It's a parenting issue if his child has seen him rile and antagonize dogs to the point where they're responding to his antagonistic behavior. I could easily see, as a small child, becoming scared because the dogs are whipped up. If she's seen that, then daddy bears some responsibility in her fear.
Regardless of whether she's seen that, I think antagonizing dogs in vehicles for no reason is reprehensible behavior. Of course, if the dogs managed to somehow get free of the vehicle and attack him, they'd be put down - instead of seeing him bear some responsibility for getting them into that state in the first place.
In fairness, we have no idea what happened, besides the account of one obviously biased poster.
I don't think I have a reputation on here for being dishonest. Plus, what about my story sounds far fetched? People walk around with their dogs off leash all the time (e.g. you).
Anyway, our quibbling is distracting from the more important point I was trying to make.
I don't think I have a reputation on here for being dishonest. Plus, what about my story sounds far fetched? People walk around with their dogs off leash all the time (e.g. you).
Anyway, our quibbling is distracting from the more important point I was trying to make.
Well lack of hockey news, and a slow day makes for interesting conversation.
If you go through my posts, I never said you were wrong about the incident or that I disagreed that the dogs should have been on a leash.
I will drop it here, but this is not the first time we have not seen eye-to-eye on issues with dogs. You do like to start threads on them though, so you should be prepared to discuss.
The owner is at fault. All dogs should be on a leash in a residential area unless they are specifically in an off-leash park.
But all that aside, I wish Sliver would introduce, in the proper environment, his daughter to some stable, well behaved dogs.... definitely start with the smaller breeds though.
I'd love to introduce her to Ryley but at 2-1/2 years old and weighing 75 lbs he's not the best first option for your daughter. Maybe in another couple of years when he calms down a little more. He'd never hurt your daughter but in his enthusiasm to greet and play with your child he can get a little over powering.
Please introduce your daughter to some well behaved dogs. You are doing her an immense disservice if you let her fear of dogs grow into a phobia <<ahem... cough cough>>
Having been chased as a kid from one end of my small prairie town to the other on Halloween night by an aggressive German Shephard, I too was once afraid of dogs.
Got chased from one end of Warner, Alberta to the other by a pack of dogs as an adult while riding my bike once as well.
I chilled through time, my wife buying a Sheltie over my gurgles and eventually moving on.
Being terrified of dogs isn't a mental disorder. Occasionaly there's a good reason for it. Usually its a bad dog owner.
Cowperson
__________________
Dear Lord, help me to be the kind of person my dog thinks I am. - Anonymous
Well lack of hockey news, and a slow day makes for interesting conversation.
If you go through my posts, I never said you were wrong about the incident or that I disagreed that the dogs should have been on a leash.
I will drop it here, but this is not the first time we have not seen eye-to-eye on issues with dogs. You do like to start threads on them though, so you should be prepared to discuss.
Even if Sliver is making the story up or exaggerating details (which I doubt), it's not like the situation he's describing doesn't actually happen.
In fact, there's a couple who live on my street who routinely exhibit this kind of dbag behaviour. I live in a densely populated area of the Beltline. The couple in question live in a ground floor townhouse and own a large black lab. I frequently see them walking their dog off-leash on city sidewalks. They also like to sit in their garage drinking beer while their dog runs up and jumps/barks at any passing pedestrians. One time it did this to my wife as she was walking home from the grocery store. She's not scared of dogs (afterall, we own one ourselves), but it caught her off-guard so she jumped and yelled in shock. The dbags, instead of apologizing and tying up their dog, just laughed at her.
Another time, when my dog was a young puppy, I was walking her around the park in our neighbourhood (which is not a designated off-leash dog park). The idiot owner was playing fetch with his dog. As soon as it saw my dog, it started running towards us, completely beyond the control of its owner. I remarked to the owner that this was not an off-leash park and he wasn't permitted to let his dog run freely here. He gave me a rude look as if I was the one at fault and took his dog home.
Some people...
The Following User Says Thank You to MarchHare For This Useful Post:
It's common courtesy to have your dog on a leash around unknown people, particularly small children.
Quoting the most reasonable and correct response in case everyone gets distracted by the awesome dog picture.
I think this is it perfectly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by J-bo09
If your daughter is afraid, why not introduce them in a safe and calm enviroment? Oh right, you have an irrational hate to the dirty filthy mongrels. However, if you took a few minutes to show her that there is nothing to be afraid, maybe next time this is a non incident.
Then again, why blame yourself, dog owners are easier!
Desensitization (what you describe as introducing in a calm safe environment) is indeed a good way to go about it, however a random encounter on the street with off-leash strange dogs in an area where a leash is expected is NOT that environment, and desensitization isn't just that easy. For some kids with some things it takes a long time, or maybe some kid they haven't started it yet, hence the law that covers for all circumstances.. dogs in an area where everyone expects the dogs to be on a leash should be on a leash.
Then a parent could begin the process by going out with a kid walking around the neighbourhood with the dogs safely leashed to start to get used to the dogs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by J-bo09
Just so we are clear here, I'm sure you have never sped in your car.
Johnny jumped off a bridge so I did too is never a reasonable position.
Quote:
Originally Posted by J-bo09
In my case, I let my dog walk a block with no leash, but if it bother someone I would gladly oblige.
Since you don't know who could be on the street at any given time you have no way of knowing if it would bother someone, I think Cowperson's position is the correct one and the considerate one, especially to kids.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef
Seems like as much of a parenting issue as it is a dog owner issue.
Don't be an ass.
__________________ Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.
But certainty is an absurd one.
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to photon For This Useful Post:
Even if Sliver is making the story up or exaggerating details (which I doubt), it's not like the situation he's describing doesn't actually happen.
In fact, there's a couple who live on my street who routinely exhibit this kind of dbag behaviour. I live in a densely populated area of the Beltline. The couple in question live in a ground floor townhouse and own a large black lab. I frequently see them walking their dog off-leash on city sidewalks. They also like to sit in their garage drinking beer while their dog runs up and jumps/barks at any passing pedestrians. One time it did this to my wife as she was walking home from the grocery store. She's not scared of dogs (afterall, we own one ourselves), but it caught her off-guard so she jumped and yelled in shock. The dbags, instead of apologizing and tying up their dog, just laughed at her.
Another time, when my dog was a young puppy, I was walking her around the park in our neighbourhood (which is not a designated off-leash dog park). The idiot owner was playing fetch with his dog. As soon as it saw my dog, it started running towards us, completely beyond the control of its owner. I remarked to the owner that this was not an off-leash park and he wasn't permitted to let his dog run freely here. He gave me a rude look as if I was the one at fault and took his dog home.
Some people...
It never ceases to amaze me when I'm walking my dogs in a mountain park and come across someone with an off-leash dog who chastises me for having my dogs on a leash.
WTF?
Shut up and keep walking instead of stopping people and councilling them to break the law. Did I stop you and tell you to put your dog on a leash?
Pet peeve.
Morons.
Cowperson
__________________
Dear Lord, help me to be the kind of person my dog thinks I am. - Anonymous
The Following User Says Thank You to Cowperson For This Useful Post:
Even if Sliver is making the story up or exaggerating details (which I doubt), it's not like the situation he's describing doesn't actually happen.
Exactly, there's a lady with a larger dog that walks her kid to the same school I walk mine to, and she almost never has her dog on a leash.
My kid is border line with dogs (sometimes loves them, sometimes is very intimidated), but I've seen other kids quite scared of it, but she reacts the same way Silver describes where she doesn't seem to see the fear and thinks it is fun and tries to encourage the interaction.
I find it as disrespectful as not picking up after the dog.
__________________ Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.
But certainty is an absurd one.
Quoting the most reasonable and correct response in case everyone gets distracted by the awesome dog picture.
I think this is it perfectly.
Desensitization (what you describe as introducing in a calm safe environment) is indeed a good way to go about it, however a random encounter on the street with off-leash strange dogs in an area where a leash is expected is NOT that environment, and desensitization isn't just that easy. For some kids with some things it takes a long time, or maybe some kid they haven't started it yet, hence the law that covers for all circumstances.. dogs in an area where everyone expects the dogs to be on a leash should be on a leash.
Then a parent could begin the process by going out with a kid walking around the neighbourhood with the dogs safely leashed to start to get used to the dogs.
Johnny jumped off a bridge so I did too is never a reasonable position.
Since you don't know who could be on the street at any given time you have no way of knowing if it would bother someone, I think Cowperson's position is the correct one and the considerate one, especially to kids.
Don't be an ass.
My point with introducing the child in a calm safe enviroment was seperate advice from the incident. I was suggesting that had this occured, maybe this this is very much a non-incident.
I have a very irrational fear of flying. I have learned to deal with it by learning as much as I can, and making myself fly often. My fear is still there, but I have learned to deal with it.
As for the law breaking, I was merely pointing out that everyone will pick and chose what they want to follow. To say I am proclaiming myself as Ghandi was extreme...hate to quote an obvious one but "let he who is without sin cast the first stone"
Noted about you may not know who is on the street. I have not looked at it that way. Maybe due to the small size of my dog, I have not really given it much thought. I have never once in 16 years and two dogs ever had an incident where someone appeared scared. I also think I am a very responsible dog owner and would never allow my dog to run up to someone. My dog is good nature and mellow. I live in mission and my parents live in Varsity. I would never allow my dog off lease in Mission, but in Varsity it is a VERY friendly dog community along the gully.
As for the law breaking, I was merely pointing out that everyone will pick and chose what they want to follow. To say I am proclaiming myself as Ghandi was extreme...hate to quote an obvious one but "let he who is without sin cast the first stone"
The Ghandi thing was over the line, I apologize.
I still think dogs should be on leash in residential areas, and since that's the law it's the responsible thing to do.
I haven't read through the whole thread, but is it likely your child's fear of dogs was a taught behavior? You are after all a guy that wants a species wide culling. Do you think the home environment may be a bit poisonous to man's best friend?
My point with introducing the child in a calm safe enviroment was seperate advice from the incident. I was suggesting that had this occured, maybe this this is very much a non-incident.
Fair enough, and probably true all things being equal. My son used to not have any issues with dogs (the opposite in fact, he would approach any dog happily, even the fang bearing barking doberman). But anxiety is a funny thing and increased anxiety in one area of life can impact many other areas, especially with kids. There have been times when my kid has reacted in terror for no reason to the most innocent looking ball of fluff.
Not saying we have to make the world foam, but I think reasonable things are ok and a dog on a leash in a general area where kids are expected is reasonable (and you seem to agree).
Quote:
Originally Posted by J-bo09
As for the law breaking, I was merely pointing out that everyone will pick and chose what they want to follow. To say I am proclaiming myself as Ghandi was extreme...hate to quote an obvious one but "let he who is without sin cast the first stone"
I see the Ghandi thing as a bit of hyperbole but I agree with his point.. civil disobedience to change society is one thing, but having the dog off leash isn't that thing.
We all do pick and choose sometimes, and lots of times for bad reasons. Choose to cross between crosswalks because I'm lazy, but we do it because we usually see the consequences as minimal (we might get a ticket), in this case part of it is the consequence (getting licked and jumped on and such) is viewed disproportionately by those choosing and those being subjected to the consequence without their choosing.
That's why I wouldn't do it, because I feel like I'm imposing my judgment about what's acceptable on someone else, but I'm also very much a product of uber-polite don't rock the boat Canadian culture.
Quote:
Originally Posted by J-bo09
I would never allow my dog off lease in Mission, but in Varsity it is a VERY friendly dog community along the gully.
And I can see that as well how that could make a difference in evaluating how significant an infraction it would be. Walking across the street in my little off street is different than doing it elsewhere, and if I'm walking with my kid in an area I know vs. an area I don't, I'd have different expectation levels.
__________________ Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.
But certainty is an absurd one.
The Following User Says Thank You to photon For This Useful Post:
I haven't read through the whole thread, but is it likely your child's fear of dogs was a taught behavior? You are after all a guy that wants a species wide culling. Do you think the home environment may be a bit poisonous to man's best friend?
I'm not afraid of dogs and generally teach my kid to be kind to animals (I usually put spiders outside rather than squishing them), but he's still reacted in terror to the smallest most innocent dog you could imagine. So it could be something else, and putting it that way just continues conflict rather than discussion.
__________________ Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.
But certainty is an absurd one.
I actually agree with you Photon, and I will admit that it is an issue I saw personaly as very minimal, yet may have an effect I was unaware of.
On a flip side and different point of view, I am allergic to cats and dread going over to houses with them. In people's homes, they usually have no issue letting the cat crawl all over me though. Usually takes two reactine and a shower to start to feel better.
Yeah my wife is allergic to cats (well supposedly, she actually tested negative but she does react strongly, so who knows, the test is only for one specific protein), and we go through the same thing. She's too polite to ask though so I'm usually the one to ask if we can put the cat outside or in the basement.
Not that it helps, the people we know with cats also seem to have a different idea of "clean", so even if the cat was on vacation the house would still have enough allergens to make her burn her clothes when we get home.
__________________ Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.
But certainty is an absurd one.
