Let's play Dump or Keep

[Gord_Wappel]

I'm not sure why the love in for Cervenka on almost everyones keep list. I had high hopes for and was excited to see him play but he seems as soft as butter and has completely whiffed on more quality scoring chances than almost any other Flame.

To me the only guys i would keep on my must keep list would be Brodie, Baertschi, Backlund, and Hudler.

I would try and keep Bouw, Stempniak, and Horak unless the return was really good. I've been an anti trade Iggy guy but I think this team needs a change of personnel not just for the on ice product but also the leadership and direction in general and unfortunately I think until they get a new mix of players and let Iggy go this team will be broken. I think just like a good coach can "lose" a team and have a short shelf life i believe the same is true with the leadership of the product on the ice and that starts with JI.

I am sick of mixing up the lines to "get Iggy going" or watching the powerplay (which admittedly has been very good this year) work to get him setup with his predictable Stamkos style one timer. It seems this team tries way too hard to adapt to one player when in reality if you watch Iggy's best years he almost never setup on the side to do the Stamkos or goal sucked at the offensive blue line.

whoops -end Iggy rant- (i actually think if he is traded he will catch fire going to a team with an established system and culture where he is looked at as a complimentary piece to win a cup rather than "the guy" here)

[moon]

Originally Posted by Gord_Wappel

I'm not sure why the love in for Cervenka on almost everyones keep list. I had high hopes for and was excited to see him play but he seems as soft as butter and has completely whiffed on more quality scoring chances than almost any other Flame.

The reason I had Cerevenka on the doesn't matter list is that he will be under 30 by the time the rebuild should be done, shouldn't cost much and seems like the perfect guy to get 50-60 points on a bad, non-play-off team while providing some exciting play. I think he is actually more valuable (or a better fit) on a bad/rebuilding team than he would be on a good team.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by moon

The reason I had Cerevenka on the doesn't matter list is that he will be under 30 by the time the rebuild should be done, shouldn't cost much and seems like the perfect guy to get 50-60 points on a bad, non-play-off team while providing some exciting play. I think he is actually more valuable (or a better fit) on a bad/rebuilding team than he would be on a good team.

Yep, that's exactly what I was thinking too. Flames fans will need something to watch while the team rebuilds and he's a great candidate.

[Super-Rye]

Keep:
Backlund
Brodie
Beartschi
Wideman
Hudler
Horak
Cervenka
Glencross
Giordano
Kiprusoff

Fence:
Iginla
Tanguay
Bouwmeester
Sarich
Smith

Dump:
Comeau
Jackman
Jones
Begin
Stempniak
Stajan
Cammalleri
Butler
Babchuk

As fun as it would be to see this team just ripped apart from top to bottom, in the long run it would be absolutely brutal. We have all seen it before and we lost some pretty good players for nothing. Ideally the management of this team would start looking towards next season and beyond and start to weed out the guys that don't fit into the long term plans.

[Spinach]

I haven't read all of the posts, but I do love this game. Pardon me if this isn't exactly original thinking:

Contracts Expiring This Year

Aliu - gone (unless he shows significant progress)
Backlund - keep
Babchuk - gone
Bouma - keep
Brodie - keep (nearly untouchable)
Butler - gone
Carson - gone
Comeau - gone
Cervenka - keep (hard to say at this point, and depends on the $/term)
Iginla - trade before season's end. Otherwise, the jury's out...
Irving - qualify for 1 more year
Kolanos - gone
Lamb - gone
Nemisz - qualify
Piskula - gone
Walter - gone

Guys with 2 years left (including 2013)

Cammy - trade if/when decent return found. Otherwise, gone at deal's end.
Bouwmeester - "" ""
Glencross - keep
Horak - keep
Howse - gone unless he shows significant progress.
Jackman - gone
Jones - keep
Kiprusoff - trade if/when decent return available
Ortio - keep
Martin - keep (?)
Sarich - gone
Smith - keep
Stajan - gone
Stempniak - gone (hopefully he's tradeable at deadline 2013)
Street - gone

Guys with 3+ years remaining (incl. 2013)

Baertschi - keep (nearly untouchable)
Ferland - keep
Hudler - keep
Reinhart - keep
Tanguay - trade if/when decent return available
Giordano - keep
Reinhart - keep
Wideman - keep

Other prospects & miscellaneous contracts

Arnold - keep
Bancks - gone
Breen - keep
Brossoit - keep
Byron - gone
Cameron - gone
Elson - ???
Eddy - ???
Gaudreau - keep
Gillies - trade for young D or RW
Jankowski - keep
Patterson - gone
Ramage - keep
Sieloff- keep
Wahl - gone
Wotherspoon - keep

I'm looking forward to a number of useless contracts (Piskula, Walter, Kolanos, Babchuk, Comeau) coming off the books this July.

[WessThompson]

Originally Posted by Icon

All out rebuild imo. Keep the youth and the guys who show up to play each night. Unload everyone else for whatever you can get, as minor retools won't make this a winning team any time soon anyway.

Keep: (in no particular order)
- Hudler
- Wideman
- Brodie
- Baertschi
- Backlund
- Smith
- Horak
- Cervenka
- Stempniak

Try to Trade:
- Stajan
- Butler
- Bouwmeester
- Iggy
- Cammy
- Comeau
- Jackman
- Babchuk
- Kipper
- Giordano
- Tanguay
- Glencross


Was on the fence with Tanguay, Glencross & Stempniak... as Jiri mentioned you need some vets around even in a full rebuild. Of the 3, stick with Stempniak, then he, Wideman & Hudler answer that role well enough I think.

I would do exactly this with the exception of Stajan. I would keep him. He is one of very few players that has shown any desire and effort.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by WessThompson

I would do exactly this with the exception of Stajan. I would keep him. He is one of very few players that has shown any desire and effort.

Also, haven't people learned from this year that you keep all the centers you can until you are damned sure you have someone to replace them. You can almost always convert extra centers to wingers, but rarely wingers to centers.

[Stay Golden]

Keep

- Hudler
- Wideman
- Brodie
- Baertschi
- Backlund
- Gio
- Smith
- Horak
- Cervenka
- Tanguay
- Stempniak
- Sarich
- Alui
- Kipper I see nobody on the immediate horizon in the Flames system that can replace him.
- Ramos we won't know if he is maybe the future untill he actually becomes an NHL roster player.

Look for draft picks or roster improvments through trade with:

- Butler
- Stajan
- Glencross
- Bouwmeester
- Cammy
- Comeau
- Jackman
- Babchuk

Iginla there is no point deciding to keep or trade for assets because I think the Flames have made up their mind he is staying and retiring a Flame. So its counter productive to go through all the "what ifs" about it.

[Matty81]

Stempniak is the only older guy without a NMC or NTC you'd get anything significant for.

That said I'd love to see any of Stajan, Babchuk, Sarich, Glencross or Cammalleri dealt for any picks they could get, I actually think Glencross and Cammalleri would bring decent returns.

Butler, Comeau and Begin wouldn't even bring a pick in my opinion.

My keep list is:
Iginla (if he re-signs)
Backlund
Baertschi
Giordano
Bouw
Wideman
Kipper
Smith
Brodie
Hudler
Cervenka
Horak

Jackman I can't decide, he's the only one with any grit on the whole team this year but his puck skills and skating seem to have declined.

Count me in the Iginla retire as a Flame camp.

[Trojan97]

Keep:
Youth (Sven, Brodie, Backlund, Horak)
Steady veteran leadership (Sarich, Tanguay)
Guys on good contracts (Glencross, Stajan (now that he is making less than his cap hit), potentially Stempniak)
Guys who bring some production/excitement during a long/rough season of losing (Hudler, Wideman, Cervenka)
Minute eater on D (Bouw or Gio) strong lean to Bouwmeester

That leaves us with...

Baertschi-Backlund-Tanguay
Glencross-Cervenka-Hudler
Horak-Stajan-x
x-x- Bouma (Matt Hendricks is a pending UFA, would love to see him in Calgary)

Wideman-Brodie
Bouw- x
Sarich-x
Extra: Butler (on a cheap contract, otherwise goodbye)

Ramo
x (veteran FA)

Get rid of:
Iggy
Kipper
Gio (nothing personal, just can't eat minutes like Bouwmeester can)
Cammy
Smith
Babchuk
Jackman
Begin
Jones
Comeau
Stempniak (depending on what we could get in return, I would be fine with him coming back to play third line)

Tanguay/Glencross would take over the captaincy. Tanguay becomes the liason between players and coaching staff which I think he would really thrive doing. Focus on acquiring picks and young d-men at the deadline. Focus on a centre in the draft if possible. If we can go into the draft with 9-10 picks I would be ecstatic.

[foshizzle11]

Keep:

Hudler
Wideman
Brodie
Baertschi
Backlund
Horak
Cervenka
Stempniak
Smith
Bouma

Dump:

Stajan
Iggy
Cammy
Glencross
Tanguay
Comeau
Jackman
Sarich
Babchuk
Begin
Giordano
Smith
Butler
Kipper
Jaybo

[Kaine]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Keep: (in no particular order)
- Hudler
- Wideman
- Brodie
- Baertschi
- Backlund
- Gio
- Smith
- Horak
- Cervenka
- Butler
- Glencross
- Tanguay
- Stempniak
- Sarich

Try to Trade:
- Stajan
- Bow
- Iggy
- Cammy
- Comeau
- Jackman
- Babchuk
- Kipper


You still need to have some decent players even if you go in a re-build direction. Tanguay/Stempniak are both guys I would hang on to even with a re-build.

Agree 100%, the only thing I would add is that if a great offer is made for Glencross I would let him go as well. With his contract he could fetch a decent return. Otherwise yes you keep him for sure.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by cgy2london

Glencross- is NOT a top six forward, 25 other teams in the NHL would put him in their bottom six. He has put up points the last few years because of his gracious ice time (due to our limited depth) but its time to admit he is what he is. He's not a top six forward, hes horrific in our zone and is not a player we need to be "investing" in or depending on.

The number 61-90 top scoring left wingers last year had 5-11 goals.

Glencross is a top 6 LW on 30 NHL teams and the Top LW on at least 15.

[cgy2london]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

The number 61-90 top scoring left wingers last year had 5-11 goals.

Glencross is a top 6 LW on 30 NHL teams and the Top LW on at least 15.

I disagree. His numbers are ridiculsouly inflated due to the fact hes playing top six minutes on a very bad team. He benfited from ice time he would not have gotten on the majority of other NHL teams.

Hes simply far too one dimensional and not offensivly gifted enough to be a true top six forward on a good team. Its really not very hard to see.

[$ven27]

Keep: Sven, Backlund, Brodie, Curtis, Tangs.
Trade: all.