 years and Kessel would only be 32 in 7 years.

What most don't get is good players that reach UFA get long contracts. It will be no different for Sven, Monahan, Johnny Hockey , ect if they pan out.

He's 26 tomorrow so 33 in 7 yrs. I wouldn't be shocked if he's bought out like Briere with 2 yrs. to go in that contract

[Bertuzzied]

Holy crap. For Kessel to get that term he must have hacked off both of Nonis's achilles and then speared him in the nuts in the boardroom.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Yoho

He's 26 tomorrow so 33 in 7 yrs. I wouldn't be shocked if he's bought out like Briere with 2 yrs. to go in that contract

You could say that about any UFA player signing for 7 years. Not sure why you would think that though?

Does Kessel have injury problems? No

At 33 would he have slowed down a lot? Maybe

Does he play a physical brand of hockey that will take a big toll on his body? No

[dino7c]

It may be the market rate but its not how I would spend 8M

[Jake]

He's a very good player, but the Leafs definitely did not get a discount, which makes me happy.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by dino7c

It may be the market rate but its not how I would spend 8M

I understand why the Leafs did it given finally making the playoffs after 7 years out and letting Kessel go would be a step back. It's all about winning now and dealing with the consequences later for a lot of these long term deals as Nonis won't likely even be the Leafs GM at the end of the deal. If Kessell gets on the market how many other teams offer him that money? Not many I would think but there's always one or two desperate teams that would battle it out over him just like the three teams that tried hard to sign Brad Richards. Turns out the other 27 teams in the league were right in thinking he wasn't worth the bidding war money.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I understand why the Leafs did it given finally making the playoffs after 7 years out and letting Kessel go would be a step back. It's all about winning now and dealing with the consequences later for a lot of these long term deals as Nonis won't likely even be the Leafs GM at the end of the deal. If Kessell gets on the market how many other teams offer him that money? Not many I would think but there's always one or two desperate teams that would battle it out over him just like the three teams that tried hard to sign Brad Richards. Turns out the other 27 teams in the league were right in thinking he wasn't worth the bidding war money.

Not sure you can compare the Brad Richards UFA signing and Kessel as the same situation. There would have been a 4 year difference in age and thats a lot. Also there were more than 3 teams that tried to get Richards. Do you not remember the stupid coverage with 3/4 of the teams in the league waiting outside a building to get their chance to talk to him.

[Miniac]

Highest paid lumberjack I have ever seen.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Not sure you can compare the Brad Richards UFA signing and Kessel as the same situation. There would have been a 4 year difference in age and thats a lot. Also there were more than 3 teams that tried to get Richards. Do you not remember the stupid coverage with 3/4 of the teams in the league waiting outside a building to get their chance to talk to him.

All teams kick tires and I'm sure more than a few submitted offers but it was clearly spelled out at the end that only 3 were in the ballpark of what he got as the other teams all bowed out when the money and term got silly.

The age difference makes it not a perfect comparison but you can argue Richards had a better resume with a Stanley cup and a successful captain. I'm sure a lot of teams would be interested in Kessel but really how many teams in the league do you think would have handed him 7 years at $8 million per season? I don't think there would be more than two or three at the most.

[LickTheEnvelope]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Rick Nash is one of the most overrated players in the league which kind of sums up why some of us feel this is an overpayment.

Yup, but the real problem out in New York is the dramatic fall-off of Brad Richards.

You guys should be thanking your stars every day Feaster didn't land Richards as wow did he fall off a cliff last season.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope

Yup, but the real problem out in New York is the dramatic fall-off of Brad Richards.

You guys should be thanking your stars every day Feaster didn't land Richards as wow did he fall off a cliff last season.

Its gotta make you think that there is something in the water in NY. Almost every big money free agent they have signed in the last number of years has shown a rather large drop in production after signing and joining the Rangers.

If it wasn't for the fact that they are actually pretty good at producing talent from within the organization (and Lundqvist in general) they would probably be a bottom feeder team.

[return to the red]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

The cap will probably be over $80 million in 7 years

Not picking on you but I keep seeing this popping up in more and more posts. Not a fan of the assumption that the cap will be at X amount of dollars 7 years down the road. Lot's of things can change in that time.

[BigTuna]

Originally Posted by strombad

My bad, meant 1-1.5 million, as you said multiple times he is essentially guaranteed over 7 as a UFA. Sorry!



I pay him 7-7.5

The difference between their point totals over the past 3 years is 4, and if you don't put on your leaf blinders you can see that if you factor in the last 4 years instead of the last 3?
Well, Kane then has 29 more points than Kessel.

Over their NHL careers?
Kessel - 504 GP/379 points
Kane - 446 GP/424 points

Kane is better, by leaps and bounds. He's been a big contributor to 2 cup winning teams, and is actually a dynamic player who can create from every area of the offensive zone.

Again, Kessel is GOOD. But he's not that good.

So Kessel outscores Kane the past 3 years, does it with Bozak where Kane plays with Toews, but Kane is "Leaps and Bounds Better? That's silly. They are very similar players.

Cups are a team game. On Toronto, Kane is winning no cups.

[BigTuna]

Originally Posted by return to the red

Not picking on you but I keep seeing this popping up in more and more posts. Not a fan of the assumption that the cap will be at X amount of dollars 7 years down the road. Lot's of things can change in that time.

Most hockey people say that so it's not exactly a stretch. It'll probably be close to 70 million by next summer.

[BigTuna]

LeBrun:

Many will believe that’s too much money for Kessel, but the numbers, at least, suggest otherwise:

--Only Kessel and Steven Stamkos were among the top 10 scorers in the NHL each of the past two seasons

--Only Stamkos, Evgeni Malkin and Claude Giroux have more points than Kessel over the last two seasons

--And only Stamkos, Alex Ovechkin and Corey Perry have more goals than Kessel over the last three years

Kessel’s $8 million cap hit in the new deal is still less than Claude Giroux's new deal ($8.275M), Corey Perry's ($8.625M) and Ryan Getlzaf's ($8.25M), the three contracts brought up the most in negotiations by Kessel’s camp.

[BigTuna]

Originally Posted by Voodooman

Nope. I actually take the time to think about what I'm going to say, and how it's relevant to the current situation. If you had done so, you would note that 15 of those 22 playoff games you are hanging your hat on were over 5 years ago, when he was still with the Bruins.

Kessel just doesn't have the reputation as a game changer and a leader. When it's crunch time, he's not the guy you can count on. Look at all those trips to Boston, the heat was turned up, and he was invisible. And the 2010 Olympics, 2 points in 6 games.

I'm not saying that he's awful, but $8 million for 8 years suggests an elite level player. Kessel seems more along the lines of a Tavares, Marleau or Towes. A great player, salary in the lines of $6-6.5 million/year. But he's just not in the same league as a Stamkos, Perry or Getzlaf.

I will say that the talk that the Bruins absolutely "won" the Kessel trade is now dead. The Raycroft/Rask trade has far eclipsed that in terms of Toronto ineptitude.

I'm trying to understand why that matters? He's actually a better player now than 5 years ago. When he returned to the playoffs this past May, he had 4 goals, 6 points in 7 games with 2 GWG.

It's not like we're talking about a guy who was better 5 years ago and is past his prime now. He picked up right where he left off in May.

And who cares about reputation? Kessel's reputation is so unfair, he'd be totally worthless if half the things were true.

A few Olympic games does not mean more than 13 goals, 21 points in 22 playoff games.

Face it, you had no idea what his stats were when you posted that.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope

Yup, but the real problem out in New York is the dramatic fall-off of Brad Richards.

You guys should be thanking your stars every day Feaster didn't land Richards as wow did he fall off a cliff last season.

It is funny that Feaster took 2 big runs at trying to acquire a guy who is a potential #1C and the flames are far far better off that the moves failed. He offered a 9-10 year deal to Richards at $7.1M per and then the offer sheet of RoR. Both would have been a disaster if the flames signed Richards or the Avs failed to match. Richards looked awful in the preseason and he will probably be bought out next summer. My guess is he goes back to Tampa or to Toronto